Lockout talk thread

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NervousPerson

Registered User
Apr 11, 2010
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Bertuzzi and Sammy are fine. Sammy is a decent pickup who is rock steady as a supporting winger. Realistically none of our prospects have the consistency or size of these two.

We can also be sure that they will both spend time on the IR due to their age and history. Opening up opportuntiies for our young guys to play them out of a job.

Worst case: 1. Steady veteran wingers with size/skill 2. Prospects get a shot to play at the NHL 10-30 games and win a job (and keep their next contract reasonable). 3. Veteran wingers will hopefully be healthy and rested for playoffs.

Whats the downside?

Yeah, I wouldn't buyout anyone either, like I said but if I had to it would probably be those two.

Conversely on the Leafs board a thread was made with possible buyouts for every team.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1315233

What castoffs would you want to pick up?

Vinny? Redden? Volchenkov? Souray?

I'd give Volvhenkov a shot. Then the Wings would have way too many players though.
 

Winger98

Moderator
Feb 27, 2002
22,756
4,569
Cleveland
I guarantee this 3-4 month extra rest it's nothing but positive for older bodies.

I'm not sure it's a good thing for older athletes. Bert hasn't been able to play, and he's going to have a much more difficult time getting into game shape than the younger guys.
 

TS Quint

I can see!
Sep 8, 2012
7,792
5,065
Yeah, I wouldn't buyout anyone either, like I said but if I had to it would probably be those two.

Conversely on the Leafs board a thread was made with possible buyouts for every team.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1315233

What castoffs would you want to pick up?

Vinny? Redden? Volchenkov? Souray?

I'd give Volvhenkov a shot. Then the Wings would have way too many players though.

Bring in the Heater! With all the pass first players we have he would light it up. Playing Dats and Nyquist would be deadly. Pipe dream, I know but I think it would be awesome.

Volchenkov would be some good defensive stability. He would allow Smith to rome around a little more.
 

TS Quint

I can see!
Sep 8, 2012
7,792
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Bert, Sammy and Franzen all need to go. Realistically, none of them will be bought out.

Maybe you can trade Franzen, like propain said.

Any forward over 6'2 must go! We need to be the smallest, weakest team in the league. We like it when Weber comes to town to take our lunch money.
 

Vladdy84

L-O-Y-A-L-T-Y
Dec 1, 2011
10,675
12
Farmington
Yeah, I wouldn't buyout anyone either, like I said but if I had to it would probably be those two.

Conversely on the Leafs board a thread was made with possible buyouts for every team.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1315233

What castoffs would you want to pick up?

Vinny? Redden? Volchenkov? Souray?

I'd give Volvhenkov a shot. Then the Wings would have way too many players though.

Briere, Homicide Heatley, Campbell? Especially Campbell if the Wings choose not to re-sign White.
 

RedWingsNow*

Guest
Honestly, If I could buy out two guys it would be Cleary and Sammy..

Bert's cap hit makes him keepable.

No way do I buy out Franzen. I may be disappointed that we kept him over Franzen, and I may get sick of his two-month no-shows, but he's still an important part of this team.
 

ProPAIN

I am the DANGER!
Nov 3, 2009
13,989
5
Paris
Honestly, If I could buy out two guys it would be Cleary and Sammy..

Bert's cap hit makes him keepable.

No way do I buy out Franzen. I may be disappointed that we kept him over Franzen, and I may get sick of his two-month no-shows, but he's still an important part of this team.

Why would you buy-out a player who will be a free agent in July? Unless this year doesn't count against contracts, he has 6 months before he's a UFA.

I would let Bert and Sammy go, bring in Tatar, Mursak and go with this team:

Nyquist - Datsyuk - Franzen
Filppula - Zetterberg - Brunner
Tatar - Helm - Miller
Abdelkader - Andersson - Tootoo

Mursak, Emmerton, Eaves (IR)

Kronwall - Smith
Ericsson - White
Colaicovo - Quincey

Kindl

Howard
Gustavsson

Another possibility is Colaicovo, but we are too thin on D.
 

