LeBrun: LeBrun sees Vegas, Toronto and Calgary as best landing spots for Pietrangelo

[A1LeafNation]

Wonder what he takes:

8m x 8 years no signing bonus money from STL

Or

9m x 7 years with 45m in signing bonus money in 24 months with the Leafs.

 

[seanlinden]

Lavoie really does have a point that I think far too often, hockey players are conditioned not to do because it has the perception of deflating salaries for their peers -- for AP, really what is the difference between $7m a season and $9m a season?

Yes, it's $14m, but it's $14m on career earnings of roughly $100m. The guy is going to be exorbitantly wealthy regardless.

I get why the young guys (Matthews / Marner) had to push for the money they did. Yes, they're premier players likely to get an even bigger 3rd contract, but they can also be 1-2 injuries away from losing the ability to set themselves up for life. Tavares took/got $11m, because at the time, there was no justifyable reason to not give him $11m.

If you're Alex Pietrangelo.... it seems like you've got 6 reasonable choices....

St. Louis - Where you have won a cup, are the captain of the team, the city you've called home your entire career and where your wife and her family are from. A team that will likely remain competitive throughout a long contract... but you've got an old-school GM who you feel has disrespected you, and isn't necessarily prepared to give you complete trade / movement protection, and isn't prepared to budge on his stance of no bonuses.

Toronto - A very exciting and dynamic team with some of the best young players in the game. A team that will almost certainly be legitimate cup contenders for the majority of your contract.
Where you grew up and your family lives, a beneficiary of the Eastern conference travel schedule. You'll get whatever bonus structure you can cook up, and full no-move protection, but you're going to have to "live" with likely one of the lowest AAV offers, and a situation where it's not that there's 1 guy on the team who makes a little more than you -- there are 3 that make a lot more than you... maybe that's something he's into after being the captain of the Blues for so long... similar to what Ryan McDonagh did in Tampa. A high-pressure market, where he doesn't necessarily have to take that burden.

Vegas - Structured similar to St. Louis in that they're a team without exciting starpower, but play a really solid game and should be competitive for a very long time. They're not as AAV-restricted as Toronto, and there's lots of take-home money with no state tax. You will instantly become their franchise defenceman. From a lifestyle perspective, warm weather -- maybe a place that your wife's parents come with you. They'll likely give you all the trade protection you'd like.

Calgary - Have the cap flexibility and need to give you a big AAV contract likely in the realm of Roman Josi... not a great team though.

Colorado: Arguably the best team with your addition, very likely Stanley Cup contenders and likely the 2nd best forward in the world, along with a couple of other really good young players. May not have the financial wherewithal to give you the big signing bonuses, long term, and full NMC that you're likely to want.

Boston: A team with a track record of success, and the cap flexibility to make things happen similar to Calgary. The question is with so many of their core pieces being players that are older than you -- are you signing yourself up for a team that could find themselves rebuilding?

Overall, obviously, I'm not Alex Pietrangelo, but with such quality options, and having so much money already in the bank / so much coming my way, I can't imagine how you make this decision based on money... you've got a cup, you've got 4 kids, you're going to be at $100m in career earnings. He has deep roots in both St. Louis & Toronto -- I don't believe he's going to throw a 3rd city in there, and I don't believe he's going to sign a deal where there's any chance of him getting moved short of a buyout.

 

[seanlinden]

Wonder what he takes:

8m x 8 years no signing bonus money from STL

Or

9m x 7 years with 45m in signing bonus money in 24 months with the Leafs.

The Leafs cannot afford to give him $9m in AAV.

Realistically, with the decision to stop negotiating with St. Louis, the 8 years is probably off the table... the money is probably going to be less from the Leafs than the Blues... but it will be delivered in signing bonus form and with a full NMC.

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

Looking back at the cup winners since 07/08 (cap information for 05/06 and 06/07 is limited), the cap percentage taken up by the 7 highest paid players who played in at least half of the playoff games on each club averaged out to be ~59.39% and maxed out at ~65.78% (15/16 Penguins). A $9 mil Pietrangelo puts Toronto's 7 at ~73.75%.

 

[seanlinden]

Pietro is gonna go from a consensus top 5 dman to fringe top 20 dman the minute he signs with Toronto (if that happens)

JT was vited the 4th best C in the league in a poll prior to signing with the leafs yet people on here talk about a guy that had 47g/88pts his first year like he is a cap dump lol.


