Losing mentality sunk in deep.

[djdub]

Holy ****, I can't believe how many people will come into a thread just to ***** about another poster making a thread.

It's a forum, the OP put together a well articulated post that brought up some valid concerns. If your actually getting that pissed off because one thread that hasn't been replied to in 2 weeks got bumped to page 2, you should go get that blood pressure checked out or grow up. It's a forum, a place to talk over the web to other people. If you don't have something constructive to say, why post? Go do something else.

BTW, good post Replacement. Shed some new light on the situation for me, hadn't thought of it that way.

From how I saw Hall *****ing Yak out, I'm worried there is a locker room divide starting, Hall n His Buds vs The Rest.

 

[Replacement*]

Holy ****, I can't believe how many people will come into a thread just to ***** about another poster making a thread.

It's a forum, the OP put together a well articulated post that brought up some valid concerns. If your actually getting that pissed off because one thread that hasn't been replied to in 2 weeks got bumped to page 2, you should go get that blood pressure checked out or grow up. It's a forum, a place to talk over the web to other people. If you don't have something constructive to say, why post? Go do something else.

BTW, good post Replacement. Shed some new light on the situation for me, hadn't thought of it that way.

From how I saw Hall *****ing Yak out, I'm worried there is a locker room divide starting, Hall n His Buds vs The Rest.

Thank you. Its a messageboard. One should be able to post within reason and share with posters. I have as you say outlined rationale in as much detail as I would go into on a public board.

I'm all for discussion, debate, but as usual the one line drive by approaches add nothing at all to the dialog. When its happened I've attempted to initiate those individuals participating. I of course welcome criticism and I'm fine with it being offered. This being what furthers discussion. Which on a topical, public, messageboard shouldn't be all that surprising.

I'm far from the only one that doesn't start threads here anymore, there's those who don't contribute anymore, or who have left the board. Or who only lurk due to hesitation about contributing here.

 

[Replacement*]

Effort doesn't always mean they're dialed in. I'd be interested, if I were an Oil fan, to see what sort of responsibility and professionalism they display off the ice. Is focus and discipline a part of their daily lives? Is the top of the franchise (ownership and management) going to create an environment that instills this?

I think the org detects ongoing commitment problems and players not dialing into team concept and why they've instituted a series of different approaches and responses and coaches to try to rectify it. The team has also dabbled with team based psychologists and have looked for other inputs. The team has also through the years recruited individuals that they felt would redress, or reshape internal team dynamic. The latest of these recruits specifically being Ference and Gordon. Belanger, Sutton, Whitney, I believe were similar choices but not inspired ones.

When one sits back through the years the org has attempted to engage changes in the play of this club in different ways. Recruits of several toughs to try to reshape a more physical game, recruits of more defensively focused players, and even some alpha male players to introduce to the dressing room to change dynamic. The team specifically actively looks for recruits that have had affiliation with championship. I'm not convinced this in itself is effective ploy but I think it mirrors K Lowe, and MacT's concept (and perhaps conceit) that possessing championships equates to being a champion. There are of course players that drive championship performance and those that are a part of it. That said nothing wrong with exposing the club to players that have some background in what it takes to win. I think the message isn't gettng across though. The message should be; "This is the kind of commitment it takes to win" and then model or describe it. I think it possible that the message gets percieved as something else, i.e., "I'm a winner, listen to me".

One last comment. I find it interesting, as others have expressed in the thread, that the team keeps soliciting the help, either by way of consultants (for instance lately Messier) and have continued to increase the stable of coaches and managers. It seems as if the rank of the *management* enlisted is steadily growing in numbers. When this happens in an org its usually in response to some perceived desperation, struggle, controversy, conflict. This team is at a real crossroads. it could go both ways at this point. We could be building something special or a talented club that has continued trouble taking off. I've never seen such worry at Oilers command central. But it looks warranted.

