Losing mentality sunk in deep.

McDraekke

5-14-6-1
Jan 19, 2006
2,853
397
Edmonton
I actually disagree with all of your interpretations of each of these quotes. Sounds more like to me that he's pissed with himself and his team that they keep letting things slip away.

I don't comment on here much, obviously, but I've been a part of this forum for quite a while, and I know enough that when you post things, Replacement, you add your own agenda to the mix when you're talking. Don't lead in with Hall having a loser's mentality, then show small snippets of quotes and pick each apart. When you start a conversation with that type of message, you're leading people. And you do this often.

Now, I haven't personally met a lot of professional competitors... but there's no way that some of these players are OK with losing. Hell, I am on a dodgeball team in a rec level league and it bothers me when I lose. Things haven't gelled yet, and the team has gone through how many coaches? No system is ingrained in these young kids yet.

I have patience, because now I finally believe that this team is on the right track. We've got solid depth players (I like Gazdic and Joensuu), some beastly wingers, a potential superstar center who is recovering from having major surgery, and I'll say this: below-average backup goaltending as our starters.

The mgmt has picked up Ference, a good player on the back end, Joensuu, maybe one of my biggest surprises this year, and has managed to get 8 points in 8 games out of what I thought to be an ahl career guy. Signed how many dmen, so to make sure that we don't have large gaping holes if a couple go down. Once Gagner comes back, we have a 'problem' at center...cause we don't know who to take out, or demote to lower lines. That's a great problem.

I wanna see this team get an actual bonafide goalie, then see how things go from there. If we can have solid and dependable goaltending and we still suck this bad, then ya... this team needs to figure out its ****.
 

McDraekke

5-14-6-1
Jan 19, 2006
2,853
397
Edmonton
It would be nice to know the context of his answers, if you're going to tear him apart like this. For all we know, the person with the interview is hand feeding him crap.
 

Replacement*

Checked out
Apr 15, 2005
48,856
2
Hiking
I actually disagree with all of your interpretations of each of these quotes. Sounds more like to me that he's pissed with himself and his team that they keep letting things slip away.

I don't comment on here much, obviously, but I've been a part of this forum for quite a while, and I know enough that when you post things, Replacement, you add your own agenda to the mix when you're talking. Don't lead in with Hall having a loser's mentality, then show small snippets of quotes and pick each apart. When you start a conversation with that type of message, you're leading people. And you do this often.

Now, I haven't personally met a lot of professional competitors... but there's no way that some of these players are OK with losing. Hell, I am on a dodgeball team in a rec level league and it bothers me when I lose. Things haven't gelled yet, and the team has gone through how many coaches? No system is ingrained in these young kids yet.

I have patience, because now I finally believe that this team is on the right track. We've got solid depth players (I like Gazdic and Joensuu), some beastly wingers, a potential superstar center who is recovering from having major surgery, and I'll say this: below-average backup goaltending as our starters.

The mgmt has picked up Ference, a good player on the back end, Joensuu, maybe one of my biggest surprises this year, and has managed to get 8 points in 8 games out of what I thought to be an ahl career guy. Signed how many dmen, so to make sure that we don't have large gaping holes if a couple go down. Once Gagner comes back, we have a 'problem' at center...cause we don't know who to take out, or demote to lower lines. That's a great problem.

I wanna see this team get an actual bonafide goalie, then see how things go from there. If we can have solid and dependable goaltending and we still suck this bad, then ya... this team needs to figure out its ****.

Fair post and comment. I did lead, through frustration, but tbh the thread doesn't happen without that frustration. The Hall comments elicited this for me. Not everbodies take, which is fine, thanks for taking the time to discuss.

This thread is Replacement snapping the pencil after 8GP. I actually lasted longer than most of the board..:laugh:

Last night was last straw territory for me and just disgusted that a club that is "tired of losing" could come out with that bs effort. Where they even admit they "came out flat"

If a club hates losing it doesn't come out flat. The Oilers do it regularly, still do.

Difference between this years version of club and others is theres less if any excuses and they're still losing, solid vet additions and still losing, solid game by Dubnyk and still lose.

Like everybody I'm frustrated with that. Maybe I hate losing..:laugh:
 

Replacement*

Checked out
Apr 15, 2005
48,856
2
Hiking
It would be nice to know the context of his answers, if you're going to tear him apart like this. For all we know, the person with the interview is hand feeding him crap.

The Hall content is from a print article which I linked. So this criticism is not fair. I provided the context as best I could. It was in the Edmonton Journal but I linked the Montreal Gazette instead because of the Journals pesky and stupid prescription requirement.
 

SeriousBusiness

T.Hall da man
Oct 5, 2003
3,628
3
I actually disagree with all of your interpretations of each of these quotes. Sounds more like to me that he's pissed with himself and his team that they keep letting things slip away.

