Let's fantasize about Bobby Orr.

[seventieslord]

Bobby Orr is still considered the greatest defenseman of all-time, and for good reason. No need to state the whole bucket of reasons. I was thinking today, what would his career offensive numbers look like if his career had not been derailed by injuries starting in 1975? Go ahead and make your projections.

Now I wouldn't expect him to play 22 years and 1600 games like Bourque. For whatever reason, the generation that began from 1978-1984 seems to be the one that did this with regularity. I would think he'd have a career path more similar to Brad Park, who started just two years after Orr. I'm also making the assumption that if he remained healthy, he would have been a lifelong Bruin. I also don't think he would play forever for no good reason, he'd do like Lemieux and retire even though he could still play, just not at the elite level he was used to.

Here's mine:

1966-67 Boston Bruins NHL 61 13 28 41
1967-68 Boston Bruins NHL 46 11 20 31
1968-69 Boston Bruins NHL 67 21 43 64
1969-70 Boston Bruins NHL 76 33 87 120
1970-71 Boston Bruins NHL 78 37 102 139
1971-72 Boston Bruins NHL 76 37 80 117
1972-73 Boston Bruins NHL 63 29 72 101
1973-74 Boston Bruins NHL 74 32 90 122
1974-75 Boston Bruins NHL 80 46 89 135
1975-76 Boston Bruins NHL 80 45 105 150
1976-77 Boston Bruins NHL 72 39 88 127
1977-78 Boston Bruins NHL 75 37 92 129
1978-79 Boston Bruins NHL 69 30 80 110
1979-80 Boston Bruins NHL 78 34 85 119
1980-81 Boston Bruins NHL 65 25 65 90
1981-82 Boston Bruins NHL 70 18 62 80
1982-83 Boston Bruins NHL 73 16 60 76
1983-84 Boston Bruins NHL 65 14 55 69
1984-85 Boston Bruins NHL 50 8 40 48
Career Totals after 19 seasons, retiring at age 37:
NHL Totals 1273 525 1343 1868

He would pass Gordie Howe for 1st all-time in points in his 30th game in 84-85. Just four years later, Wayne Gretzky would pass him, and 15 more years later, Mark Messier would squeak by. There would be no debate about the best player of all-time, as the only thing that holds Orr back in reality is his longevity - whether you believe this is fair or not... I personally do.

Comments?

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[Nalyd Psycho]

I just fantasize about Orr and Gretzky sharing the ice at the '84 Canada cup...

 

[RUSqueelin*]

I just fantasize about Orr and Gretzky sharing the ice at the '84 Canada cup...

What about 81? Canada would have likely won with a healthy Orr rather then getting pummeled in the final.

I'll go for a simple fantacy. I'll waiting the the day that the NHL network actually shows games from the 70's (aka Bruins) on the classic games show - or vintage games show - rather the a 2003 playoff game between the Leafs and Flyers which to them is apparently classic hockey.


The numbers listed above are very realistic projection of what ifs.

 

[Ogopogo*]

What about 81? Canada would have likely won with a healthy Orr rather then getting pummeled in the final.

.

Are you kidding me? If Orr couldn't lead the '71 Bruins (8 of the top 10 scorers in the NHL) to victory over a rookie goalie, how on earth could he overturn an 8-1 thrashing against the Russians?

Orr was good but only Christ could turn that one around.

 

[Psycho Papa Joe]

Are you kidding me? If Orr couldn't lead the '71 Bruins (8 of the top 10 scorers in the NHL) to victory over a rookie goalie, how on earth could he overturn an 8-1 thrashing against the Russians?

Orr was good but only Christ could turn that one around.

Not having Mike Liut in net and letting the game get out of hand would have been better for Canada.

 

[RUSqueelin*]

Are you kidding me? If Orr couldn't lead the '71 Bruins (8 of the top 10 scorers in the NHL) to victory over a rookie goalie, how on earth could he overturn an 8-1 thrashing against the Russians?

