Speculation: Lose for Hughes

Do you want to tank 2018-19 for a chance at Jack Hughes?


  • Total voters
    87

blinkman360

Loyal Players Only
Dec 30, 2005
11,925
1,489
Lawn Guyland
This team has a chip on their shoulder after all the drama that's gone down this offseason. People are already writing them off. When you take a step back though and look at the roster, there is still a lot of talent here. There is a legend running the FO and a Cup winning HC behind the bench. I'm curious to see how they come out of the gate before I decide to blow it up.

Worst case we can still sell our assets at the deadline - Lee and Eberle, mainly. I'd still look to lock both of those guys up before the season starts, though.
 

LeapOnOver

Mackenzie is a hack!
Jan 23, 2011
12,473
3,677
Iksan, S. Korea
www.leaponover.com
My point was that we wouldn’t be in a slam dunk position to draft Hughes.

There is no slam dunk position to get Hughes with a draft lottery. I would have worded the OP differently and say going for a high draft pick rather than a middle draft pick. Ask Detroit what it's like getting middle of the road draft picks for years and years.

It's unfathomable to me that people think we have a chance to make the playoffs with this roster.

Beau Barzal Eberle
Lee Nelson Bailey
Ladd Cizikas Clutterbuck
Martin/Fillipula Komarov Johnston

Leddy / Boychuk
Pelech / Hickey
Mayfield/Toews

Lehner
Greiss

I mean really? This is scary bad. I don't think JHS hast teh mentality to be a game-breaker in this league, but he could be the wildcard.

Trotz is a good coach, but I don't think he's a miracle worker.
 

Hunn

Registered User
Feb 23, 2017
1,647
1,251
The best approach, IMO:

(1) No Duchene, Karlsson, etc.

(2) Let's see what this team can do under Trotz, let's see whether the young guns like Barzal, Pulock, Beau, JHS are ready to make that "next step".

(3) If, by New Year, we are a bubble team hovering at or below WC - then go Rangers way.
 

JKP

Registered User
Sep 19, 2004
6,501
3,355
Halifax, NS
Sounds easy enough! Boom, playoffs here we come.

This team has a great foundation of talent but is simply not ready to compete yet.

Tanking doesn't mean that we are going to start Chris Gibson every night and give Ross Johnston 18-20 minutes on the first line. In this instance, it means that the Islanders are going to hold on their assets, avoid "quick fixes" and look to build a sustainable winning culture with the new regime (management who actually knows what the hell it is doing this time!). No one should be heartbroken or surprised when this team misses the playoffs this season.
The “quick fix” is what everyone clamoured for - a real coach!
 

BelovedIsles

Registered User
Oct 22, 2005
20,219
5,464
There is no slam dunk position to get Hughes with a draft lottery. I would have worded the OP differently and say going for a high draft pick rather than a middle draft pick. Ask Detroit what it's like getting middle of the road draft picks for years and years.

It's unfathomable to me that people think we have a chance to make the playoffs with this roster.

Beau Barzal Eberle
Lee Nelson Bailey
Ladd Cizikas Clutterbuck
Martin/Fillipula Komarov Johnston

Leddy / Boychuk
Pelech / Hickey
Mayfield/Toews

Lehner
Greiss

I mean really? This is scary bad. I don't think JHS hast teh mentality to be a game-breaker in this league, but he could be the wildcard.

Trotz is a good coach, but I don't think he's a miracle worker.

The roster, as is, is slated for a 5 to 12 finish imho.
 

MattMartin

Killer Instinct™
Feb 10, 2007
17,552
10,140
Long Island
The best approach, IMO:

(1) No Duchene, Karlsson, etc.

(2) Let's see what this team can do under Trotz, let's see whether the young guns like Barzal, Pulock, Beau, JHS are ready to make that "next step".

(3) If, by New Year, we are a bubble team hovering at or below WC - then go Rangers way.