 

[Koto]

we need a high-profile player from a winning club that could really lead by example. the kids won't learn winning from Ference as he isn't the kind they will look up to. we have to trade for a star, maybe just about to head into decline, but a player that can show everybody how the things are done for a year or two. we need to get such player no matter the cost.

yes, i'm again dreaming of Joe Thornton. i bet Hertl's confidence is currently through the roof after how Jumbo had handled his debacle. we need some of that here ASAP.

We have that


3rd pair defenceman Captain Andrew Ference.

 

[gwiz999]

I think the org detects ongoing commitment problems and players not dialing into team concept and why they've instituted a series of different approaches and responses and coaches to try to rectify it. The team has also dabbled with team based psychologists and have looked for other inputs. The team has also through the years recruited individuals that they felt would redress, or reshape internal team dynamic. The latest of these recruits specifically being Ference and Gordon. Belanger, Sutton, Whitney, I believe were similar choices but not inspired ones.

When one sits back through the years the org has attempted to engage changes in the play of this club in different ways. Recruits of several toughs to try to reshape a more physical game, recruits of more defensively focused players, and even some alpha male players to introduce to the dressing room to change dynamic. The team specifically actively looks for recruits that have had affiliation with championship. I'm not convinced this in itself is effective ploy but I think it mirrors K Lowe, and MacT's concept (and perhaps conceit) that possessing championships equates to being a champion. There are of course players that drive championship performance and those that are a part of it. That said nothing wrong with exposing the club to players that have some background in what it takes to win. I think the message isn't gettng across though. The message should be; "This is the kind of commitment it takes to win" and then model or describe it. I think it possible that the message gets percieved as something else, i.e., "I'm a winner, listen to me".

One last comment. I find it interesting, as others have expressed in the thread, that the team keeps soliciting the help, either by way of consultants (for instance lately Messier) and have continued to increase the stable of coaches and managers. It seems as if the rank of the *management* enlisted is steadily growing in numbers. When this happens in an org its usually in response to some perceived desperation, struggle, controversy, conflict. This team is at a real crossroads. it could go both ways at this point. We could be building something special or a talented club that has continued trouble taking off. I've never seen such worry at Oilers command central. But it looks warranted.

Has anyone worked closely with the 18-25 age group in recent years? It's like there's a completely different mentality and sense of entitlement with this age group than in years past. Many take no ownership and tend to have a flippant attitude towards things that should be taken seriously. It's frustrating to spend any time trying to teach them when they think they know everything. Not all are like this, but a good majority sure are. Add a $6 mil/per yr paycheck guaranteed regardless of work ethic and production and I would imagine complacency would set in quickly. No doubt there is, and probably has been, a divide amongst the younger and older players (not based solely on pay grid and age, but on work ethic, taking ownership, and respect).

 

[fuswald]

Has anyone worked closely with the 18-25 age group in recent years? It's like there's a completely different mentality and sense of entitlement with this age group than in years past. Many take no ownership and tend to have a flippant attitude towards things that should be taken seriously. It's frustrating to spend any time trying to teach them when they think they know everything. Not all are like this, but a good majority sure are. Add a $6 mil/per yr paycheck guaranteed regardless
of work ethic and production and I would imagine complacency would set in quickly. No doubt there is, and probably has been, a divide amongst the younger and older players (not based solely on pay grid and age, but on work ethic, taking ownership, and respect).

Players that make it to this level worked their ***** off to get here even the best ones. Not your typical forced to go to school by their parents kids. WORKED THEIR ***** OFF!

Not a good comparison.

 

[fuswald]

I think this thread is in poor taste and is along the lines of Gregor insulting because it makes him feel good.

Kind of like the media wanting to stir up and invent news.

Crap thread should be deleted.

 

[Kranix]

Dim light at the end of the tunnel: I've seen worse than this current Oilers team. I remember how pathetic the Blackhawks were in the few years before Toews and Kane arrived. The Blackhawks were a shuffled gang of pathetic losers. This Oilers team does not appear to me to have the right mix of forwards, the dependable goaltending, or the Norris trophy candidate defenseman. All cup winners have that in common. Only Carolina and Tampa Bay won in my recent memory without a Norris calibre defenseman. They seemed to have organized such a good team mix in all other positions, and had excellent goalies. That is rare. The Oilers will have to figure this out. Hall is a winner and he should be captain.

