TSN: Leafs deadline wants: RHD or Power forward?

[HoweHullOrr]

So, you want a big top-pairing RHD that's physical?

Honestly think there's any of those available, much less available for the sorts of pieces Toronto would like to be moving to acquire one?

The idea of the scarcity of resource hasn’t exactly penetrated the mindset of some/many. Additionally then there is the attitude of both entitlement coupled with money can buy anything.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

90% of them include parayko petro or another blues player. Lol

It’s best to kick them when their down. Think I saw this in the hive mentality playbook.

 

[Tit]

God dammit....i have been trying to be polite on here lately....but it's getting tougher.....

Agreed.
People throwing 2 big pieces from the leafs for any depth RD just to troll or whatever, no idea why.
Leafs are parting with a package like that if it isn't for an elite young RHD.

I know leaf fans are just as guilty of it, but since the leafs have become contenders, the offers are even worse.

Personally I'm probably never trading Liljegren and Sandin if I'm the leafs. Or Kapanen for that matter. I'd much rather move Nylander for the cap room. And the two D will be needed for the future, as we are about to lose a lot of our D to either cap problems, or old age.

 

[Hunter368]

Gubranson, Virtanen
For
Kapanen, Liljegren, 1st

Easy pass by the Leafs......zero interest in that.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Okay.

What's the more realistic target, then?

The pending UFA crop for RHD (i.e. the rental market) is essentially barren, if I remember right. This is a big need for a prominent contender so I get the chatter, but there needs to be a second party that's actually willing to make a deal.

What other teams are there? LA isn't trading Doughty. Chicago doesn't have anything Toronto would want. What first pairing quality defensemen are available at this point, much less available for a collection of lesser parts?

I honestly don't think there are any. You could try to change a team's mind by making them an offer they can't refuse, or settle for a lesser solution, or simply ignore the issue for the time being. For all intents and purposes, though, I think this talk about getting a top pairing RHD is just pie in the sky wishing at this point. There's just no dance partners out there to be had.

Keith maybe, but Hawks would probably have to retain 90% and give us a pick.

 

[StevenB]

Easton but kappenan, johns on, brown, zaitsev and 30-31st over all great pieces that all teams should be lucky to have. Lol

So are the leafs pretenders or are they going to pick 30-31st (Stanley cup winners/finalists?) hf needs to make their mind up and stop with this ridiculous leaf bias lmao

 

[Ziggdiezan]

So are the leafs pretenders or are they going to pick 30-31st (Stanley cup winners/finalists?) hf needs to make their mind up and stop with this ridiculous leaf bias lmao

Ya I have been told the leafs are certainly getting bounced in the first round... should mean their first rounder is worth more though lol

 

[HoweHullOrr]

I'd rather have Pesce than Kapanen long-term.

If Faulk is inevitably leaving Carolina, Pesce is flat out not a trade candidate. Zaitsev has negative value to Carolina in this scenario.

In summation, Carolina isn't going to trade the lone RHD under team control long-term, deal a quality rental that they need to keep and indirectly eat a ton of money to buy high on Kapanen and acquire a late 1st.

So, you’re trying to tell us it’s important/relevant that the trade would be good for the Canes as well?

 

[zeke]

the play for the leafs is to consolidate a bunch of their dman depth into one very good dman.

so package together some of:

Dermott - Ozhiganov
Sandin - Liljegren
Rosen - Rasanen
Borgman - Durzi

mix in some picks, and throw in Zaitsev for cap purposes.

and target a guy like pietro.

 

[zeke]

Through 31 games. He has some more to prove before he takes on the value of an NHL Top 6 forward.

I'd rather have Pesce than Kapanen long-term. Sure, he'd help address what is a porous forward group, but that impact would be negated by the top goal scorer on the team going back the other way. Carolina would still be mediocre as hell after that deal. Prioritizing short-term need would be pretty dumb in that scenario. The long-term consequences are what matters. Svechnikov and Necas should get better as they get older. That alone will address much of what ails the Canes.

If Faulk is inevitably leaving Carolina, Pesce is flat out not a trade candidate. Zaitsev has negative value to Carolina in this scenario.

