Luc Bourdon the next Dion Phaneuf?

[BrooklynCanuck]

Speaking as a Canuck's fan who had Kopitar, O'Marra, then Bourdon on his wish list:

I have been very pleased with the post-draft buzz on Bourdon. If he rounds into a solid top 4 guy I will be pleased. If he turns into a top pairing guy, then I will be thrilled.

Does anyone compare him to Derek Morris?

 

[flambers]

They are totally different Dman, Morris was way more offensive as a junior than Bourdon.

 

[flambers]

Average draft year? The top 15 of this draft is as deep as you can get.

Totally disagree after the top 4 or 5 it dropped allot thats why you seen teams go all over the place in the first round. 2005 draft year is not even close to 2003

 

[flambers]

The number of players in this list that are projected to be star players is totally mind boggling. There is no way 2005 list will even be close.

2003 top 30
1 Pittsburgh Marc-Andre Fleury G
2 Carolina Eric Staal C
3 Florida Nathan Horton C
4 Columbus Nikolai Zherdev R
5 Buffalo Thomas Vanek
6 San Jose Milan Michalek
7 Nashville Ryan Suter D
8 Atlanta Braydon Coburn D
9 Calgary Dion Phaneuf D
10 Mtl. Canadiens Andrei Kostitsyn W
11 Philadelphia Jeff Carter C
12 NY Rangers Hugh Jessiman F
13 Los Angeles Dustin Brown R
14 Chicago Brent Seabrook D
15 NY Islanders Robert Nilsson R
16 San Jose Steve Bernier R
17 New Jersey Zach Parise C
18 Washington Eric Fehr R
19 Anaheim Ryan Getzlaf C
20 Minnesota Brent Burns D
21 Boston Mark Stuart D
22 Edmonton Marc-Antoine Pouliot C
23 Vancouver Ryan Kesler C
24 Philadelphia Mike Richards C
25 Florida Anthony Stewart R
26 Los Angeles Brian Boyle F
27 Los Angeles Jeff Tambellini
28 Anaheim Corey Perry R
29 Ottawa Patrick Eaves F
30 St. Louis Shawn Belle D

 

[hockeyfan125]

Again flambers, we realize that as a flame fan you love Phaneuf, and for good reason. However, saying Bourdon is "ok" is a ridiculous understatement, almost as ridiculous as comparing an 18 year old with a 20 year old.

Two years is huge for development, so wait and see.

 

[flambers]

Again flambers, we realize that as a flame fan you love Phaneuf, and for good reason. However, saying Bourdon is "ok" is a ridiculous understatement, almost as ridiculous as comparing an 18 year old with a 20 year old.

Two years is huge for development, so wait and see.

I agree its really tough comparing an 18 yr old vs 20 yr old player. I guess we will have to wait and see. I believe Bourdon is an NHL calibre dman but I don't believe he has the star potential that a player like Phaneuf has.

I am really interested to see how he does at the WJC level. That usually shows how good a player is.

 

[God Bless Canada]

A lot of what we're saying about Bourdon now is what we saying about Phaneuf two years ago. Big, mobile defenceman. Physical and takes care of his own end. Has a bullet shot from the point that will serve him well on the power play. Offensive production will be somewhat limited because there's a lack of creativity.

Phaneuf took big strides in the last two years. His numbers increased as he matured against his competition. He showed some offensive upside. He certainly demonstrated how physically dominant he can be at the WJC and with Red Deer. All indications point to him being the NHL's next dominant shutdown defenceman.

We'll have to wait and see how Bourdon progresses. Right now, I'd say he still projects out to a solid, top-pairing defenceman. One telling fact is he was chosen for the WU18 all-star team despite only getting one assist in six games.

 

[monster_bertuzzi]

Does anyone compare him to Derek Morris?

I've heard Phaneuf, Brad Stuart, Mattias Ohlund. But never Derek Morris...