Exactly my thoughts. We can technically trade Lee and Eberle for picks and still be left with the following

Beauvillier
Barzal
Bellows
Wahlstrom
JHS

Pulock
Toews
Dobson
Wilde
Pelech

Sorokin
Skarek
Soderstrom
 

LeapOnOver

Mackenzie is a hack!
Jan 23, 2011
12,473
3,677
Iksan, S. Korea
www.leaponover.com
The roster, as is, is slated for a 5 to 12 finish imho.

5-12 from the bottom of the league I assume you are saying? Can't really argue with that. I just don't want to finish in that higher range. My greatest fear for this team is us to be 4-5 points out of a wild card spot come the trade deadline with neither Lee or Eberle agreeing to an extension and have to sit here and go back and forth on whether to trade them or lose them for nothing. I really hope, if Lou's intention is to keep them, that they re-sign early or the Islander's play makes it a no-brainer to sell them off to the highest bidder.
 

PWJunior

Stay safe!
Apr 11, 2010
42,914
22,755
Long Island, NY
5-12 from the bottom of the league I assume you are saying? Can't really argue with that. I just don't want to finish in that higher range. My greatest fear for this team is us to be 4-5 points out of a wild card spot come the trade deadline with neither Lee or Eberle agreeing to an extension and have to sit here and go back and forth on whether to trade them or lose them for nothing. I really hope, if Lou's intention is to keep them, that they re-sign early or the Islander's play makes it a no-brainer to sell them off to the highest bidder.

After what just happened, there is no debate... you sell no matter what at the trade deadline. We're a fringe playoff team at best if everything comes together, the assets will be needed to upgrade the team to make real noise in 2019-2020.
 

LamorielloAndSon

Registered User
May 28, 2018
1,775
702
Next year is a great crop of ufas, will it be this good next July first, absolutely not
If the isles can squeeze into the playoffs can they attract some of those players that do make it to ufa, absolutely
 

Benedict Kovalchuk

Kovalchuk: A spy?
Jul 19, 2011
8,233
2,960
CASCADIA NOW
Huh, so Komarov Fillipula Matt Martin and Thomas Hickey is Lou "going for it"? I think it's quite obvious he's on board for a few tank seasons.
I never said going for it, we're obviously not there. What I think is that we are in for a year or two retooling, that's it. While He-who-must-not-be-named has left us in the lurch, and our upcoming UFAs doing so as well, we are not the team we were 10 years ago. These moves are more a signal of a culture change than really tanking, though that may end up the outcome anyways.
 
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BelovedIsles

Registered User
Oct 22, 2005
20,219
5,464
5-12 from the bottom of the league I assume you are saying? Can't really argue with that. I just don't want to finish in that higher range. My greatest fear for this team is us to be 4-5 points out of a wild card spot come the trade deadline with neither Lee or Eberle agreeing to an extension and have to sit here and go back and forth on whether to trade them or lose them for nothing. I really hope, if Lou's intention is to keep them, that they re-sign early or the Islander's play makes it a no-brainer to sell them off to the highest bidder.

Yeah, bottom 5-12. So much parity within the crap.

I trust LL. My guess is he’ll asses whether he believes they are long term pieces, whether they are interested in committing, and act accordingly.
 

YearlyLottery

The Pooch Report
Feb 7, 2013
11,374
7,654
South Carolina
After what just happened, there is no debate... you sell no matter what at the trade deadline. We're a fringe playoff team at best if everything comes together, the assets will be needed to upgrade the team to make real noise in 2019-2020.

I'm curious because I keep hearing you use the "sell sell sell: mantra. Who do you want them to sell? I mean let's go best case and this team is in the final wildcard spot but you've got Lee and Eberle unsigned. Do you trade them for just picks?
 

saintunspecified

Registered User
Nov 30, 2017
6,048
4,341
I'm curious because I keep hearing you use the "sell sell sell: mantra. Who do you want them to sell? I mean let's go best case and this team is in the final wildcard spot but you've got Lee and Eberle unsigned. Do you trade them for just picks?

Eberle and Nelson are the only sells I can see. Nyi tanking would mean taking on contracts for assets more than selling players. But I agree - there's no reason to make a decision now. But it would be a mistake to give up futures for Duchene.

Lee should be signed to the jvr deal imo.
 