 

[Up the Irons]

On paper this club is better than the Islanders. I stand by that. On the ice this club doesn't compete like the Islanders. I'm not sure this team even believes its better than the Islanders. Therein lies some of the problem.

But lets look at is specifically. This Islanders club have also been chronic also rans and only made the playoffs last year on basis of being in weak EC.

I get that they are a hard team to play against, so play hard for 60minutes. Match level of compete.

People were wondering what Ference had to say. He stated that the Oilers needed to bring the level of effort they had against Pens and apply it to this game. But of course they didn't do that. Because they rarely bring a true winning effort. This club is good enough to win. I'm not convinced they believe it or know what it takes.

well, we differ on the bolded. this team has more players than most that are skilled at stickhandling and shooting. but, these are not the be all and end all, in fact, they are not necessarily the most needed skills in the NHL. I think this fact is at the heart of the problem. Everyone thinks the Oilers should be so good because they can stick-handle and shoot, but they are weak at everything else and the everything else is more important. Until they admit this, they are not going anywhere.

 

[Seedling]

Not sure if it has been mentioned already but I believe this is what Eakins was referring too when he said this renovation is going to be a lot more extensive than he thought.

Good thread Replacement.

 

[Kranix]

Eakins needs one season to organize an improvement. No matter where the finish this season, he should be given 82 games. If they start poorly in 2014-15, then he will be fired.

 

[Up the Irons]

I don't believe either team hates losing any more or less than the other.

I don't believe the Islanders having a better group of players surrounding Tavares is a myth.

I don't believe that 'on paper' there is not much wrong with the Oilers.

I don't believe in any such notion that a great player suddenly learns how to lead a team to victory.

I'm unsure if Tavares is a LOT better than Hall as you suggest.

I guess that's why I read the sound bites you've posted from Hall as something entirely different.

I was mistaken that this thread has any value though, as it seems like lots of people wanted yet another thread complaining about phantom issues

this.

1. Below average goaltending.
2. Not one impact defenseman.
3. the best players are all under 24.
4. aside from Hall, the best players are all under 180 lbs.
5. more danglers than physical players.
6. the physical players they do have can't play more than 12 minutes.

the Oilers are just not that good... on paper.

 

[Islander102]

I didn't state that. But its a myth that on paper the islanders have a better core.

Theres not much wrong with this Oilers club on paper now. MacT has brought in several good vet additions to solidify this lineup. Arco has also done a super job making the NHL transition.

I'm not seeing this as supporting cast victory. I'm seeing this as there being heroes on the island leading the club to greater heights. With Tavares being the poster boy for that.

Tavares is a lot better player than Taylor Hall. A notion this board fought tooth and nail against for years.

A great player learns how to lead his club to victory. Its clearly Tavares club. With not such a great supporting cast. They just play a lot harder than the Oilers. Because they ACTUALLY hate losing more I can only guess.

I agree entirely with you that the Islanders are much more of a TEAM. But wanting to win REQUIRES buying into team. Hall and fellow star Oilers haven't even bought into that concept yet.

If I can chime in, what you described wasn't always the case on Long Island. In fact, it wasn't until very recently. For years, the Isles were a cherry picking, non physical (outside of Martin) defensively negligent team. With pretty decent skill, and little commitment to do the little things on the ice that win games.

At some point, about mid-way through last season, it changed. They had a pretty long stretch of games where they were constantly very close to, often leading, very good teams in the league, and would ultimately wind up losing the games late. For whatever reason, it seemed like at that point in the season, they finally started to feel that they were good enough to compete with, and beat whoever they played, and almost instantaneously they started picking up their detail, compete level, and commitment to defense. Out of nowhere they started refusing to lose board battles, stopped cheating out of the D zone, paid extra attention to D zone support, and all four lines started hitting every chance that they got. And just as instantaneously, they started winning games with regularity.

