Liam Maguire tells the truth about the Habs dynasty and the French-Canadian draft

[benji]

Just thought I'd post this, I didn't see anything else on it. For anyone ever bringing up the "special" draft the Habs apparently had to attempt to justify the Canadiens' dyansties.

"I hope this helps clear up any misconception. I believe this fallacy was born primarily by frustrated anti-Montreal fans who for decades suffered through parade after Stanley Cup parade." - Liam Macguire

http://www.liam.ca/ed20040319.html

Click to read more...

 

[Bear of Bad News]

I like Liam - he used to dominate my Goalie Trivia.

 

[colonel_korn]

The only thing I can think of whenever someone mentions Liam Maguire is the time he almost got into a fistfight with Gene Mack on "Off The Record"... over his choice of tie.

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

It is worth noting that the C-form system did bias towards benefitting Montreal and Toronto, as the majority of top prospects were from Ontario or Quebec and, given a choice, would sign with Montreal or Toronto.

 

[mcphee]

The only thing I can think of whenever someone mentions Liam Maguire is the time he almost got into a fistfight with Gene Mack on "Off The Record"... over his choice of tie.

Dick Irvin used to have a quiz show [antiquated term for trivia] on the Mointreal CTV affiliate, CFCF, not sure when, may have been early 70's. Liam McGuire made his name there, he thoroughly cleaned up the competition.

I saw the Mack/McGuire episode, kind of funny from what I remember. A classic example of 2 guys getting mad when both totally misunderstood what the other guy was saying. It was entertaining though.

 

[arrbez]

It is worth noting that the C-form system did bias towards benefitting Montreal and Toronto, as the majority of top prospects were from Ontario or Quebec and, given a choice, would sign with Montreal or Toronto.

True, but to take it one step further, it looks to me like the Habs had an advantage in terms of French Canadians that none of the other teams did, while many great players from Ontario went to other squads. I have nothing to back this up with, but that's my first impression, seeing how the vast majority of GREAT French Canadians in the pre-draft era played with Monreal, while the elite Ontario guys like Hull, Orr, Esposito, Kelly, Lindsay, the Bread Line, etc were dispersed throughout the league.

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

True, but to take it one step further, it looks to me like the Habs had an advantage in terms of French Canadians that none of the other teams did, while many great players from Ontario went to other squads. I have nothing to back this up with, but that's my first impression, seeing how the vast majority of GREAT French Canadians in the pre-draft era played with Monreal, while the elite Ontario guys like Hull, Orr, Esposito, Kelly, Lindsay, the Bread Line, etc were dispersed throughout the league.

English Quebecers did disperse as well. That said, I do agree, early this wasn't a big issue, but, post Richard the level of French Canadien hockey was greater than most places.

 

[JaymzB]

English Quebecers did disperse as well. That said, I do agree, early this wasn't a big issue, but, post Richard the level of French Canadien hockey was greater than most places.

But I think it should also be taking into account that the Habs had quite possibly the 2 greatest GM's ever in a row, and these men were so adept at gauging talent that they created a franchise thta was so far ahead of the pack at identifying talent, and ensuring that they would get that talent, no matter the cost.

 

[arrbez]

Speaking of english Quebecers, do they still play hockey? There hasn't been a great one in the league since Mike Bossy.

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

But I think it should also be taking into account that the Habs had quite possibly the 2 greatest GM's ever in a row, and these men were so adept at gauging talent that they created a franchise thta was so far ahead of the pack at identifying talent, and ensuring that they would get that talent, no matter the cost.

This is very true, IMO, Selke, Pollack and Torrey are the big three when it comes to GMs. But they did start from a position of strength and then used it very well. They would have won anywhere, but they won how many cups in how many years? Couldn't have repeated that with the Rangers IMO.

Speaking of english Quebecers, do they still play hockey? There hasn't been a great one in the league since Mike Bossy.

Do they still exist?

 

[arrbez]

Mathew Lombardi may be the last of a dying breed...