I don't comment on here much, obviously, but I've been a part of this forum for quite a while, and I know enough that when you post things, Replacement, you add your own agenda to the mix when you're talking. Don't lead in with Hall having a loser's mentality, then show small snippets of quotes and pick each apart. When you start a conversation with that type of message, you're leading people. And you do this often.

Now, I haven't personally met a lot of professional competitors... but there's no way that some of these players are OK with losing. Hell, I am on a dodgeball team in a rec level league and it bothers me when I lose. Things haven't gelled yet, and the team has gone through how many coaches? No system is ingrained in these young kids yet.

I have patience, because now I finally believe that this team is on the right track. We've got solid depth players (I like Gazdic and Joensuu), some beastly wingers, a potential superstar center who is recovering from having major surgery, and I'll say this: below-average backup goaltending as our starters.

The mgmt has picked up Ference, a good player on the back end, Joensuu, maybe one of my biggest surprises this year, and has managed to get 8 points in 8 games out of what I thought to be an ahl career guy. Signed how many dmen, so to make sure that we don't have large gaping holes if a couple go down. Once Gagner comes back, we have a 'problem' at center...cause we don't know who to take out, or demote to lower lines. That's a great problem.

I wanna see this team get an actual bonafide goalie, then see how things go from there. If we can have solid and dependable goaltending and we still suck this bad, then ya... this team needs to figure out its ****.

This is a great post. :handclap:
 

Up the Irons

Registered User
Mar 9, 2008
7,681
389
Canada
Fair post and comment. I did lead, through frustration, but tbh the thread doesn't happen without that frustration. The Hall comments elicited this for me. Not everbodies take, which is fine, thanks for taking the time to discuss.

This thread is Replacement snapping the pencil after 8GP. I actually lasted longer than most of the board..:laugh:

Last night was last straw territory for me and just disgusted that a club that is "tired of losing" could come out with that bs effort. Where they even admit they "came out flat"

If a club hates losing it doesn't come out flat. The Oilers do it regularly, still do.

Difference between this years version of club and others is theres less if any excuses and they're still losing, solid vet additions and still losing, solid game by Dubnyk and still lose.

Like everybody I'm frustrated with that. Maybe I hate losing..:laugh:

we're all frustrated and maybe realizing that there might not be a light at the end of tunnel. it is now painfully obvious that time is not the only thing standing in the way of this team becoming a contender. it's not minor additions or tinkering, either. it's major decision time.

i still think you might be over analyzing things, Rep. they're just not a very good team, ergo, the opponent scores more goals.
 

Replacement*

Checked out
Apr 15, 2005
48,856
2
Hiking
we're all frustrated and maybe realizing that there might not be a light at the end of tunnel. it is now painfully obvious that time is not the only thing standing in the way of this team becoming a contender. it's not minor additions or tinkering, either. it's major decision time.

i still think you might be over analyzing things, Rep. they're just not a very good team, ergo, the opponent scores more goals.

On paper this club is better than the Islanders. I stand by that. On the ice this club doesn't compete like the Islanders. I'm not sure this team even believes its better than the Islanders. Therein lies some of the problem.

But lets look at is specifically. This Islanders club have also been chronic also rans and only made the playoffs last year on basis of being in weak EC.

I get that they are a hard team to play against, so play hard for 60minutes. Match level of compete.

People were wondering what Ference had to say. He stated that the Oilers needed to bring the level of effort they had against Pens and apply it to this game. But of course they didn't do that. Because they rarely bring a true winning effort. This club is good enough to win. I'm not convinced they believe it or know what it takes.
 
Last edited:

Meanashell11

Registered User
Jan 3, 2003
2,138
0
Greenwich CT
Visit site
I actually disagree with all of your interpretations of each of these quotes. Sounds more like to me that he's pissed with himself and his team that they keep letting things slip away.

I don't comment on here much, obviously, but I've been a part of this forum for quite a while, and I know enough that when you post things, Replacement, you add your own agenda to the mix when you're talking. Don't lead in with Hall having a loser's mentality, then show small snippets of quotes and pick each apart. When you start a conversation with that type of message, you're leading people. And you do this often.

Now, I haven't personally met a lot of professional competitors... but there's no way that some of these players are OK with losing. Hell, I am on a dodgeball team in a rec level league and it bothers me when I lose. Things haven't gelled yet, and the team has gone through how many coaches? No system is ingrained in these young kids yet.

I have patience, because now I finally believe that this team is on the right track. We've got solid depth players (I like Gazdic and Joensuu), some beastly wingers, a potential superstar center who is recovering from having major surgery, and I'll say this: below-average backup goaltending as our starters.