Sometimes, all it takes to find that extra gear, extra focus and commitment level is the confidence to know that it's going to pay off. I don't think the Islanders had that for a very long time, and I don't think the Oilers have it right now, but you would (and hopefully will) be surprised at how quickly it can snowball. I saw the Oilers playing on Thursday a lot like the Islanders used to play. Especially when they were trailing in the 3rd period. Guys trying to stickhandle over the blueline and turning the puck over, instead of crashing and banging, to open up room for their skill later in the play. Very little physicality or urgency in their own zone. They looked like they were hoping to tie the game, rather than believing that they were going to.

But it can change pretty quickly if a couple things happen that make the team believe that they can win. There were reports last year, about a month in, that Bailey and Okposo dodged the press in the hallway after a loss to Carolina, and were laughing it up in the hallway over how bad the team sucked. By the end of the year, those two (not Tavares) were playing the best all around hockey of their careers, and were the driving force behind the Isles' run to qualify for the playoffs, with pretty much dominating two way play. Sometimes all it takes is confidence that you're good enough to win, and a hatred for losing can grow from it.

 

[Halibut]

Players that make it to this level worked their ***** off to get here even the best ones. Not your typical forced to go to school by their parents kids. WORKED THEIR ***** OFF!

Not a good comparison.

That's the problem I see with the whole thread. People spewing deep psychological analysis of the players and the org based on small samples from interviews when the players are emotional from another loss. That and the bs talk of not competing hard enough as if that's a thing.

 

[Up the Irons]

If I can chime in, what you described wasn't always the case on Long Island. In fact, it wasn't until very recently. For years, the Isles were a cherry picking, non physical (outside of Martin) defensively negligent team. With pretty decent skill, and little commitment to do the little things on the ice that win games.

At some point, about mid-way through last season, it changed. They had a pretty long stretch of games where they were constantly very close to, often leading, very good teams in the league, and would ultimately wind up losing the games late. For whatever reason, it seemed like at that point in the season, they finally started to feel that they were good enough to compete with, and beat whoever they played, and almost instantaneously they started picking up their detail, compete level, and commitment to defense. Out of nowhere they started refusing to lose board battles, stopped cheating out of the D zone, paid extra attention to D zone support, and all four lines started hitting every chance that they got. And just as instantaneously, they started winning games with regularity.

Sometimes, all it takes to find that extra gear, extra focus and commitment level is the confidence to know that it's going to pay off. I don't think the Islanders had that for a very long time, and I don't think the Oilers have it right now, but you would (and hopefully will) be surprised at how quickly it can snowball. I saw the Oilers playing on Thursday a lot like the Islanders used to play. Especially when they were trailing in the 3rd period. Guys trying to stickhandle over the blueline and turning the puck over, instead of crashing and banging, to open up room for their skill later in the play. Very little physicality or urgency in their own zone. They looked like they were hoping to tie the game, rather than believing that they were going to.

But it can change pretty quickly if a couple things happen that make the team believe that they can win. There were reports last year, about a month in, that Bailey and Okposo dodged the press in the hallway after a loss to Carolina, and were laughing it up in the hallway over how bad the team sucked. By the end of the year, those two (not Tavares) were playing the best all around hockey of their careers, and were the driving force behind the Isles' run to qualify for the playoffs, with pretty much dominating two way play. Sometimes all it takes is confidence that you're good enough to win, and a hatred for losing can grow from it.

beauty post. Unfortunately, IMO, i think the Eureka moment will only come after the bold move. I truly believe the Oil are too small and soft at this point. get them 2 key players and it could all come together.