InjuredChoker

Registered User
Dec 25, 2011
31,402
345
LTIR or golf course
Campbell bought out? LMAO. Number 1D, Florida doesn't have cap issues and Campbell, though slightly overpaid still has value.

Heatley won't get bought out. Worst offensive team in NHL? Yeah, they're buying out their best shooter. Buy out PMB, maybe Brodziak or Cullen, and bring in the kids on ELCs.
 

JmanWingsFan

Your average Jman
Aug 18, 2011
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Somewhere
Is variance basically the ability for GM's to restructure salaries of players by the percentage amount allowed during the period so as to fit under the cap? If that's the case, then 30% plus two cap compliance buyouts with a cap between $60-65million (My guess it will end up at $63 Million)... Boy things could get very interesting very fast.
 

Actual Thought*

Guest
The 50ish game season should help the wings. I thought they were a fringe playoff team with a full regular season, but 50 games will benefit an older team.

Lockout years are very random.
They should start keeping lockout year stats. Lockouts happen so often that they are becoming a huge factor in outcomes!
 

sarcastro

Registered User
Jul 28, 2005
13,059
1
Honestly, If I could buy out two guys it would be Cleary and Sammy..

Bert's cap hit makes him keepable.

No way do I buy out Franzen. I may be disappointed that we kept him over Franzen, and I may get sick of his two-month no-shows, but he's still an important part of this team.

Bert's cap hit might be reasonable but his penchant for taking bad penalties (bad on his part, or bad on the refs' part because he has a bullseye on his back, either way) is a detriment to the team and they have a lot of good young players ready to contribute.

Keepable? Maybe. But they have alternatives now and should have more confidence in them after the way they've been performing in GR. Besides, this team is going to have to go young at some point and it's better if they don't wait until they have to do it all at once.
 

probertrules24

Registered User
Jul 10, 2007
2,901
1
Canada
Would love it if someone explained make-whole and variance to me.

Quoted from NHL.com

No Rollback; Players' Share "Make Whole" Provision
The NHL is not proposing that current SPCs be reduced, re-written or rolled back. Instead, the NHL's proposal retains all current Players' SPCs at their current face value for the duration of their terms, subject to the operation of the escrow mechanism in the same manner as it has worked under the expired CBA. (In other words, under the expired CBA, the compensation a Player received each year was either higher or lower than the face value of his contract depending upon Club-Player contracting levels and the level and growth rate of HRR.) Under the expired CBA, in two of the seven years Players were paid in excess of the face values of their SPCs and in five of those years they received less than their face values. That process would remain intact under the new CBA.

Under our "make whole" proposal, which is premised upon a 5% anticipated growth of HRR both this year and in future years, every Player will be paid compensation based on the full value of the Players' Share under which his current SPC was signed.

In order to effectively transition from a Players' Share of 57 percent to 50 percent, including importantly to protect Players' current SPCs against an absolute reduction in Players' Share dollars, the new Agreement contemplates, in its initial years, a "make whole" mechanism that will effectively pay each Player currently under contract the difference between 50% of Actual HRR in 2012/13 and 57% of HRR in 2011/12 -- which was $1.883 Billion.

Again, premised upon an assumed 5% growth rate between 2011/12 and 2012/13, the "make whole" amount is calculated to be a maximum of $149 million for the 2012/13 season ($1.883 Billion minus $1.734 Billion (57% multiplied by $3.303 Billion minus 50% multiplied by $3.468 Billion). Similarly, utilizing that formula and our 5% growth projections, the "make whole" amount is calculated to be a maximum of $62 million for the 2013/14 season.

To accomplish the "make whole," each Players' pro-rata "make whole" will be determined for the first two years of the Agreement and will be paid to each Player as a Deferred Compensation benefit over the life of the Player's existing SPC. For those Players whose contracts expire after the 2012/13 season, the benefit will be paid when final HRR is determined for this season (in October/November 2013). Player "make whole" payments will be accrued and paid for by the League, and will be chargeable against Players' Share amounts in future years as Preliminary Benefits.

