Post-Game Talk: Leafs Lose 2-1

[unitedstars87]

This team is a colossal waste of time.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

Ehh I'm not sure about that. I'm leery about Keefe's defensive structure. The "swarm" concept just doesn't sit well with me and seems to cause lots of chaos in their own end when the Leafs get scrambling.

I mean he is basically just implementing the lauded Islanders defensive system. At the end of the day the players on this team have had the exact same issues now under two very very different coaches. I have no time for blaming the coaches when the players have shown what they have since what January of 2019? Yeah coaching is way down the list.

 

[TheBeastCoast]

Funny that Dallas Eakins used to favour the swarm coming out of the AHL when he started with the Oilers. It's a chaotic minor league tactic that doesn't leave a team in good position to transition up the ice.

It is also the same tactic that "the best coach in hockey" uses with the Islanders. Almost like the players need to execute or something.

 

[Boxscore]

If you look at the roster that Lou left us with, it was a healthy mix of veterans and young stars. A mix of grit and skill. Leaders and people who needed to be led. Dubas didn't value any of that, so he got rid of all the grit, vets and leaders and replaced them either young guys or players with no work ethic who don't know how to win. That gap was painfully evident during this trip.

The major concern I had with getting rid of Babcock at the time is even if you hated his in game tactics and general personality, his message was always correct. It's like giving the room over to a substitute teacher.

Both of you gentlemen are exactly right. Lou knew what this team needed to take the next step--he brought in guys like Marleau and Hainsey, etc. If he had his way, he would have brought in the Thorntons and Niskanens of the world, etc. but there are cap limitations.

And Babcock--why do you think he visited Matthews in Arizona in the offseason? It was always to "smooth things over." If us fans on TV could see Matthews' eye-rolls when Babcock was telling him things, don't you think Babcock knows what's going on with his star players? Babcock is as sharp as they come--he knows everything about every single one of his men.

Babcock fully believed this was going to be a 5-7 year plan. Remember when he said, "there will be some pain"? He knew this team needed to learn how to play winning hockey, and it wouldn't be easy. Then the Leafs surprised everyone, made the playoffs, and took the Caps to the brink. At that point, the media, fans, and probably management decided--"screw the build, let's go all in"--which is why they strayed from the plan, brought in Tavares for big money, then ultimately fired Babcock because they weren't fulfilling the "win now" prophecy. Nothing has changed under Keefe. This team started out great under him, now look even worse than with Babcock.

This is on the players--they are like the criminals running the asylum. Babcock was a gatekeeper (and they disliked him for it) but it appears Dubas and Keefe are enablers--they are both part of the "too cool for school kids club" with the players and Shanahan is just all-in because he was seduced by Dubas' intellect and wanted to appear to be this young, progressive executive himself.

This Leafs team is young and extremely talented. But the mix is wrong and the leadership (meaning Shanahan, Dubas and Keefe) isn't willing to right the ship IMO and make the necessary decisions to advance the team--at least they haven't so far. This offseason will 100% tell if Shanny or Dubas truly learned anything yet, or if they are bullish to their own detriment.

 

[Cecithepylon]

I’m at a point where I’m not mad anymore. We win some we lose some. Let’s get to the playoffs or miss them. Whatever

 

[hoglund]

Just like Carolina! Damn those hot goalies.

Carolina's goalies had nothing to do with that game, the Leafs were terrible, against Los Angeles and Anaheim the goalies were hot and stole the wins.

 

[IPS]

I have no idea how people say stuff like that. Matthews uses his body all the time, just not for hits. Are you honestly trying to say that Matthews doesn't use his size to shield the puck, for example?

The Leafs lost a few games in a row.

It's about that time where we make shit up and present it as fact.

 

[81Leafs50]

So.
It Wasn't all Babs fault?

it never was and I have said that from the start.

 

[thewave]

This team is a colossal waste of time.

I watch, see uninspired hockey and flip it. They may just not have that winning DNA, a flawed group with low compete. Now it's down the stretch, teams are playing hard now.

 

[81Leafs50]

Agreed, but how many coaches do these players need to go through to find someone they listen to?

they need a coach with clout. Someone undeniable.

 

[Suntouchable13]

It just seems like the team just does not have it. Feels like the only reason they are in a playoff spot is because Florida sucks worse.