The mgmt has picked up Ference, a good player on the back end, Joensuu, maybe one of my biggest surprises this year, and has managed to get 8 points in 8 games out of what I thought to be an ahl career guy. Signed how many dmen, so to make sure that we don't have large gaping holes if a couple go down. Once Gagner comes back, we have a 'problem' at center...cause we don't know who to take out, or demote to lower lines. That's a great problem.

I wanna see this team get an actual bonafide goalie, then see how things go from there. If we can have solid and dependable goaltending and we still suck this bad, then ya... this team needs to figure out its ****.


Excellent post for sure.

With respect to knowing professional competitors, I run in the same circles as a number of them including a few NHL players. I can tell you that they never take losing, ever. I'll give one example from a number of years ago. I golfed with Clarke Gillies, he played pretty damn well but at one point had a really bad hole. After the game there was a dinner and we were getting showered and changed. He went to the driving range for an hour because he was so pissed at that one hole. Believe me, these guys compete over everything.

I also live down the street from Messier, Maloney, Bossy is always around. Marty St Louis lives in town. There are tons more, US olympians, college athletes and coaches. You have never seen a more driven person in your life. They are 60 years old and miss a shot at tennis and they come down so hard on themselves you would not believe.

In the end, that's what made them so good in the first place and that never leaves them.
 

McDraekke

5-14-6-1
Jan 19, 2006
2,853
397
Edmonton
The Hall content is from a print article which I linked. So this criticism is not fair. I provided the context as best I could. It was in the Edmonton Journal but I linked the Montreal Gazette instead because of the Journals pesky and stupid prescription requirement.

You're right, it isn't. I guess I meant it more as a "I wish that the article showed us the questions, then I'd feel better about picking Hall's answer." So my apologies for that.
 

Replacement*

Checked out
Apr 15, 2005
48,856
2
Hiking
You're right, it isn't. I guess I meant it more as a "I wish that the article showed us the questions, then I'd feel better about picking Hall's answer." So my apologies for that.

No worries, very much enjoyed your contribution to the thread. You should do the board a favor and post more often. Would keep guys like me in line. ;)
 

McDraekke

5-14-6-1
Jan 19, 2006
2,853
397
Edmonton
Oh and, I'm frustrated as hell too. Believe me. It's hard to watch this team lose and lose and lose. And I keep thinking "well, most are one goal games"... but that excuse is getting hard to take.

So if anything, my retort is from a place of frustration... we have that in common anyways.
 

Replacement*

Checked out
Apr 15, 2005
48,856
2
Hiking
Excellent post for sure.

With respect to knowing professional competitors, I run in the same circles as a number of them including a few NHL players. I can tell you that they never take losing, ever. I'll give one example from a number of years ago. I golfed with Clarke Gillies, he played pretty damn well but at one point had a really bad hole. After the game there was a dinner and we were getting showered and changed. He went to the driving range for an hour because he was so pissed at that one hole. Believe me, these guys compete over everything.

I also live down the street from Messier, Maloney, Bossy is always around. Marty St Louis lives in town. There are tons more, US olympians, college athletes and coaches. You have never seen a more driven person in your life. They are 60 years old and miss a shot at tennis and they come down so hard on themselves you would not believe.

In the end, that's what made them so good in the first place and that never leaves them.

Clark Gillies?

With all due respect if your familial context is former dynastic Islanders they had a legendary level of compete on that club and a commitment that I would never, ever question so I'm not sure thats a valid context. That club knew more than any, what was required to win and which a former version of the Oilers used as its effort based model as we all know.

While we're talking about what it takes to win we also remember a young Mark Messier talking in earnest about not knowing what he was going to do. He had an idea what it was going to take to be great, but had not convinced himself yet that he was prepared to make the entire life sacrifice yet to be do that. He actually briefly contemplated retiring. This is old news. This was sometime in late 1980.

So when people talk about caring about winning I think sometimes its engaged in a little flippantly without entirely realizing how much guys like Hall have to dial in, and dig deep if this club is going anywhere.

Its funny that John Tavares, pretty much on his own, is the heart and soul figurehead of the current Islanders. Its a good model for Hall to follow.
 

doulos

Registered User
Oct 4, 2007
7,725
1,235
Tavares has a much better core of TEAM players surrounding him. The idea that's he's a man alone on an island (pun intended) is simply a myth.
 

Replacement*

Checked out
Apr 15, 2005
48,856
2
Hiking
Tavares has a much better core of TEAM players surrounding him. The idea that's he's a man alone on an island (pun intended) is simply a myth.

I didn't state that. But its a myth that on paper the islanders have a better core.

Theres not much wrong with this Oilers club on paper now. MacT has brought in several good vet additions to solidify this lineup. Arco has also done a super job making the NHL transition.

I'm not seeing this as supporting cast victory. I'm seeing this as there being heroes on the island leading the club to greater heights. With Tavares being the poster boy for that.

Tavares is a lot better player than Taylor Hall. A notion this board fought tooth and nail against for years.