Orr was good but only Christ could turn that one around.

You are correct. If Gretzky, the greatest player in history, couldn't help Canada in that game, there was no hope.

 

[mytor4*]

lets not.

 

[Stonefly]

You are correct. If Gretzky, the greatest player in history, couldn't help Canada in that game, there was no hope.

Well.....considering Orr's legendary ability to block shots....
and considering his offensive capabilities he very well could have made the difference. It's not out of the question. Or it may have been closer at least.

 

[Stonefly]

Are you kidding me? If Orr couldn't lead the '71 Bruins (8 of the top 10 scorers in the NHL) to victory over a rookie goalie, how on earth could he overturn an 8-1 thrashing against the Russians?

Orr was good but only Christ could turn that one around.

Why do you keep placing the blame for this on Orr's shoulders? You've said it numerous times. You can't possibly believe that it's his fault.

 

[Devilhawk]

Orr played in such pain near the end of his career those years are unfair and shouldn't even be looked at.

To me and many others, he was the greatest player on both ends of the ice who ever played.

 

[SuddentheSwede]

Lidström>Orr

It comes a time when one must realise that the present has passed the past. Good bye mr. Orr.

 

[Chief Jokinen]

Lidström>Orr

It comes a time when one must realise that the present has passed the past. Good bye mr. Orr.

Well, thats funny. Sure meant it that way?

 

[SuddentheSwede]

Seems like I ****ed up. Should I shoot myself or simply cut my wrists?

 

[Masao]

I only wish we could have seen him in 72 against russia

 

[Bruins420]

i cant agree with those numbers at all those numbers are of an injured orr you said he was uninjured i can't see bobby orr in his prime at 30-34 not putting up better numbers than that especially druing the 80's when anybody could score. His numbers would of been a whole lot better than that especially with the talent that was there in boston during those times. i beleive he would of come a lot closer to 200 pts for a few more seasons than what you have down and i could see his highest point total around 176 for a two years or more. now for the lidstrom > orr response do me a favor don't respond here again until lidstrom has two seasons of a hundred points or more. we are talking greatest defensemen ever yeah lidstrom is great defensively but don't for a moment stop and think that a defensemen is just suppose to play defense. and i would love to see lidstrom kill off powerplays single handedly than skate down and pop one in the net on a somewhat constant basis. Lidstrom is great at a lot of areas of a defensemen but is not the full package like bobby fn orr.

 

[SuddentheSwede]

Bruins420, I hate to break it to ya, but your wrong, Lidström is better.

The great book of hockey says so.


On a more serious note I have no idea which of them is better. I just prefer Lidström.

 

[arrbez]

Bruins420, I hate to break it to ya, but your wrong, Lidström is better.

The great book of hockey says so.


On a more serious note I have no idea which of them is better. I just prefer Lidström.

Bobby Orr won 8 straight Norris trophies, 3 straight Harts, 2 Conn Smyths, and won the scoring title twice. What on earth would lead you to believe that Nicklas Lidstrom is better?

 

[Masao]

Bobby Orr won 8 straight Norris trophies, 3 straight Harts, 2 Conn Smyths, and won the scoring title twice. What on earth would lead you to believe that Nicklas Lidstrom is better?

Du gamla, du fria, etc.

 

[Weztex]

Bobby Orr won 8 straight Norris trophies, 3 straight Harts, 2 Conn Smyths, and won the scoring title twice. What on earth would lead you to believe that Nicklas Lidstrom is better?

Maurice ''Rocket'' Richard 965 pts
Brian ''Rocket'' Bellows 1022 pts

''Rocket'' Bellows > ''Rocket'' Richard

Don't try to argue with SuddentheSwede's logic. It is irefutable.

 

[Wisent]

Not having Mike Liut in net and letting the game get out of hand would have been better for Canada.