Kerfoot and Johnsson out for cap space, maybe even one of Dermott/Holl as well.

Sign a few vets cheap to play bottom 6 roles (Thornton, Spezza, Simmonds etc)
They will have the money to make Pietro happen if he wants to go to TO

Pietro is not a consensus top 5 dman.

Yes, he was ranked 4th this year in Norris Voting, last year he didn't receive a single vote. Objectively, Josi/Carlson/Hedman all rank ahead of him. Doughty & Karlsson too, even though they did not have the best years.

Pietrangelo IMO falls into a group that includes Jones, Rielly, Hamilton, Slavin, Klingberg, OEL, McDonagh, Weber, Giordano & Burns. He might rank as high as 6.

In the coming years, you've got Rasmus Dahlin, Cale Makar, Quinn Hughes, Miro Heiskanen, Zach Werenski, Thomas Chabot, Aaron Ekblad, Shea Theodore, and Charlie McAvoy who all have youth on their side.

 

[BB88]

Pietro is gonna go from a consensus top 5 dman to fringe top 20 dman the minute he signs with Toronto (if that happens)

JT was vited the 4th best C in the league in a poll prior to signing with the leafs yet people on here talk about a guy that had 47g/88pts his first year like he is a cap dump lol.


Kerfoot and Johnsson out for cap space, maybe even one of Dermott/Holl as well.

Sign a few vets cheap to play bottom 6 roles (Thornton, Spezza, Simmonds etc)
They will have the money to make Pietro happen if he wants to go to TO

What bargain goalie will you have in net?

& Slow bottom6 really isn't a huge threat

 

[jetsforever]

I swear if he goes to Vegas...

 

[voyageur]

I swear if he goes to Vegas...

I can see it. I remember Stastny saying there were 2 Blues at his wedding party, Pietrangelo and Steen. Albeit Stastny is only there for one more year, but maybe he re-signs at a lesser value. Reaves is there too.

Maybe Pietrangelo takes $7.5 million over 7 years, front loaded. The lost income, in the Blues offer, is made up by living in a state with no personal income taxes.

Knights would have to move Fleury to sign Lehner, but I could see him back in Pittsburgh, with Tristan Jarry. Pens haven't won a Cup since Fleury left.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Star players are more fun to watch than depth guys

I can tell you right now it was way more exciting seeing Kiviranta get a hattrick than Pavelski. So no this is not entirely true

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Look at the bottom 6 the Avs ran out last year, nobody said that was an issue. Dubas can easily replicate that with a combination of Euro free agents (Mikheyev, Barabanov), drafting (Robertson), and smart FA Adds (Spezza).

What? Did the Avs win the cup and I wasn't aware of it? Literally the main talk about the Avs right now is how bad their 3rd line was.

 

[Ledge And Dairy]

Lavoie really does have a point that I think far too often, hockey players are conditioned not to do because it has the perception of deflating salaries for their peers -- for AP, really what is the difference between $7m a season and $9m a season?

Yes, it's $14m, but it's $14m on career earnings of roughly $100m. The guy is going to be exorbitantly wealthy regardless.

I get why the young guys (Matthews / Marner) had to push for the money they did. Yes, they're premier players likely to get an even bigger 3rd contract, but they can also be 1-2 injuries away from losing the ability to set themselves up for life. Tavares took/got $11m, because at the time, there was no justifyable reason to not give him $11m.

If you're Alex Pietrangelo.... it seems like you've got 6 reasonable choices....

St. Louis - Where you have won a cup, are the captain of the team, the city you've called home your entire career and where your wife and her family are from. A team that will likely remain competitive throughout a long contract... but you've got an old-school GM who you feel has disrespected you, and isn't necessarily prepared to give you complete trade / movement protection, and isn't prepared to budge on his stance of no bonuses.

Toronto - A very exciting and dynamic team with some of the best young players in the game. A team that will almost certainly be legitimate cup contenders for the majority of your contract.
Where you grew up and your family lives, a beneficiary of the Eastern conference travel schedule. You'll get whatever bonus structure you can cook up, and full no-move protection, but you're going to have to "live" with likely one of the lowest AAV offers, and a situation where it's not that there's 1 guy on the team who makes a little more than you -- there are 3 that make a lot more than you... maybe that's something he's into after being the captain of the Blues for so long... similar to what Ryan McDonagh did in Tampa. A high-pressure market, where he doesn't necessarily have to take that burden.