Newsworthy

Registered User
Jan 28, 2018
4,253
982
USA
How do you instill a winning atmosphere by deliberately tanking?
How do you win without premiere talent?
How do you get top talent?
Certainly not by picking in the 10-15 range all the time.
Islanders should try and capitalize on their bad goalies and young defense now.
Even with JT, Cdh, and a solid netminder we'd be a borderline playoff team. A better coach and system wouldve made us at best a first rd exit.
This team is so flawed that bringing in Trotz doesn't matter.
It kinda hurts the unintentional tank.
Last year people were complaining about the last three wins in a row. Than the draft happened.

Next year's draft is nowhere near as deep.
But which way do fans want it to go?
 

LeapOnOver

Mackenzie is a hack!
Jan 23, 2011
12,473
3,677
Iksan, S. Korea
www.leaponover.com
How do you win without premiere talent?
How do you get top talent?
Certainly not by picking in the 10-15 range all the time.
Islanders should try and capitalize on their bad goalies and young defense now.
Even with JT, Cdh, and a solid netminder we'd be a borderline playoff team. A better coach and system wouldve made us at best a first rd exit.
This team is so flawed that bringing in Trotz doesn't matter.
It kinda hurts the unintentional tank.
Last year people were complaining about the last three wins in a row. Than the draft happened.

Next year's draft is nowhere near as deep.
But which way do fans want it to go?

How do you get top talent? Draft and develop is probably the Islander's only choice. It's obvious we are still not even close to being a premiere UFA destination and NMC's kill us as well.
Certainly not by picking in the 10-15 range all the time. Agree
Islanders should try and capitalize on their bad goalies and young defense now. Pretty much agree
Even with JT, Cdh, and a solid netminder we'd be a borderline playoff team. A better coach and system wouldve made us at best a first rd exit. I disagree with this. I think a healthy CDH and a real defensive system would have done wonders for this team. We even started out very well. Weight lost the team, they didn't buy into the system, the train went off the tracks. If we had the same team as last season with a new coach I'd be excited about this upcoming season
This team is so flawed that bringing in Trotz doesn't matter. Having a good coach always matters, but it won't affect this season. It will be building a winning culture for future seasons though. Set the system, copy it in Bridgeport and start building for future success with it. It's still important to bring in a good coach now like we finally did.
It kinda hurts the unintentional tank. Still gotta ice the best team and push your players to perform as best as possible, but no reason not to trade guys that aren't part of the future or dont' want to be here to maximize and manage assets. Now is the season to do that with which seems to be a roster incapable of really competing for anything
Last year people were complaining about the last three wins in a row. Than the draft happened. Don't know about that...I kept watching games but stopped caring about the outcomes in December.

When you really break this down to nuts and bolts...and I don't know why people aren't grasping this, but we lost our best/2nd best forward, best/2nd best stay at home defenseman, and our best goalie to UFA. The best of a team that missed the playoffs by 17 points or so. Even if Trotz gains us back 7 or 10 points with that squad...he doesn't have that squad. He's got a worse one. I'm usually the one to sit here and say, "eh, there are some question marks but if some key guys step up and fill the gap it could be a good season". I can't even begin to think that with this roster. I wrote it down above. How can anyone be confident with it in it's current state? Aren't there guys that have been able to (in the past) extrapolate the advanced stats of the added and removed players to see where we would have been in the course of a full season? I'd really be curious if that could add some data to those who are still looking at this team with "aww lost stray" eyes. Taking this team to the vet, cleaning them up some and trimming their nails is still going to leave us with a skinny mutt who shits on the floor before he scratches at the door to go out.
 

Kevin27NYI

Registered User
Aug 5, 2009
19,781
5,848
There is no slam dunk position to get Hughes with a draft lottery. I would have worded the OP differently and say going for a high draft pick rather than a middle draft pick. Ask Detroit what it's like getting middle of the road draft picks for years and years.

It's unfathomable to me that people think we have a chance to make the playoffs with this roster.