The "make whole" obligation will be operational only through the 2013/14 season because, beginning in Year 3, the projected growth in League-wide revenues should have resulted in an increase in absolute Players' Share dollars (in excess of the Players' Share of $1.883 Billion in 2011/12). This will effectively restore "full value" to all existing SPCs without any continuing need for a "make whole."

We note in regard to this proposal, that while the NHLPA's August 14 proposal was premised upon a 7% annual growth rate in HRR, we instead used the more conservative growth rate of 5%, consistent with our prior proposals. If the NHLPA's estimate of revenue growth is more accurate, then the amount of money needed to effectuate a "make whole" would actually be less.
 

RedWingsNow*

Guest
Cleary's contract already comes off the books in July, unless you're talking about buying him out now... Still makes no sense to me, but whatever.

Ah sorry. I was thinking a quick buyout on return. The cap doesn't go down until the next year, right?
Yep. Sammy + Bert. Though I might consider Quincey, too.
 

ProPAIN

I am the DANGER!
Nov 3, 2009
13,989
5
Paris
Ah sorry. I was thinking a quick buyout on return. The cap doesn't go down until the next year, right?
Yep. Sammy + Bert. Though I might consider Quincey, too.

As much as some people may hate hate him, this team is just too thin on defense to let a second pairing defenseman go. He's not the best in the league by any stretch of the imagination, but Holland has decided to replace key players by committee and Q is part of that. He can play on the PP and PK (a luxury we just don't have apart from Kronner). If we have a better replacement for cheaper, then I'd like to hear them. And I don't mean point production.
 

Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
36,201
14,684
I really have little to absolutely no faith in the lockout ending, but in the event a miracle occurs I would be very excited to see Brunner come over and play. I really think he could give a big boost to this team offensively, guy has a great skill set.
 

Heaton

Moderator
Feb 13, 2004
22,548
925
Auburn Hills
As much as some people may hate hate him, this team is just too thin on defense to let a second pairing defenseman go. He's not the best in the league by any stretch of the imagination, but Holland has decided to replace key players by committee and Q is part of that. He can play on the PP and PK (a luxury we just don't have apart from Kronner). If we have a better replacement for cheaper, then I'd like to hear them. And I don't mean point production.

Especially with Quincey's age. As average as he was since coming over there weren't a ton of better value for the long term.
 

RedMachine87

Registered User
May 20, 2011
665
0
A^2
I really have little to absolutely no faith in the lockout ending, but in the event a miracle occurs I would be very excited to see Brunner come over and play. I really think he could give a big boost to this team offensively, guy has a great skill set.

I sadly agree about the work stoppage. Lockouts really are a pretty pathetic bargaining strategy. Childish even. I'd go so far as to compare it to a schoolyard kickball game where the two sides can't agree on a fair set of rules and so the owner takes his ball and goes home.

Grow up, act professional, and stop getting so butt hurt over the disagreements. Is the money you think you're going to "save" really going to compensate for the money lost by canceling a whole NHL season (around $3 billion last year) or the damage done to the sport in general due to pissed off fans?

There is a reason the NHL has more canceled games over the last 20 years than the three other major sports combined. It's because it makes no business sense to alienate your fans. Especially when the major issues will trend towards an equilibrium anyways.

/End Rant
 

RedWingsNow*

Guest
As much as some people may hate hate him, this team is just too thin on defense to let a second pairing defenseman go. He's not the best in the league by any stretch of the imagination, but Holland has decided to replace key players by committee and Q is part of that. He can play on the PP and PK (a luxury we just don't have apart from Kronner). If we have a better replacement for cheaper, then I'd like to hear them. And I don't mean point production.

i disagree. I;m tired of the excuse makers.
And I also disagree that he's an answer on our PK. If he is, this team is in serious trouble.
Frankly, with Kronwall, White, Smith, CC and Kindl, we don;t need Quincey on the PP.

So what we needed was a defensive defenseman. Allen or Hanan were better options.
 
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