Let's Talk About Hockey (Dawn of the Professional Era)

[Shibby1984]

Chronicling the history of the sport of ice hockey, from the beginning to the present day.

In this episode our journey through the evolution of the game continues with the first 24 years following the introduction of the Stanley Cup, including the multiple major leagues that sprung up all over North America and hockey's shift from an amateur sport to a professional one.

[blip]h8RkgtO3fQA[/blip]​

Click to read more...

 

[jkrx]

A very good history lesson. Keep it up.

 

[Shibby1984]

A very good history lesson. Keep it up.

Thank you. I have to say that the stories about the Colored Hockey League and the Ottawa Silver Seven were the most interesting to research.

 

[jkrx]

Thank you. I have to say that the stories about the Colored Hockey League and the Ottawa Silver Seven were the most interesting to research.

Yes, I heard some of it before. Would be very intresting if there is more to either watch or read about. Going to pick up the book that you talked about.

 

[SidGenoMario]

Oh.

My.

God.

You had me right from the beginning with the Blades of Steel reference.

 

[Shibby1984]

Yes, I heard some of it before. Would be very intresting if there is more to either watch or read about. Going to pick up the book that you talked about.

There was a segment done about the CHL on ESPN a while back.

 

[jkrx]

There was a segment done about the CHL on ESPN a while back.

Thank you, much appreciated.

 

[Iain Fyffe]

It's a good effort, but you have some inaccuracies in there.

1. The IPHL was not the first pro league in the US, and it was not the IPHL. It was the IHL, and the WPHL (which you mention) was fully professional before the IHL came into being.

2. The OPHL was not the first pro league in Canada. That was the Manitoba Hockey League (which was never called the MPHL), which turned pro in 1906-07, a year before the OPHL came into being. Your omission of the MHL from the list of leagues at the time is also puzzling, considering the Thistles and Winnipeg Vics both won Stanley Cup, and Brandon also challenged once as I recall.

3. The name "Silver Seven" was almost never used at the time for the Ottawa team, it is a retroactive name applied by later writers.

4. Joe Malone is the only NHL player to score two goals per game in a season, but the list of players who did it in the NHA like Malone is quite long, including Malone's teammate Tommy Smith, Newsy Lalonde (pronounced la-lond), Marty Walsh, Ernie Russell, Harry Smith, Harry Hyland, Bruce Stuart, Dubby Kerr and Frank Nighbor. Pre-NHA, Russell Bowie averaged over three goals per game for his entire career.

5. I believe the Cyclone Taylor backwards goal story has been debunked.

6. I doubt the first slapshot was used in the CHL. In the game's early days shots were made like in field hockey, using their short sticks to whack at the puck. The wrist shot was actually considered an innovation when it came into use as longer sticks came into play.

 

[BigFatCat999]

I always wondered how the Halifax explosion of 1917 effected the colored hockey league.

 

[Shibby1984]

It's a good effort, but you have some inaccuracies in there.

1. The IPHL was not the first pro league in the US, and it was not the IPHL. It was the IHL, and the WPHL (which you mention) was fully professional before the IHL came into being.

2. The OPHL was not the first pro league in Canada. That was the Manitoba Hockey League (which was never called the MPHL), which turned pro in 1906-07, a year before the OPHL came into being. Your omission of the MHL from the list of leagues at the time is also puzzling, considering the Thistles and Winnipeg Vics both won Stanley Cup, and Brandon also challenged once as I recall.

3. The name "Silver Seven" was almost never used at the time for the Ottawa team, it is a retroactive name applied by later writers.

4. Joe Malone is the only NHL player to score two goals per game in a season, but the list of players who did it in the NHA like Malone is quite long, including Malone's teammate Tommy Smith, Newsy Lalonde (pronounced la-lond), Marty Walsh, Ernie Russell, Harry Smith, Harry Hyland, Bruce Stuart, Dubby Kerr and Frank Nighbor. Pre-NHA, Russell Bowie averaged over three goals per game for his entire career.

5. I believe the Cyclone Taylor backwards goal story has been debunked.

6. I doubt the first slapshot was used in the CHL. In the game's early days shots were made like in field hockey, using their short sticks to whack at the puck. The wrist shot was actually considered an innovation when it came into use as longer sticks came into play.

1. While there were some leagues that were in all reality professional before the IHL (which I had seen referred to as the IPHL in some texts and the IHL in others, so I may have just chosen the wrong one), those other leagues kind of kept it under the table, where as the IHL was the first one to pay its players openly. So that was probably a wording mistake on my part.