 

[Transported Upstater]

The number of players in this list that are projected to be star players is totally mind boggling. There is no way 2005 list will even be close.

2003 top 30
1 Pittsburgh Marc-Andre Fleury G
2 Carolina Eric Staal C
3 Florida Nathan Horton C
4 Columbus Nikolai Zherdev R
5 Buffalo Thomas Vanek
6 San Jose Milan Michalek
7 Nashville Ryan Suter D
8 Atlanta Braydon Coburn D
9 Calgary Dion Phaneuf D
10 Mtl. Canadiens Andrei Kostitsyn W
11 Philadelphia Jeff Carter C
12 NY Rangers Hugh Jessiman F
13 Los Angeles Dustin Brown R
14 Chicago Brent Seabrook D
15 NY Islanders Robert Nilsson R
16 San Jose Steve Bernier R
17 New Jersey Zach Parise C
18 Washington Eric Fehr R
19 Anaheim Ryan Getzlaf C
20 Minnesota Brent Burns D
21 Boston Mark Stuart D
22 Edmonton Marc-Antoine Pouliot C
23 Vancouver Ryan Kesler C
24 Philadelphia Mike Richards C
25 Florida Anthony Stewart R
26 Los Angeles Brian Boyle F
27 Los Angeles Jeff Tambellini
28 Anaheim Corey Perry R
29 Ottawa Patrick Eaves F
30 St. Louis Shawn Belle D

Still can't get over the '85's...

 

[Redden Punches Faces*]

I'll take Meszaros out of the 20 and unders, thank you!

 

[sunb]

I totally disagree, Bourdon was drafted high in a very avg draft year. Phaneuf was drafted high in a incredible deep draft. Bourdon is okay but he is not a dman with the upside that Phaneuf has.

Your argument is flawed. 2003 is indeed one of the deepest drafts ever but what pertinence do guys picked between 11th overall and 30th have on a defenseman who is picked 10th overall?

If you're comparing top tier talents, don't bother listing guys picked at 100th overall.

Here's the breakdown for the top 10 picks of 2003:
1.) Marc-Andre Fleury
2.) Eric Staal
3.) Nathan Horton
4.) Nikolai Zherdev
5.) Thomas Vanek
6.) Milan Michalek
7.) Ryan Suter
8.) Braydon Coburn
9.) Dion Phaneuf
10.) Andrei Kostitsyn

Here's the breakdown for the top 10 picks of 2005:
1.) Sidney Crosby
2.) Bobby Ryan
3.) Jack Johnson
4.) Benoit Pouliot
5.) Carey Price
6.) Gilbert Brule
7.) Jack Skille
8.) Devin Setoguchi
9.) Brian Lee
10.) Luc Bourdon

If lets compare the top 10 of 2005 vs the top 10 of 2003.

Crosby > Fleury
Ryan < Staal
Johnson > Horton
Pouliot < Zherdev
Price < Vanek
Brule > Michalek
Skille < Suter
Setoguchi = Coburn
Lee < Phaneuf
Bourdon > Kostitsyn

As you can see, it doesn't matter how much bottom depth the class of 2003 has, both draft classes had supreme talent in their respective top 10s. Gilbert Brule would've been drafted top 3 in any other draft year but fell to 6th this year. This gives you an idea of how good the top 10 of 2005 is.

 

[KH1]

Of course not they are not American

We're not worthy

On the contrary, as a loyal Democrat I often wish I lived in Canada. That statement has more to do with the fact that in my book Johnson will be better than Phaneuf in every aspect of the game except for hitting.

As for Suter that is more a pick of personal preference. Unlike Bourdon I know exactly the kind of player Suter will be and I know that there is no way barring injury that he will not be an NHL top 4 defenseman. Bourdon has yet to prove that to me.

 

[flambers]

Your argument is flawed. 2003 is indeed one of the deepest drafts ever but what pertinence do guys picked between 11th overall and 30th have on a defenseman who is picked 10th overall?