 

[thewave]

It just seems like the team just does not have it. Feels like the only reason they are in a playoff spot is because Florida sucks worse.

Exactly, they don't have IT. I am just waiting for the playoffs to see what we really have. If we make it.

 

[Superstar]

I’m at a point where I’m not mad anymore. We win some we lose some. Let’s get to the playoffs or miss them. Whatever

This sounds like a team like Buffalo, which is totally unacceptable.

 

[ToneDog]

Want to see them with Rielly, Muzzin and Soup back before I close the book on them for this year.

 

[Boxscore]

they need a coach with clout. Someone undeniable.

I agree. I'm thinking one with a Hall of Fame resume, Stanley Cup, Olympic Gold Medal and World Championship wins under their belt. Is Mike Babcock available?

 

[Fonzieleaf]

What’s really infuriating is that if we would’ve won against these 3 easy opponents we would’ve had an 11 point gap on Florida right now.

 

[ToneDog]

I agree. I'm thinking one with a Hall of Fame resume, Stanley Cup, Olympic Gold Medal and World Championship wins under their belt. Is Mike Babcock available?

Mike too stubborn for his own good and played mind games. I wouldn't mind handing the reigns over to Boudreau who bleeds blue and white underneath it all.

 

[ToneDog]

Malgin not doing much. We signed Agostino for two years yet he has never been given a shot while so many have.

 

[TIGERCOOL]

has pitts been a 500 team a year plus? to the cap? won nothing?

The point is that they definitely went on that roadtrip and tried their hardest to win every single night, just like us. Getting swept by 3 teams that low in the standings would be an unacceptable outcome at this stage in the season for a team hoping to make a cup run.

The reality is that it can still happen. Pittsburgh's "right to get swept" or our lack thereof is completely irrelevant to the point I'm making and has no impact on the outcome for either team. It's a tough league.

 

[Funk21]

Oilers are a hard working team. They have an experienced coach and a GM with an excellent track record. Nobody expected them to be in the playoffs, now they could be in a conference final. Amazing turn around.

I am talking about Oilers teams of the past. Not since MCJESUS and Drai have become the leadership of this team. PC put them in an awful spot cap wise which benefited them in not making the playoffs. Now they have high draft picks that are developing and will likely form part of the core in years to come(Bouchard and Broberg)

 

[lottster14]

This team is a colossal waste of time.

Seriously. Just excited for playoff hockey as a whole (best live sports), if the leafs surprise and give their fans hope it's just a bonus. But right now it's looking like they wont

 

[Boxscore]

Mike too stubborn for his own good and played mind games. I wouldn't mind handing the reigns over to Boudreau who bleeds blue and white underneath it all.

Mike had his faults--all coaches do--even Scotty Bowman. But Mike also knows what it takes to win. You are right, however, he was stubborn--but so were/are his players. Mike was stubborn in thinking his way could eventually result in a parade (it has worked before) and the players were stubborn in thinking their style of play was needed (they are snot-nosed kids who never accomplished squat in the NHL). At the end of the day, neither the coach nor players caved and the players won out. Enter Keefe--a young coach who thinks just like Dubas--willing to give the kids tons of leash to play "their game." Look how that is turning out.

IMO, the core personalities in the room cannot handle a taskmaster like Babcock, Gallant, Laviolette or Torts. But I am also convinced they cannot improve under a young, progressive cerebral type like Keefe or Hakstol. So, you roll the dice on someone like Boudreau (as you suggested) or you shoot a warning shot through the core and trade a Nylander, Marner or Tavares (if possible) for a Matt Tkachuk/Sean Couturier type player who will run through a brick wall for their coach and teammates.

The more I watch this team, the more I think the core needs a shake-up. Can't have that much salary tied up in the same type of players.

 

[I Believe]

We could've had a 7-8 point lead on Florida right now.

That's a shame.

 

[Boxscore]

We could've had a 7-8 point lead on Florida right now.

That's a shame.

Florida is doing their part.

 

[LeafSteel]

Malgin not doing much. We signed Agostino for two years yet he has never been given a shot while so many have.

Agree 100%.

I don’t see anything in Malgin. Petan V2.0 as far as I’m concerned.

Agostino deserves a shot. Brings some jam and has scored on the Marlies.

What hasn’t he done to deserve a call up?