 

[Replacement*]

Has anyone worked closely with the 18-25 age group in recent years? It's like there's a completely different mentality and sense of entitlement with this age group than in years past. Many take no ownership and tend to have a flippant attitude towards things that should be taken seriously. It's frustrating to spend any time trying to teach them when they think they know everything. Not all are like this, but a good majority sure are. Add a $6 mil/per yr paycheck guaranteed regardless of work ethic and production and I would imagine complacency would set in quickly. No doubt there is, and probably has been, a divide amongst the younger and older players (not based solely on pay grid and age, but on work ethic, taking ownership, and respect).

You're almost describing millennial. Yes, to some degree any generation is going to be impacted by the way in which they were raised. With some by products being due to that experience and beliefs in child rearing at that time. Combine this with technological prowess and being first generation to much of todays technology and this can result in millennial taking the view that they are better, and superior at everything then older generations. The latter part I think being very much due to the tecnnological revolution.

AS it befits the Oilers we've heard expressed many times the management being surprised how difficult it is to motivate younger players these days. It was never all that hard to motivate K Lowe, or MacT and have them play their best. It was just assumed to occur. They don't really understand lesser motivation.

 

[dustrock]

Good thread Replacement.

I would loveeeeeeee to be a fly on the wall in the locker room though to see where the players are mentally.

 

[Evets 81]

This concept of a losing mentality is why I was so glad to see a new head coach brought in from elsewhere, and a new captain who came from a different organization as well. I completely agree with the idea of the players are content with losing. I mean, if they weren't, you would think that the team would actually show some effort or drive or something to make it look like they were actually trying and fed up with losing. But, as we've seen and watched, many nights there has been NO effort. Just a bunch of guys gliding around for most of a game.

Honestly, this season has been plagued by cases of one section of the team's gameplay being fine, but completely wrecked by the other (I.E., the offense being good enough, but the goaltending or defense cancel it out). If these parts had come together for even just a couple of those games, we could be having a completely different discussion right here.

With all the damage that has been done over the past 7 years, (in the form of losing, constant coaching changes, saving the losing atmosphere, poor leadership, no depth, etc.) and nothing being done to fix it but mere patches (1st overall picks being led by the previously mentioned 'losers', so to speak, and them adopting this mentality), Eakins and Ference are in for a tough road in fixing this.

 

[rboomercat90]

Players that make it to this level worked their ***** off to get here even the best ones. Not your typical forced to go to school by their parents kids. WORKED THEIR ***** OFF!

Not a good comparison.

Some of them had to work their ----- off and some of them were just so much better that they never needed to learn how to work hard. They never faced adversity and learned how to overcome it. It happens in every walk of life. That could be something we're dealing with here.

 

[Supermassive]

Some of them had to work their ----- off and some of them were just so much better that they never needed to learn how to work hard. They never faced adversity and learned how to overcome it. It happens in every walk of life. That could be something we're dealing with here.

It isn't. Ask a junior player how much they practice and work out. Everybody busts their *****.

Our issue isn't the effort level or dedication from the players we have, it's an extremely unbalanced lineup.

 

[AJGass4]

I don't buy that there is a losing mentality. We've just never gotten the right people to fix this team.

We have not had a bonafide #1 goaltender for years. Most teams have goalies that are so good, it takes a great shot to beat them. When is the last time we had that? Roloson? And he went on a fantastic run in '06.

We have not had a bonafide #1 since Chris Pronger. We don't need to discuss that because any guy who could be so close to a Stanley Cup and simply walk away from his team with 3 years left on his contract doesn't give a crap. Mike Peca peaked at the right time, he wasn't great until the end of the season and then had a fantastic playoff. Another one who left for greener pastures.

We haven't had role players and I mean good role players here for years. Stoll, Torres and Co. were all great at what they did.

Last but not least, Tambellini brought in crap to replace people and we've paid for it dearly. Everyone crashed and burned here. The thought of Belanger still makes me sick.

Add to that the constant juggling of coaches and the fact that Pat Quinn was terrible, although a great post game interview, this department has been awful. The Old Boys Club on the bench is a disaster and maybe Lowe has their backs, but they needed to go in the off season.