Beau Barzal Eberle
Lee Nelson Bailey
Ladd Cizikas Clutterbuck
Martin/Fillipula Komarov Johnston

Leddy / Boychuk
Pelech / Hickey
Mayfield/Toews

Lehner
Greiss

I mean really? This is scary bad. I don't think JHS hast teh mentality to be a game-breaker in this league, but he could be the wildcard.

Trotz is a good coach, but I don't think he's a miracle worker.
Did you intentionally try and make the line combos look bad?
 

Sorge Georos

Registered User
Apr 28, 2009
3,026
260
LI
How do you instill a winning atmosphere by deliberately tanking?

By getting good players and having a good coach.

When we actually looked like a contender in 2014 I doubt anyone was crying about the losing culture that brought us Tavares.

Did this rebuild fail because of an existential culture problem? IMO it failed because of terrible coaching, player development, drafting, arena situation, and JT being a penishead.
 
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Sorge Georos

Registered User
Apr 28, 2009
3,026
260
LI
What Snow did was not an indictment on the concept of rebuilding. You just need to have proper infrastructure to bring your guys up.

I think it's time to see this roster for what it is rather than suiciding for mediocrity.

If Brian Cashman were our GM and we imported the Yanks Player Dev it would be different.
 

crasherino

Registered User
May 9, 2013
7,342
2,836
How do you win without premiere talent?
How do you get top talent?
Certainly not by picking in the 10-15 range all the time.
Islanders should try and capitalize on their bad goalies and young defense now.
Even with JT, Cdh, and a solid netminder we'd be a borderline playoff team. A better coach and system wouldve made us at best a first rd exit.
This team is so flawed that bringing in Trotz doesn't matter.
It kinda hurts the unintentional tank.
Last year people were complaining about the last three wins in a row. Than the draft happened.

Next year's draft is nowhere near as deep.
But which way do fans want it to go?

I dunno - we just picked 11 and 12 and came out with absolute studs. Guys who just revitalized our entire prospect pool. Our best young defender was taken at #15. Our franchise Center was taken at #16. The last guy we took in the top 5 is only one of 3 guys not to have a goal from his draft class. I think we've done pretty damn well in that range.

The goal is to make the playoffs. I wouldn't sell off any prime assets to make an unrealistic push and if we aren't competitive at the TDL, I certainly would look to be a seller. But its fvcking July 6th, I'm looking for this team to be competitive. We will obviously need some good breaks with health and development this season, but lesser teams have done better in this league.
 
Last edited:
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Newsworthy

Registered User
Jan 28, 2018
4,253
982
USA
I dunn0 - we just picked 11 and 12 and came out with absolute studs. Guys who just revitalized our entire prospect pool. Our best young defender was taken at #15. Our franchise Center was taken at #16. The last guy we took in the top 5 is only one of 3 guys not to have a goal from his draft class. I think we've done pretty damn well in that range.

The goal is to make the playoffs. I wouldn't sell off any prime assets to make an unrealistic push and if we aren't competitive at the TDL, I certainly would look to be a seller. But its fvcking July 6th, I'm looking for this team to be competitive. We will obviously need some good breaks with health and development this season, but lesser teams have done better in this league.

No. We've done horrible in picking top five in the past.
Strome instead of Schiefele
Reinhart instead of Forsberg
MDC instead of Ehlers
We lost our best player who went 1OA.
Picking 11 and 12 in a very deep draft. Next year it's back to normal. And by making the playoffs that puts the team in the teens and sets us back in our rebuild.
So you rather continue to be mediocre?
I wanted the NYI to tank even if we kept Tavares and CDH because our prospect pool is so devoid of talent. Snow didn't get the job done.
Look at the last teams to win the Cup. Their best players were high picks.
This reminds me of the NY Knicks philosophy.
Not bad enough to draft a Lebron James or Ayton and not good enough to make the playoffs.
I get it fans are tired of losing and the thought of another rebuild is mind bending but we just lost Tavares. We have no franchise goalie. Our defense presently is bad. What we have going for us is Trotz. I don't have faith in Lou personally. I thought he killed the draft but getting Martin and Komariv show me that he wants to win now. But that isn't realistic.
Maybe Toronto should have tanked last year?
Could you imagine they drafted Dahlin or Svechnikov?
 
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