Vegas - Structured similar to St. Louis in that they're a team without exciting starpower, but play a really solid game and should be competitive for a very long time. They're not as AAV-restricted as Toronto, and there's lots of take-home money with no state tax. You will instantly become their franchise defenceman. From a lifestyle perspective, warm weather -- maybe a place that your wife's parents come with you. They'll likely give you all the trade protection you'd like.

Calgary - Have the cap flexibility and need to give you a big AAV contract likely in the realm of Roman Josi... not a great team though.

Colorado: Arguably the best team with your addition, very likely Stanley Cup contenders and likely the 2nd best forward in the world, along with a couple of other really good young players. May not have the financial wherewithal to give you the big signing bonuses, long term, and full NMC that you're likely to want.

Boston: A team with a track record of success, and the cap flexibility to make things happen similar to Calgary. The question is with so many of their core pieces being players that are older than you -- are you signing yourself up for a team that could find themselves rebuilding?

Overall, obviously, I'm not Alex Pietrangelo, but with such quality options, and having so much money already in the bank / so much coming my way, I can't imagine how you make this decision based on money... you've got a cup, you've got 4 kids, you're going to be at $100m in career earnings. He has deep roots in both St. Louis & Toronto -- I don't believe he's going to throw a 3rd city in there, and I don't believe he's going to sign a deal where there's any chance of him getting moved short of a buyout.

Agreed with everything except this. Calgary has a very young core with 2 of the best wingers in the league as well as a really young, high potential up and coming D-core but are missing that anchor on the right side. 1 year ago they were first in the West and this year clearly underachieved. Calling them not a great team but not saying the same about Toronto is just biased.

 

[BB88]

What? Did the Avs win the cup and I wasn't aware of it? Literally the main talk about the Avs right now is how bad their 3rd line was.

Yeah the big issue was secondary scoring after the big guys

 

[Islay1989]

What? Did the Avs win the cup and I wasn't aware of it? Literally the main talk about the Avs right now is how bad their 3rd line was.

Their 3rd line center was the problem, other pieces are there up front. And no one would be talking about Compher had their goalies been able to stop a beach ball.

 

[McTonyBrar]

Lavoie really does have a point that I think far too often, hockey players are conditioned not to do because it has the perception of deflating salaries for their peers -- for AP, really what is the difference between $7m a season and $9m a season?

Yes, it's $14m, but it's $14m on career earnings of roughly $100m. The guy is going to be exorbitantly wealthy regardless.

I get why the young guys (Matthews / Marner) had to push for the money they did. Yes, they're premier players likely to get an even bigger 3rd contract, but they can also be 1-2 injuries away from losing the ability to set themselves up for life. Tavares took/got $11m, because at the time, there was no justifyable reason to not give him $11m.

If you're Alex Pietrangelo.... it seems like you've got 6 reasonable choices....

St. Louis - Where you have won a cup, are the captain of the team, the city you've called home your entire career and where your wife and her family are from. A team that will likely remain competitive throughout a long contract... but you've got an old-school GM who you feel has disrespected you, and isn't necessarily prepared to give you complete trade / movement protection, and isn't prepared to budge on his stance of no bonuses.

Toronto - A very exciting and dynamic team with some of the best young players in the game. A team that will almost certainly be legitimate cup contenders for the majority of your contract.
Where you grew up and your family lives, a beneficiary of the Eastern conference travel schedule. You'll get whatever bonus structure you can cook up, and full no-move protection, but you're going to have to "live" with likely one of the lowest AAV offers, and a situation where it's not that there's 1 guy on the team who makes a little more than you -- there are 3 that make a lot more than you... maybe that's something he's into after being the captain of the Blues for so long... similar to what Ryan McDonagh did in Tampa. A high-pressure market, where he doesn't necessarily have to take that burden.

Vegas - Structured similar to St. Louis in that they're a team without exciting starpower, but play a really solid game and should be competitive for a very long time. They're not as AAV-restricted as Toronto, and there's lots of take-home money with no state tax. You will instantly become their franchise defenceman. From a lifestyle perspective, warm weather -- maybe a place that your wife's parents come with you. They'll likely give you all the trade protection you'd like.

Calgary - Have the cap flexibility and need to give you a big AAV contract likely in the realm of Roman Josi... not a great team though.