As for the losing mentality, it ain't the players, ask them all how they feel about that? It's certainly not a jovial bunch after a game.

MacT hasn't made too dumb of a move yet so I'll give him some time. I bashed him more than anyone but the guy hates to lose and will do whatever it takes to right this ship. He truly loves this emblem and I'm willing to see how he handles his first season.

 

[McTedi]

If I can chime in, what you described wasn't always the case on Long Island. In fact, it wasn't until very recently. For years, the Isles were a cherry picking, non physical (outside of Martin) defensively negligent team. With pretty decent skill, and little commitment to do the little things on the ice that win games.

At some point, about mid-way through last season, it changed. They had a pretty long stretch of games where they were constantly very close to, often leading, very good teams in the league, and would ultimately wind up losing the games late. For whatever reason, it seemed like at that point in the season, they finally started to feel that they were good enough to compete with, and beat whoever they played, and almost instantaneously they started picking up their detail, compete level, and commitment to defense. Out of nowhere they started refusing to lose board battles, stopped cheating out of the D zone, paid extra attention to D zone support, and all four lines started hitting every chance that they got. And just as instantaneously, they started winning games with regularity.

Sometimes, all it takes to find that extra gear, extra focus and commitment level is the confidence to know that it's going to pay off. I don't think the Islanders had that for a very long time, and I don't think the Oilers have it right now, but you would (and hopefully will) be surprised at how quickly it can snowball. I saw the Oilers playing on Thursday a lot like the Islanders used to play. Especially when they were trailing in the 3rd period. Guys trying to stickhandle over the blueline and turning the puck over, instead of crashing and banging, to open up room for their skill later in the play. Very little physicality or urgency in their own zone. They looked like they were hoping to tie the game, rather than believing that they were going to.

But it can change pretty quickly if a couple things happen that make the team believe that they can win. There were reports last year, about a month in, that Bailey and Okposo dodged the press in the hallway after a loss to Carolina, and were laughing it up in the hallway over how bad the team sucked. By the end of the year, those two (not Tavares) were playing the best all around hockey of their careers, and were the driving force behind the Isles' run to qualify for the playoffs, with pretty much dominating two way play. Sometimes all it takes is confidence that you're good enough to win, and a hatred for losing can grow from it.

Great insight. The Isles have had the benefit of deeper D but alot of what ails both clubs is pretty similar.

 

[Oilslick941611]

pts or not he's -6 and his been owned on the year.

Got his lunch money stolen last night as well. By players that he ought to be better than.

+/- is such a useless stat and doesn't tell anything beyond a player being on the ice during a goal. btw, did you see how Dubnyk started the year? - stat on this team is inflated and biased towards the negative because of goaltending issues, it is especially useless for this team. No reliable conclusions can be gained from the +/- on any given day, much less with how our goalies are playing.

 

[Seedling]

If I can chime in, what you described wasn't always the case on Long Island. In fact, it wasn't until very recently. For years, the Isles were a cherry picking, non physical (outside of Martin) defensively negligent team. With pretty decent skill, and little commitment to do the little things on the ice that win games.

At some point, about mid-way through last season, it changed. They had a pretty long stretch of games where they were constantly very close to, often leading, very good teams in the league, and would ultimately wind up losing the games late. For whatever reason, it seemed like at that point in the season, they finally started to feel that they were good enough to compete with, and beat whoever they played, and almost instantaneously they started picking up their detail, compete level, and commitment to defense. Out of nowhere they started refusing to lose board battles, stopped cheating out of the D zone, paid extra attention to D zone support, and all four lines started hitting every chance that they got. And just as instantaneously, they started winning games with regularity.

Sometimes, all it takes to find that extra gear, extra focus and commitment level is the confidence to know that it's going to pay off. I don't think the Islanders had that for a very long time, and I don't think the Oilers have it right now, but you would (and hopefully will) be surprised at how quickly it can snowball. I saw the Oilers playing on Thursday a lot like the Islanders used to play. Especially when they were trailing in the 3rd period. Guys trying to stickhandle over the blueline and turning the puck over, instead of crashing and banging, to open up room for their skill later in the play. Very little physicality or urgency in their own zone. They looked like they were hoping to tie the game, rather than believing that they were going to.

