OT: LOCAL COVID19 - PART I... Seriously, local only
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Pierre from Orleans
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- May 9, 2007
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They should have absolutely funded the LTC homes more once they knew they were the most vulnerable demographic. Reports from the start up until now by the military have found grotesque conditions which probably attributed to the death toll. Not to mention what hasn't been documented or places that haven't been visited
DaveMatthew
Bring in Peter
As the US and CDC continue to ease restrictions with vaccines proving to be more effective at reducing symptoms AND transmission, Canada's health "leaders" continue to fear monger and beat down their populace.
New York and California announce, essentially, a full-reopening on July 1st (sports events, broadway, concerts, etc).
Toronto cancels all major summer events, Lisa McLeod says the CFLs plan to have SOME fans in the stands in August is "ambitious".
The CDC says fully-vaccinated individuals do not need to wear masks indoors or outdoors, regardless of the gathering size, as there is next to no risk to them or others.
Deputy Chief Public Officer of Canada comes out and says that Canada is unlikely to follow the US approach to easing restrictions, saying, "we have a community approach, so it's not about what an individual should be able to do with one or two doses."
These people have completely lost all sense of logic and reason. "Trust the science" has been completely abandoned by this country.
New York and California announce, essentially, a full-reopening on July 1st (sports events, broadway, concerts, etc).
Toronto cancels all major summer events, Lisa McLeod says the CFLs plan to have SOME fans in the stands in August is "ambitious".
The CDC says fully-vaccinated individuals do not need to wear masks indoors or outdoors, regardless of the gathering size, as there is next to no risk to them or others.
Deputy Chief Public Officer of Canada comes out and says that Canada is unlikely to follow the US approach to easing restrictions, saying, "we have a community approach, so it's not about what an individual should be able to do with one or two doses."
These people have completely lost all sense of logic and reason. "Trust the science" has been completely abandoned by this country.
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Rand0m
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- Oct 2, 2011
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To be fair, all of my co-workers in the US have had their second shots for a few weeks already now. One guy in California said he had his second one the 1st week of February. Basically, if you've wanted the shot in the US, you could have gotten it very easily by now. At that point, reopening plans make sense.
It's also unfair to paint all of Canada with a broad brush, many of these things are provincial responsibilities. The only reason Ontario is doing so poorly is that they elected a mini-Trump that's way over his head. Although I can't say I agree with everything the Quebec government has done, there at least was a plan in place and the messaging was somewhat clear, especially starting back in the fall. The Vaccine rollout is also going particularly well so far, anyone 18+ is eligible and 16+ if you work in a summer camp. I got mine last weekend, the whole thing took 30 minutes.
We've been pretty much under curfew since Christmas, we had a bit of a lift in restrictions in February but they quickly shut things back down again when things were starting to trend upwards.
Our premier publicly praised the Saskatchewan reopening plan and indicated they would work on a similar one so I'm sure as vaccination is opened up to all adults and soon to 12-18 we'll be seeing a phased plan in the coming weeks.
Phases of the Re-Open Saskatchewan Plan | Re-Open Saskatchewan Plan | Government of Saskatchewan
Big Muddy
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- Dec 15, 2019
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https://www.washingtonpost.com/busi...738674-9b29-11eb-b2f5-7d2f0182750d_story.html
Edit - Upon examining the info provided in the linked article, you would/will note that there is a chance for reinfection, although it would be small. Thought I'd clarify as you can't tell if folks read (or what they interpret from what they read) the info provided in links.
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FunkySeeFunkyDoo
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I think there are two factors at play:
1) They are tremendously gun shy as a result of the 3rd wave. It's pretty much accepted that the 3rd wave could have been avoided or lessened if they'd just delayed reopening by a few weeks back in Feb... so now they are trying to avoid a 4th wave by keeping everything shut for as long as they can.
2) They're using the opposite psychology as the US. The Americans are now running up against vaccine hesitancy, so they're using a big carrot of reopening to incent people to get vaccinated. There's not as much hesitancy here, and due to climate we have a much greater tendency to really socialize in the summer ... so they're trying to dampen that.
What they're missing though is that almost everyone needs there to be SOME END IN SIGHT to this whole thing, The mixed messaging has already caused a ton of people to tune them out or resent them, and if they continue with some kind of ultra-cautious "even after everyones vaccinated we'll still need to abstain from <x, y, z>" then they'll basically no one paying attention or doing anything they say.