If you're comparing top tier talents, don't bother listing guys picked at 100th overall.

If lets compare the top 10 of 2005 vs the top 10 of 2003.

Crosby > Fleury
Ryan < Staal
Johnson > Horton
Pouliot < Zherdev
Price < Vanek
Brule > Michalek
Skille < Suter
Setoguchi = Coburn
Lee < Phaneuf
Bourdon > Kostitsyn

As you can see, it doesn't matter how much bottom depth the class of 2003 has, both draft classes had supreme talent in their respective top 10s. Gilbert Brule would've been drafted top 3 in any other draft year but fell to 6th this year. This gives you an idea of how good the top 10 of 2005 is.

Crosby > Fleury
Ryan < Staal
Johnson = Horton (I think they are equal)
Pouliot < Zherdev
Price < Vanek
Brule < Michalek (Michalek is better)
Skille < Suter
Setoguchi = Coburn
Lee < Phaneuf
Bourdon > Kostitsyn

Okay well lets compare

In my opinion

6 in 2003 are better
2 are equal
2 in 2005 are better

 

[xtra]

Now are we comparing what the 2003 draft is today or what they were?

cause if it was were:

Corsby > Fleury
Ryan<Stall
Johnson>Horton
Pouliot=Zherdev
Price > Vanek i would take the franchise goalie over the 40 goal fwd anyday
Brule>Michalek Brule will make every GM who picked someone else (other than Crosby) look like a fool in 5 yrs
Skille<Sutter
Stegoguchi<Coburn
Lee<Phaneuf
Bourdon>Kostitsyn


So by my count its 5 for 2005
4 for 2003
1 tied

 

[cc]

I really like Phaneuf and I do think it's unfair to compare the two directly at this point but I can voice my evalution of Bourdon.
what impressed me about Bourdon is that he was actually the most impressive prospect playing well beyond his years at camp. It would surprise me if he didnt' make it next season much less when he's 20. He'd actually have to take a step backward not to make it. He has exceptional tools which includes blazing speed and a cannon of a shot. He actually looks like a faster skating Phaneuf as he's leveled several NHLers at camp. His speed leads some to believe he has more upside. As all open ice hitters, they will get out of position from time to time, but Bourdon has the kind of speed to recover from that.

 

[Roughneck]

Think Phaneuf was in a much better setup and that helped him develop the way he did.

The fact that Bourdon is on probably the worste team in the Q scares me. For that reason I see him joining the Canucks faster because of his situation in the Q.

IIRC, the reason that Phaneuf was sent down in his first year so comfortably was because Darryl liked Red Deer (for obvious reasons) and said that if he wasn't comfortable with the junior situation (like if he was stuck in Prince George or Tri-Cities) he would have stuck around alot longer if not indefinitely. I do agree, Phaneuf was in the best situation possible, going from a Sutter to a Sutter on a perennially competetive junior team in a very good division really helped his devellopment.

 

[Jason MacIsaac]

It is impossible to compare the two because 2003 has had 2 years to cool off. Back at the time of the draft here is how the top 10 would have went.

Crosby > Fleury
Ryan<Stall
Johnson<Horton
Pouliot<Zherdev
Price<Vanek
Brule<Michalek
Skille<Sutter
Stegoguchi<Coburn
Lee<Phaneuf
Bourdon<Kostitsyn

 

[sunb]

It is impossible to compare the two because 2003 has had 2 years to cool off. Back at the time of the draft here is how the top 10 would have went.

Crosby > Fleury
Ryan<Stall
Johnson<Horton
Pouliot<Zherdev
Price<Vanek
Brule<Michalek
Skille<Sutter
Stegoguchi<Coburn
Lee<Phaneuf
Bourdon<Kostitsyn

It is pertinent to track the development of the class of 2003 if Flamber is to herald it as the deepest draft ever. The class of 2003 started off strong but some of the members of the top 10 never really stayed on track as guys like Michalek and Horton succumbed to serious injuries, Coburn and Kostitsyn never really developed accordingly, and guys like Fleury were overwhelmed.