Colorado: Arguably the best team with your addition, very likely Stanley Cup contenders and likely the 2nd best forward in the world, along with a couple of other really good young players. May not have the financial wherewithal to give you the big signing bonuses, long term, and full NMC that you're likely to want.

Boston: A team with a track record of success, and the cap flexibility to make things happen similar to Calgary. The question is with so many of their core pieces being players that are older than you -- are you signing yourself up for a team that could find themselves rebuilding?

Overall, obviously, I'm not Alex Pietrangelo, but with such quality options, and having so much money already in the bank / so much coming my way, I can't imagine how you make this decision based on money... you've got a cup, you've got 4 kids, you're going to be at $100m in career earnings. He has deep roots in both St. Louis & Toronto -- I don't believe he's going to throw a 3rd city in there, and I don't believe he's going to sign a deal where there's any chance of him getting moved short of a buyout.

50 million into 5 players. Hell, what team can't win with that right?..

 

[BB88]

Their 3rd line center was the problem, other pieces are there up front. And no one would be talking about Compher had their goalies been able to stop a beach ball.

Isn’t that Torontos style as well, get the cheapest goalie out there once Pietro is signed?

On top of what 7-9 league min. contracts, team build for long playoff runs

 

[Islay1989]

Yeah the big issue was secondary scoring after the big guys

No, it wasn't. Why do people make stuff up? The big issue was the goalie not being able to crack .9%. How can someone claim a team with 5 guys over ppg, another one just barely below, plus a bunch of others who factored in on the scoresheet lacks secondary scoring is beyond me, just boggles the mind. Compher getting caved in defensively at center was the problem (still had 8 in 15), Francouz playing injured and posting .892 was the problem, being forced to play a 3rd stringer was a problem, their best PKers getting injured was the problem. They scored 29 goals against Dallas, 22 against the Yotes, had 17 different goalscorers, with 12 of them having scored at least 2 goals, 3 guys with 3 goals, 2 with 4, 2 with 7 and two more with 9. Secondary scoring? What on earth are you on about?

PS

To further add to the secondary scoring "woes" out of all the skaters that dressed only 6 haven't scored a goal, EJ (9 games), Cole (15 games), Connauton ( 4 games), Timmins (2 games), O'Connor (4 games), Dries (1 game). So 4 defensemen, two of which 3rd pairing ones with 6 games between them and two 4th liners with 5 games between them. Truly woeful.

 

[Islay1989]

Isn’t that Torontos style as well, get the cheapest goalie out there once Pietro is signed?

On top of what 7-9 league min. contracts, team build for long playoff runs

They have Grubauer who did pretty damn good before the injury, Francouz was great in the regular season and got injured as well, so again, what are you on about? I mean I get it, he will sign in Boston. Is that what you want to hear?

 

[BB88]

They have Grubauer who did pretty damn good before the injury, Francouz was great in the regular season and got injured as well, so again, what are you on about? I mean I get it, he will sign in Boston. Is that what you want to hear?

Go check the games that mattered.

You can sign him but know that you have 7 guys eating 60M of the cap then, with no starting goalie

Good luck with long playoff runs

 

[Islay1989]

Go check the games that mattered.

You can sign him but know that you have 7 guys eating 60M of the cap then, with no starting goalie

Good luck with long playoff runs

Games that mattered? Which game doesn't matter in the playoffs? Riddle me that.

Game 3 against the Stars was won by goals from Burakovsky, Zadorov and Landeskog. Game 4 won by goals from Burakovsky x2, Bellemare, MacKinnon, Kadri, Rantanen. Game 6, Zadorov, Rantanen, Makra, Mackinnon, and in game 7 they got goals from Burakovsky, Namestikov x2 and Kadri. The games they didn't get on the scoresheet was game 1 and 2. Do you know how many teams had 17 different goalscorers? Three. Avs, Islanders (who played 7 more games) and Dallas who has 9 more games played. Tampa has 16 goalscorers yet no one is creating inane narratives about them needing secondary scoring. Stop posting nonsense.

And if the Avs have secondary scoring woes what is the Bruins situation with the secondary scoring who had 11 different goalcorers, 4 of which had only one goal to their name, or the fact that they had 12 guys who did nothing offensively despite the fact that 11 of them played 5 or more games? A calamity of gigantic proportions?

 

[Ciao]

As many of my fellow Flames fans have mentioned, it's unlikely we get AP. If he moves, Toronto is likely higher on the list.