2. I was never able to find a complete list of major leagues in operation during this time period, so I attempted to put one together as best as I could. I apologize for missing that one. Also, like the IHL, I had seen texts referring to the MHL as the MPHL, so again I just picked the wrong one I guess.

3. Oops.

4. Firstly, sorry for the mispronunciation of Lalonde's name (I'm not the best at looking at a name and pronouncing it correctly). Secondly, I guess the references that I used were lacking, since while they do mention those other players, they never mentioned them accomplishing the same feat as Malone, so once again I apologize for the inaccuracies there.

5. This I did not know. The tale was in all of the references that I used and I did not find details anywhere that contradicted it.

6. I did not mean to say that the slapshot was for a fact first used in the CHL, just that in that particular book I reference that was one thing that the authors claimed about the league.


Thanks for the feedback.

 

[Hardyvan123]

good stuff although I wonder what players (and fans) from that time would think of the game today and if they ever imagined it becoming the game that is is today.

 

[Iain Fyffe]

1. While there were some leagues that were in all reality professional before the IHL (which I had seen referred to as the IPHL in some texts and the IHL in others, so I may have just chosen the wrong one), those other leagues kind of kept it under the table, where as the IHL was the first one to pay its players openly. So that was probably a wording mistake on my part.

The WPHL was one of those "shamateur" leagues, paying players under the table or by providing jobs in Pittsburgh for the Canadian players. But Harry Peel openly admitted to being paid, and when the OHA professionalized all players who played with him or against him, the WPHL magnates basically said "screw it" and went fully pro.

This is not common knowledge, even among hockey historians. But it is the case.

2. I was never able to find a complete list of major leagues in operation during this time period, so I attempted to put one together as best as I could. I apologize for missing that one. Also, like the IHL, I had seen texts referring to the MHL as the MPHL, so again I just picked the wrong one I guess.

It's only recently that the 'P' has been removed from the IPHL and MPHL names - those names had always been revisionist history. There's no accepted list of "major" leagues from this time period, partly because that concept really didn't exist yet.

3. Oops.

Once again, that's a recent revelation in historical research. Not commonly known.

4. Firstly, sorry for the mispronunciation of Lalonde's name (I'm not the best at looking at a name and pronouncing it correctly). Secondly, I guess the references that I used were lacking, since while they do mention those other players, they never mentioned them accomplishing the same feat as Malone, so once again I apologize for the inaccuracies there.

That's probably because most sources consider anything that happened before 1917-18 to not really count. Like I said Joe Malone was the only player to do that in the NHL, and he also did it in the NHA a couple of times. But the switch from the NHA to the NHL is an arbitrary line, and it's a shame that so many use it as a hard dividing point.

6. I did not mean to say that the slapshot was for a fact first used in the CHL, just that in that particular book I reference that was one thing that the authors claimed about the league.

I didn't mean to imply you did assert that. But that claim is like many made about hockey history: unsubstantiated. People like to attribute "firsts" to whatever league they're promoting, or what have you. The list of defencemen claimed to be the "first" rushing defenceman is quite long, for instance. Jack Grant, Lester Patrick, Magnus Flett, etc, etc. Defencemen have always been rushing the puck, of course, since the game did not allow forward passing at its beginnings.

 

[Pens75]

The IPHL was not the first pro league in the US

Actually is was...

http://hfboards.com/showthread.php?t=481917

and the WPHL was fully professional before the IHL came into being.

It was "semi" professional.

People like to attribute "firsts" to whatever league they're promoting, or what have you. The list of defencemen claimed to be the "first" rushing defenceman is quite long, for instance. Jack Grant, Lester Patrick, Magnus Flett, etc, etc. Defencemen have always been rushing the puck, of course, since the game did not allow forward passing at its beginnings.

Plently of "firsts" to go around...

Pittsburgh, who finished third in the seven-team NHL, lost to the Maroons, 3-1, in the opener here and tied, 3-3, in Montreal. The Maroons' 6-4 edge in goals gave them the series and they went on to win the 1926 Stanley Cup. The Pirates made the playoffs again the following year but their quality of play deteriorated throughout the 1920s.

Odie Cleghorne, the Pirates' coach (and occasional player) for the first four seasons, was the first NHL coach to change his players on the fly. This was an in-genius idea. He was also the first coach to use three set forward lines, which was a huge change from the standard, which was to simply leave the best players out for as long as possible.

Pittsburgh:

- 1st Premier artificial ice rinks in late 1800’s (The Casino & Duquesne Gardens)
- 1st United States Team (United States Amateur Team 1897)
- 1st Semi-Pro League (Western Pennsylvania Hockey League 1901-04)
- 1st Professional League (International Professional Hockey League 1904-07)
- 1st City to field a professional hockey team of all the current NHL cities