A great player learns how to lead his club to victory. Its clearly Tavares club. With not such a great supporting cast. They just play a lot harder than the Oilers. Because they ACTUALLY hate losing more I can only guess.

I agree entirely with you that the Islanders are much more of a TEAM. But wanting to win REQUIRES buying into team. Hall and fellow star Oilers haven't even bought into that concept yet.
 

AssistantCaptain*

Guest
If I was Hall, I would've "MacT gif'd" into the locker room after yesterday's game and told everyone to smarten up.

Hall telling someone to smarten up? Does not compute. This is where Andrew ference proves his worth as a leader. The guy was given the C without playing a single game ffs
 

GMofOilers

Registered User
Oct 15, 2007
15,664
4,196
Mountains
I don't know how many of you know this. Player quotes usually are the same thing the coach says to the team.

Just so you guys know. So if you are blaming a player for what they said, it's actually from the coach
 

doulos

Registered User
Oct 4, 2007
7,725
1,235
I didn't state that. But its a myth that on paper the islanders have a better core.

Theres not much wrong with this Oilers club on paper now. MacT has brought in several good vet additions to solidify this lineup. Arco has also done a super job making the NHL transition.

I'm not seeing this as supporting cast victory. I'm seeing this as there being heroes on the island leading the club to greater heights. With Tavares being the poster boy for that.

Tavares is a lot better player than Taylor Hall. A notion this board fought tooth and nail against for years.

A great player learns how to lead his club to victory. Its clearly Tavares club. With not such a great supporting cast. They just play a lot harder than the Oilers. Because they ACTUALLY hate losing more I can only guess.

I agree entirely with you that the Islanders are much more of a TEAM. But wanting to win REQUIRES buying into team. Hall and fellow star Oilers haven't even bought into that concept yet.

I don't believe either team hates losing any more or less than the other.

I don't believe the Islanders having a better group of players surrounding Tavares is a myth.

I don't believe that 'on paper' there is not much wrong with the Oilers.

I don't believe in any such notion that a great player suddenly learns how to lead a team to victory.

I'm unsure if Tavares is a LOT better than Hall as you suggest.

I guess that's why I read the sound bites you've posted from Hall as something entirely different.

I was mistaken that this thread has any value though, as it seems like lots of people wanted yet another thread complaining about phantom issues ;)
 

nitz

Registered User
Jul 27, 2009
1,758
0
No worries, very much enjoyed your contribution to the thread. You should do the board a favor and post more often. Would keep guys like me in line. ;)

You need to start spending less time at your computer.
 

oil4life97

Registered User
Aug 10, 2005
1,257
378
I think someone in edmonton back in 2005 may have literally sold their soul to the devil for some success to our sports teams. Esks win the grey gup in the fall of 2005 followed up with the oilers miraculous run to the finals the following spring. Since then both franchises have taken a severe nosedive to the sewers that etown has never seen before. I think we are cursed. Maybe edmonton needs an exorcism or something ?!
 

ResilientBeast

Proud Member of the TTSAOA
Jul 1, 2012
13,902
3,557
Edmonton
I think someone in edmonton back in 2005 may have literally sold their soul to the devil for some success to our sports teams. Esks win the grey gup in the fall of 2005 followed up with the oilers miraculous run to the finals the following spring. Since then both franchises have taken a severe nosedive to the sewers that etown has never seen before. I think we are cursed. Maybe edmonton needs an exorcism or something ?!

The Oilers are possessed with the ghost of old boys club past.
 

OttawaOilers

Registered User
Nov 12, 2012
9,278
23
Yeah. The only 'W' word I know from the Oilers is Whine. :whine:

or the only three letter word 'waa'
 

rboomercat90

Registered User
Mar 24, 2013
14,590
8,763
Edmonton
I often have opinions that highly differ from your posts, but that entire post was just bang-on with what I've been thinking for the last while. This is a serious problem that will continue to plague the team for years until it is addressed, the problem is it's a hard as hell problem to address.
The best thing that could have happened for either Hall or Eberle would have been to make the Olympic team and spend a couple weeks with a bunch of REAL professional hockey players, leaders and winners and learned what it takes to win. This did wonders for Mario Lemieux at the Canada Cup in 1987 where a few weeks with the best players in the world turned him from a petulant child into the force he became.
This could still happen of course but it sure isn't looking like they'll be earning their spots on the team right now.
 

Toydarian

Registered User
Jun 2, 2009
2,732
2
The type of "suck-age" the Oilers have displayed this year has blindsided even the most pessimistic fans. There were quips and criticisms of goaltending, questionable defense, depth, work ethic, etc. but nobody expected it all to manifest at once and so forcefully.

If fan's are dazed and confused by such a terrible performance, I suspect there are a number members of the team itself (including coaches) who didn't expect it to be this bad either.
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->