But that being said, as many have already sorta touched on, Calgary is a very legitimate dark horse from the roster to off ice stuff.

The winters here aren't bad assuming the warm Chinook winds don't give you migraines. The dry cold is far more manageable than humid cold. For instance, I have friends in Vancouver who compare 0C to around -15C in Calgary for how cold they feel. That's the difference for humid vs dry cold.

Calgary and St Louis have non stop links with one another for quite a while. MacInnis and the Tkachuks probably be strong promoters of the city someone like Brouwer might be too.

The Calgary group often have been mentioned as being a very tight group of the ice and a lot of the wives hang out and help each other out. I think this is similar to how tight knit the wives group is in STL.

Calgary does a ton relating to off ice charities and community engagement which seems like is something that is important to AP.

Roster wise, there's an opening for AP on the Flames core with Brodie and Hamonic likely leaving, but he wouldn't be immediately tasked with all the heavy lifting like on a team like Toronto. That's pretty big in terms of differences in pressure.


Again, we Flames fans understand that AP to the Flames is an absolute pipe dream. But to say there's zero chance is only accurate if we're playing roulette (it's not a great chance, but a chance nonetheless).

It's a pipe dream for Toronto too. I don't know that one is any more likely than the other.

 

[BB88]

Games that mattered? Which game doesn't matter in the playoffs? Riddle me that.

Game 3 against the Stars was won by goals from Burakovsky, Zadorov and Landeskog. Game 4 won by goals from Burakovsky x2, Bellemare, MacKinnon, Kadri, Rantanen. Game 6, Zadorov, Rantanen, Makra, Mackinnon, and in game 7 they got goals from Burakovsky, Namestikov x2 and Kadri. The games they didn't get on the scoresheet was game 1 and 2. Do you know how many teams had 17 different goalscorers? Three. Avs, Islanders (who played 7 more games) and Dallas who has 9 more games played. Tampa has 16 goalscorers yet no one is creating inane narratives about them needing secondary scoring. Stop posting nonsense.

And if the Avs have secondary scoring woes what is the Bruins situation with the secondary scoring who had 11 different goalcorers, 4 of which had only one goal to their name, or the fact that they had 12 guys who did nothing offensively despite the fact that 11 of them played 5 or more games? A calamity of gigantic proportions?

Everybody in the World knows Bostons biggest issue is secondary scoring.
Their cap situation though is in the best shape I’ve seen, now and moving forward and their top guy makes 7.25M a year

Colorado was a 1 man show with Mackinnon in these playoffs.
They run into injuries and guess what didn’t make it to the end.
Leafs bottom depth will be garbage if they sign Pietro, betting on declining players taking league minimun just to be able to ice an nhl lineup.

How are you going for a deep run with that, you’ll run into major injuries during deep runs

 

[Islay1989]

Everybody in the World knows Bostons biggest issue is secondary scoring.
Their cap situation though is in the best shape I’ve seen, now and moving forward and their top guy makes 7.25M a year

Colorado was a 1 man show with Mackinnon in these playoffs.
They run into injuries and guess what didn’t make it to the end.
Leafs bottom depth will be garbage if they sign Pietro, betting on declining players taking league minimun just to be able to ice an nhl lineup.

How are you going for a deep run with that, you’ll run into major injuries during deep runs

So you keep droning on despite being shown that you couldn't be more wrong? Kadri had 9 goals, Burakovsky 7, Rantanen 7, Makar 4, Namestikov 4 ....
What exactly constitutes good scoring depth? 51 goals in 12 games isn't enough? The top line had 18 goals combined if you include play-ins, the rest of the team had 44. Still not enough? One man show?

And the injuries that mattered were to two top goalies, which is a fluke, and EJ. Guess what, having Pietrangelo makes the EJ injury a non factor.

 

[varano]

Guessing you not a parent.

Why you depriving your parents from seeing their grand kids, given you are getting reasonable offers from both teams?

Because I'm going to spend the last year's of my career trying to win a cup. I don't care about where their grand parents are. My NHL career is limited.

Get it?

 

[The90]

Because I'm going to spend the last year's of my career trying to win a cup. I don't care about where their grand parents are. My NHL career is limited.

Get it?

Not the point. And you clearly don’t have kids. Different strokes for different folks mang

 

[Scintillating10]

LeBrun sees Vegas, Toronto and Calgary as best landing spots for Pietrangelo

Vegas they were saying last night on Tim and Sid