Look at what you just posted
The US is doing good because people are vaccinated. That's true
Ontario is not doing poorly because they elected a mini Trump. Ontario vaccinated 160k people yesterday. Ontario is doing poorly because we didn't have vaccines to vaccinate 160K people a day in February.
We can all jump up and down and point fingers. It does not do much good
What's evident from looking at world wide data is that the vaccines have been very successful.
We're struggling in Canada because there really wasn't an opportunity to be successful with out having vaccines
We'll hit vaccine hesitancy when we get to the levels the Americans are at.
FunkySeeFunkyDoo
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YouGotAStuGoing
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Rand0m
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- Oct 2, 2011
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They’re doing “better” because they produced the vaccines in the US and we don’t produce anything here. (that’s another discussion).
The Canadian vaccine delivery timelines were always forecasted to ramp up in April->June, just like they are right now. We knew there wasn’t enough in February. That’s why the plan in the mean time should be to manage the spread and prevent ICU overcrowding. The Ontario govt is on the hook for that 3rd wave.
The U.S. have a massive lead in vaccination rate, especially in places like New York State. Compared to Ontario, 40% of all adults in NY have been fully vaccinated. That number in Ontario is closer to 5%, maybe? You're comparing apples and oranges.
Even moreso, the modelling that's been done since this pandemic started has been fairly close to reality. If they continue to model major community outbreaks at current vaccination levels then I don't think the general public have much reason to object to that type of advice.
i said we are a more complicit society, using complicit as an adjective ....canadians are more likely to willingly get in line because we were instructed to do so....Americans far more likely to read the constitution to understand what the government can and cannot make them to do
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As adjectives the difference between complicit and compliantis that complicit is associated with or participating in an activity, especially one of a questionable nature while compliant is willing to comply; yielding; bending; pliant; submissive; willing to do what someone wants.
Covid restrictions are forever in Canada
https://www.canada.ca/content/dam/p...t-covid-19/vaccinated-against-covid-19-en.pdf
https://www.canada.ca/content/dam/p...t-covid-19/vaccinated-against-covid-19-en.pdf
I saw a news report the other day talking about Australia having a concert with over 100,000 people. Apparently their vaccination rates arent very high either. Yet like many other countries that managed the pandemic well, they have no real cases to worry about. Not because of vaccines, but because they took proper public health measures. A while back Michigan was having a real outbreak even though they had vaccination numbers some here were saying would solve their issues.
For sure vaccinations help, but judging by other countries its not the lack of vaccinations causing our issues but the ineffective public health measures while waiting for vaccine supply to ramp up.
For sure vaccinations help, but judging by other countries its not the lack of vaccinations causing our issues but the ineffective public health measures while waiting for vaccine supply to ramp up.
DaveMatthew
Bring in Peter
Sure. My disappointment is in the messaging. It's not rooted in fact. This statement, from Howard Njoo, deputy chief public health officer, is crap. And people are getting sick of it.
Be clear.
- This what you can do, safely, after one dose.
- This is what you can do, safely, after two doses. (Basically everything)
More and more people are getting vaccinated each day. More are getting their second dose. Give them some light at the end of the tunnel.
it's not really an apples to apples comparison though....countries like Australia and New Zealand had some distinct advantages in containing covid
DaveMatthew
Bring in Peter
This messaging of, "However, COVID-19 will not be eliminated so you will still need to follow some public health measures." is crap.
COVID will never be eliminated. In the whole of human history, only 2 diseases has been completely eradicated: smallpox and rinderpest.
Hey, everyone is tired of this thing but it doesn't change the fact that the situation is very fluid and that restrictions are being effectively changing all the time. I'm sure they have modelling for every scenario imaginable and they use the most common outcomes to deliver public health policy regarding this pandemic. Is there a messaging problem? Yes. This government has been in f***ing shambles since the day they started campaigning for provincial rule. Ever since I started tuning out Ford government press conferences and Covid updates I've found that the information has been a lot more clear. Just hang in there friend, we're so close to the end of this thing - maybe try tuning out some of these bums you see on TV and definitely don't try to compare our situation to what they're accomplishing in the US. That will definitely frustrate but ultimately we can't do anything about it.
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