While the class of 2005 didn't really have the impressive stats the class of 2003 did in their draft year, there are several guys with intriuging potentials and the aura and mystique of their future upsides builds by the minute.

Since being drafted, guy like Pouliot, Johnson and Bourdon has surprised immediately. Guys like Lee, Ryan, Price, Pouliot and Johnson have potentials that simply shoots through the roof. Crosby is supposed to be an immediate star and Brule is also seen as a lock for a top 6 NHL spot. Guys like Skille and Setoguchi are very solid too. Even a young star like Anze Kopitar, who would normally go top 5 in any other draft, fell out of the top 10.

I definitely think the top 10 in the class of 2003 and class of 2005 are comparable. Give them each a couple more years and I think the top 10 from both classes will be similar in impact.

 

[Jason MacIsaac]

It is pertinent to track the development of the class of 2003 if Flamber is to herald it as the deepest draft ever. The class of 2003 started off strong but some of the members of the top 10 never really stayed on track as guys like Michalek and Horton succumbed to serious injuries, Coburn and Kostitsyn never really developed accordingly, and guys like Fleury were overwhelmed.

While the class of 2005 didn't really have the impressive stats the class of 2003 did in their draft year, there are several guys with intriuging potentials and the aura and mystique of their future upsides builds by the minute.

Since being drafted, guy like Pouliot, Johnson and Bourdon has surprised immediately. Guys like Lee, Ryan, Price, Pouliot and Johnson have potentials that simply shoots through the roof. Crosby is supposed to be an immediate star and Brule is also seen as a lock for a top 6 NHL spot. Guys like Skille and Setoguchi are very solid too. Even a young star like Anze Kopitar, who would normally go top 5 in any other draft, fell out of the top 10.

I definitely think the top 10 in the class of 2003 and class of 2005 are comparable. Give them each a couple more years and I think the top 10 from both classes will be similar in impact.

They aren't even close. Only two years after the 2003 draft here is what some prospects are doing this year.

MA Fleury - 3 games played
Eric Staal - 8 points in 5 games
Nathan Horton - 4 points in 6 games
Nikolai Zherdev - 3 points in 6 games
Tomas Vanek - 4 points in 6 games
Milan Michalek - 5 points in 5 games
Ryan Sutter - 3 points in 5 games
Braydon Coburn - 1 point in 6 games
Dion Phaneuf - 3 points in 6 games
Kostitsyn - 0 games
Jeff Carter - 1 point in 5 games
Dustin Brown - 3 points in 6 games
Brent Seabrook - 5 points in 6 games
Robert Nillson - 1 point in 5 games
Zach Parise - 3 points in 5 games
Ryan Getzlaf - 1 point in 5 games
Brent Burns - 2 points in 6 games
Ryan Kesler - 1 point in 6 games
Mike Richards - 5 points in 5 games
Corey Perry - 4 points in 5 games

This is unheard of...that doesn't include Fritsche and Bergeron in the 2nd.

 

[sunb]

They aren't even close. Only two years after the 2003 draft here is what some prospects are doing this year.

MA Fleury - 3 games played
Eric Staal - 8 points in 5 games
Nathan Horton - 4 points in 6 games
Nikolai Zherdev - 3 points in 6 games
Tomas Vanek - 4 points in 6 games
Milan Michalek - 5 points in 5 games
Ryan Sutter - 3 points in 5 games
Braydon Coburn - 1 point in 6 games
Dion Phaneuf - 3 points in 6 games
Kostitsyn - 0 games
Jeff Carter - 1 point in 5 games
Dustin Brown - 3 points in 6 games
Brent Seabrook - 5 points in 6 games
Robert Nillson - 1 point in 5 games
Zach Parise - 3 points in 5 games
Ryan Getzlaf - 1 point in 5 games
Brent Burns - 2 points in 6 games
Ryan Kesler - 1 point in 6 games
Mike Richards - 5 points in 5 games
Corey Perry - 4 points in 5 games

This is unheard of...that doesn't include Fritsche and Bergeron in the 2nd.