But it can change pretty quickly if a couple things happen that make the team believe that they can win. There were reports last year, about a month in, that Bailey and Okposo dodged the press in the hallway after a loss to Carolina, and were laughing it up in the hallway over how bad the team sucked. By the end of the year, those two (not Tavares) were playing the best all around hockey of their careers, and were the driving force behind the Isles' run to qualify for the playoffs, with pretty much dominating two way play. Sometimes all it takes is confidence that you're good enough to win, and a hatred for losing can grow from it.

Excellent post and very timely. We are often said to be here the Isles were two years ago. Most of the pieces are here now. Now we need the attitude.

 

[bucks_oil]

If I can chime in, what you described wasn't always the case on Long Island. In fact, it wasn't until very recently. For years, the Isles were a cherry picking, non physical (outside of Martin) defensively negligent team. With pretty decent skill, and little commitment to do the little things on the ice that win games.

At some point, about mid-way through last season, it changed. They had a pretty long stretch of games where they were constantly very close to, often leading, very good teams in the league, and would ultimately wind up losing the games late. For whatever reason, it seemed like at that point in the season, they finally started to feel that they were good enough to compete with, and beat whoever they played, and almost instantaneously they started picking up their detail, compete level, and commitment to defense. Out of nowhere they started refusing to lose board battles, stopped cheating out of the D zone, paid extra attention to D zone support, and all four lines started hitting every chance that they got. And just as instantaneously, they started winning games with regularity.

Sometimes, all it takes to find that extra gear, extra focus and commitment level is the confidence to know that it's going to pay off. I don't think the Islanders had that for a very long time, and I don't think the Oilers have it right now, but you would (and hopefully will) be surprised at how quickly it can snowball. I saw the Oilers playing on Thursday a lot like the Islanders used to play. Especially when they were trailing in the 3rd period. Guys trying to stickhandle over the blueline and turning the puck over, instead of crashing and banging, to open up room for their skill later in the play. Very little physicality or urgency in their own zone. They looked like they were hoping to tie the game, rather than believing that they were going to.

But it can change pretty quickly if a couple things happen that make the team believe that they can win. There were reports last year, about a month in, that Bailey and Okposo dodged the press in the hallway after a loss to Carolina, and were laughing it up in the hallway over how bad the team sucked. By the end of the year, those two (not Tavares) were playing the best all around hockey of their careers, and were the driving force behind the Isles' run to qualify for the playoffs, with pretty much dominating two way play. Sometimes all it takes is confidence that you're good enough to win, and a hatred for losing can grow from it.

Excellent post! Thanks for coming by and bringing an outside perspective (from a fanbase that knows our pain).

To me... much of what you've said boils down to the oft overused and misunderstood term "maturity". Maturity doesn't come at a specific age... it comes with banging your head against the wall until your perspective changes.

It can be a very simple switch in mentality... from
i) "my linemate has the puck... how can I get open in scoring position so that we can go up one nothing" to " my linemate has the puck, where do I need to be to support this puck possession".
or
ii) "my Dman is in a scrum for the puck. If I jet in there, I might be able to free it up and get an odd man rush going" to "my Dman is in a scrum for the puck... he looks ok... where's my guy, ok... still got him... dman is about to gain the puck, he needs me now and I can give him an easy 5 foot outlet as my guy is still neutralized behind me"

In both cases the guys are *trying* to do the right thing, but just are too focused on their individual abilty/contribution to the situation rather than the structured 9/10 safe team perspective.

To me the biggest sub-elements of maturity in this sense relate to trust and confidence... you need to trust and have confidence in your teammates and that playing the system will pay off.

As you said... that's why it can snowball quickly as it self-reinforces.