Off topic, but that loss was not Liut`s fault.

 

[SuddentheSwede]

Orr is 59 years old. Even I could beat him.

Of course if were comparing them at their best, I'd still say Lidström was better. Better passer, shooter, defensively, puck handler, fighting, you know I wouldn't be surprised if Lidström was a better goal tender.

Your Canadian bias is really hurting this discussion =/

 

[dafoomie]

Imagine this.

Bobby Orr, Ray Bourque, and Brad Park, on the same team. Guys like Brad McCrimmon, Mike O'Connell, and Mike Milbury would round out the bottom 3. Could've been the best defense of all time.

 

[Pwnasaurus]

Bobby Orr is still considered the greatest defenseman of all-time, and for good reason. No need to state the whole bucket of reasons. I was thinking today, what would his career offensive numbers look like if his career had not been derailed by injuries starting in 1975? Go ahead and make your projections.

Now I wouldn't expect him to play 22 years and 1600 games like Bourque. For whatever reason, the generation that began from 1978-1984 seems to be the one that did this with regularity. I would think he'd have a career path more similar to Brad Park, who started just two years after Orr. I'm also making the assumption that if he remained healthy, he would have been a lifelong Bruin. I also don't think he would play forever for no good reason, he'd do like Lemieux and retire even though he could still play, just not at the elite level he was used to.

Here's mine:

1966-67 Boston Bruins NHL 61 13 28 41
1967-68 Boston Bruins NHL 46 11 20 31
1968-69 Boston Bruins NHL 67 21 43 64
1969-70 Boston Bruins NHL 76 33 87 120
1970-71 Boston Bruins NHL 78 37 102 139
1971-72 Boston Bruins NHL 76 37 80 117
1972-73 Boston Bruins NHL 63 29 72 101
1973-74 Boston Bruins NHL 74 32 90 122
1974-75 Boston Bruins NHL 80 46 89 135
1975-76 Boston Bruins NHL 80 45 105 150
1976-77 Boston Bruins NHL 72 39 88 127
1977-78 Boston Bruins NHL 75 37 92 129
1978-79 Boston Bruins NHL 69 30 80 110
1979-80 Boston Bruins NHL 78 34 85 119
1980-81 Boston Bruins NHL 65 25 65 90
1981-82 Boston Bruins NHL 70 18 62 80
1982-83 Boston Bruins NHL 73 16 60 76
1983-84 Boston Bruins NHL 65 14 55 69
1984-85 Boston Bruins NHL 50 8 40 48
Career Totals after 19 seasons, retiring at age 37:
NHL Totals 1273 525 1343 1868

He would pass Gordie Howe for 1st all-time in points in his 30th game in 84-85. Just four years later, Wayne Gretzky would pass him, and 15 more years later, Mark Messier would squeak by. There would be no debate about the best player of all-time, as the only thing that holds Orr back in reality is his longevity - whether you believe this is fair or not... I personally do.

Comments?

I don't see a healthy Orr in 75-76 putting up the best numbers of his career after the Espo trade. Sure Ratelle played well but Park would snipe up some of the blueline scoring from Bobby me thinks.

 

[Weztex]

Orr is 59 years old. Even I could beat him.

Of course if were comparing them at their best, I'd still say Lidström was better. Better passer, shooter, defensively, puck handler, fighting, you know I wouldn't be surprised if Lidström was a better goal tender.

Your Canadian bias is really hurting this discussion =/

You're the one talking about bias??? Maybe you're having multifocal glass, one side for Sweden, the other for the 21th century.

Lidstrom is my favorite current NHL player by far but saying he's better than Orr is like saying Jagr is better than Gretzky. Anyway I'm too lazy to go on again...books and films are there for that.

 

[SuddentheSwede]

OK, let's look at it this way. Long-term effects. Lidström plays for Detroit, where are they now? Orr played for Boston Bruins, where are they now?

Yeah that's what I thought.