If we're comparing the top 10s from those respective years, I don't think the guys drafted 11th overall and afterwards are pertinent to the discussion.

 

[Knucklehead]

I really like Phaneuf and I do think it's unfair to compare the two directly at this point but I can voice my evalution of Bourdon.
what impressed me about Bourdon is that he was actually the most impressive prospect playing well beyond his years at camp. It would surprise me if he didnt' make it next season much less when he's 20. He'd actually have to take a step backward not to make it. He has exceptional tools which includes blazing speed and a cannon of a shot. He actually looks like a faster skating Phaneuf as he's leveled several NHLers at camp. His speed leads some to believe he has more upside. As all open ice hitters, they will get out of position from time to time, but Bourdon has the kind of speed to recover from that.

I watched Bourdon in one Canuck preseason game and the one thing that really stood out about him right away was his amazing foot speed and mobility.. From side to side (laterally) and from stop to start and back. This skill may be more important than any other in todays NHL for a denceman.

On a side note, to give some kind of indication how much he loves to hit.(scouts say he is physically ready for the NHL now. When was the last time you heard that about a eighteen yr. old defenceman.)

Bourdon 36 hits in 5 games. for an average of over 7 per game. WOW!

next best defenceman 42 hits in 13 games for an average of just over 3

Average for a defenceman is slightly more than 1

By the way, for a very bad Val'dor team he has 7 pnts. in those 5 games.

Drool, drool can hardly wait till he is with the Nuck's

 

[gerbilanium]

Well if he progresses as Phaneuf has you guys will be in for a good one.

I have watched Phaeuf play every game this season and he is the only player I watch as I have waited for years to see him. I have never seen a prospect in a Flames uniform that has made me giddy as a schoolgirl. He has outperformed my lofty expectations so far. Even when the Flames lose, bad, I am excited at their future when watching him.

 

[MrMastodonFarm*]

Phaneuf is now an NHL'er, it is time for a new defencemen to be lauded and jerked off over on this site.

 

[AgentNaslund*]

Again flambers, we realize that as a flame fan you love Phaneuf, and for good reason. However, saying Bourdon is "ok" is a ridiculous understatement, almost as ridiculous as comparing an 18 year old with a 20 year old.

Two years is huge for development, so wait and see.

it was unfair for flambers to say what he just said about Bourdon when he didnt see him play yet. Obviously hes a homer, and no matter what Bourdon does, hes nowhere near the leauge of PHaneuf according to him. and according to them, Flames are the best team in the NHL. So why bother explaining.

He was one of our best defencemens during the pre season. He hits like a monster. He hit an oiler so hard, his helmet came off. Highlite hit. Destroyed Corry perry with a devestating hit. another highlite hit. Averaged 3 hits per game during his time in pre season. One of our fastest defencemens at trainning camp. HIs speed his in the leauge of Jovanovski. Yes hes faster then Salo and OHlund in foot speed. Easily. He moves the puck like a NHLer. Hes faster then Dion Phanuef. Bourdon was men among boys at rookie camp.

Bourdon Phaneuf Camparisons are not out of the world. The first guy to start these Bourdon Phaneuf comparisons was Pierre McGuire, when I thought, hes out of his mind. But as you watched highlites of Bourdon's hits, you know why McGuire compares him to Phaneuf.

 

[colonel_korn]

Phaneuf is now an NHL'er, it is time for a new defencemen to be lauded and jerked off over on this site.

Come on, Flames fans like you have been "jerking off" Phaneuf for the better part of two years now, why can't you let Canucks fans have their fun.