 

[mcphee]

But I think it should also be taking into account that the Habs had quite possibly the 2 greatest GM's ever in a row, and these men were so adept at gauging talent that they created a franchise thta was so far ahead of the pack at identifying talent, and ensuring that they would get that talent, no matter the cost.

Selke and Pollock both paid attention to detail and built entire organizations. They to a point had advantages but had the foresight to take advantage of what was in their backyard.

 

[MXD]

I like Liam - he used to dominate my Goalie Trivia.

Must awesome then... They're really tough, you know. Got a 15 last time I tried one and was like... WOW! (Carey Price helped me a lot on the matter...)

 

[mcphee]

Mathew Lombardi may be the last of a dying breed...

The way you disrespect Brandon Reid and the up and comer Angelo Esposito is an affront to all Quebec born Tetes Carees.

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

The way you disrespect Brandon Reid and the up and comer Angelo Esposito is an affront to all Quebec born Tetes Carees.

For that matter, what does Roberto Luongo qualify as?

 

[arrbez]

Appologies to Angelo, I assumed he was french. Keep an eye out for that kid, he's rocketing up the rankings, and may even be a first rounder come draft day.

 

[mcphee]

For that matter, what does Roberto Luongo qualify as?

I was half joking. I don't think kids of Italian descent are defined as either. Some are schooled in English,some French, depending on their parents schooling I guess. If your 1st language isn't English or French, they define you as an allophone, though I'm not sure the term is still used.

To the best of my knowledge, Luongo and Espisito are fluent in 3 languages.

 

[mcphee]

Mathew Lombardi may be the last of a dying breed...

PJ Stock was just below Bossy.




























In height.

 

[ilovehockey]

Speaking of english Quebecers, do they still play hockey? There hasn't been a great one in the league since Mike Bossy.

Mario Lemieux and Martin Brodeur I would consider great Quebecers after Bossy.

 

[Masao]

Mario Lemieux and Martin Brodeur I would consider great Quebecers after Bossy.

Mario didn't speak a word of english when he was a teenager...

 

[rmchahn]

True, but to take it one step further, it looks to me like the Habs had an advantage in terms of French Canadians that none of the other teams did, while many great players from Ontario went to other squads. I have nothing to back this up with, but that's my first impression, seeing how the vast majority of GREAT French Canadians in the pre-draft era played with Monreal, while the elite Ontario guys like Hull, Orr, Esposito, Kelly, Lindsay, the Bread Line, etc were dispersed throughout the league.

Jean Ratelle and Rod Gilbert would be two of the exceptions.

 

[Chili]

Dick Irvin used to have a quiz show [antiquated term for trivia] on the Mointreal CTV affiliate, CFCF, not sure when, may have been early 70's. Liam McGuire made his name there, he thoroughly cleaned up the competition.
.

Know your sports! McPhee, I was a teenager at the time and tried to get on the show without any luck. I did win our High School's version of the show (for whatever that was worth). The teacher who ran it actually did appear on the show and almost won his episode but blew it on one boxing question. He lamented that for years because he knew the answer but it came out wrong (I believe he answered flyweight instead of bantamweight to one of the weight classes).

 

[arrbez]

Jean Ratelle and Rod Gilbert would be two of the exceptions.

Yeah, no doubt there's exceptions. Marcel Pronovost as well.

 

[reckoning]

Some other Quebecers Montreal didn't get:

Pierre Pilote
Bernie Parent
Don Marcotte
Gilles Marotte

There were plenty of top-notch French players that other teams could've had. Frank Selke simply worked harder than the other GMs.

 

[mcphee]

Some other Quebecers Montreal didn't get:

Pierre Pilote
Bernie Parent
Don Marcotte
Gilles Marotte

There were plenty of top-notch French players that other teams could've had. Frank Selke simply worked harder than the other GMs.

Isn't Don Marcotte a Franco Ontarian ? Guess I could look it up, but I thought he was.