In summation, Carolina isn't going to trade the lone RHD under team control long-term, deal a quality rental that they need to keep and indirectly eat a ton of money to buy high on Kapanen and acquire a late 1st.

imagine for a second you had a 22yr old 1st round pick, with elite skating, a great shot and gritty two way play, who was a ppg player in the AHL at age 20 and was now producing at a 30/60 pace in his FIRST shot at an Nhl scoring role - with no PP time to boot.

would you ever even consider trading that player for a 2nd pair defensive dman?

 

[HoweHullOrr]

If Parayko was on the market then Nylander would most likely be on the table. Can't see any teams topping that offer alone.

Yes Parayko would be great for us. Blues need to make him available to us to support our Cup run. That’s the rules.

 

[The List Of Jericho]

the play for the leafs is to consolidate a bunch of their dman depth into one very good dman.

so package together some of:

Dermott - Ozhiganov
Sandin - Liljegren
Rosen - Rasanen
Borgman - Durzi

mix in some picks, and throw in Zaitsev for cap purposes.

and target a guy like pietro.

Dermott, Sandin and Liljegren should absolutely not be traded at this point

 

[HoweHullOrr]

imagine for a second you had a 22yr old 1st round pick, with elite skating, a great shot and gritty two way play, who was a ppg player in the AHL at age 20 and was now producing at a 30/60 pace in his FIRST shot at an Nhl scoring role - with no PP time to boot.

would you ever even consider trading that player for a 2nd pair defensive dman?

Where are all of these “available” defenders that we keep talking about, or wishing for? Especially the good, young ones with affordable contracts ...... Maybe that is the answer to your question.

 

[zeke]

Dermott, Sandin and Liljegren should absolutely not be traded at this point

gotta give to get.

I'd rather it be one of them for a stud dman than weakening our forward group.

 

[zeke]

Where are all of these “available” defenders that we keep talking about, or wishing for? Especially the good, young ones with affordable contracts ...... Maybe that is the answer to your question.

they seem to always be available. whether it's mcdonagh and Karlsson last year or guys like pietro this year.

 

[Liferleafer]

gotta give to get.

I'd rather it be one of them for a stud dman than weakening our forward group.

I'd rather trade from a position of strength to acquire a position of need.

 

[zeke]

I'd rather trade from a position of strength to acquire a position of need.

I'd rather just upgrade our D than upgrade it while weakening our forwards.

especially since our forward depth is not as crazy as we think. a trade means Brown back in the top 9 with only grundstrom to hope on as a top-9 prospect. our 4th line kinda sucks right now and there's nobody banging on the door in the minors.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

Look at what McDonagh was traded for....Tampa did that deal while holding their 2 most valuable prospects, and basically no roster players when you consider that they got Miller as well.

On another team, brown is a 3rd liner with easy 2nd line upside.

Was McD going to be a UFA? We’re the Rangers rebuilding? I can’t remember.

 

[HoweHullOrr]

they seem to always be available. whether it's mcdonagh and Karlsson last year or guys like pietro this year.

Soon to be UFAs (rentals) = yes

1, maybe 2 UFAs per year = yes. That means competition for the few alternatives that exist.

My post stands if you read all of the words.

 

[Broad Street Buddies]

To Toronto:
Radko Gudas (1M retained)
Wayne Simmonds (1.5M retained)
Alex Lyon


To Philadelphia:
Connor Brown
Pontus Holmberg
1st round pick - 2019
2nd round pick - 2020 (switch to 1st if TML reach ECF in any of the next 2 seasons)

 

[Tit]

I'd rather just upgrade our D than upgrade it while weakening our forwards.

especially since our forward depth is not as crazy as we think. a trade means Brown back in the top 9 with only grundstrom to hope on as a top-9 prospect. our 4th line kinda sucks right now and there's nobody banging on the door in the minors.

Brown has looked fine when moved up the lineup.
And 4th line players are easier to replace.

Trading our 2 best D prospects to fill the same need at the NHL level is kind of silly.
Liljegren will make the team next year.
And Sandin might very well as well.
If not the year after.
Rosen was signed as an insurance policy but I he doesn't have the ceiling of the other two.

It seems Dubas is at a bit of a crossroads here.
Our prospect depth is not very good, our picks will be late and thus not having huge value.

We need to maximize our window here and stay within the cap.
Trading players like Liljegren is a bad idea IMO, more so than Sandin.
We are going to lose Hainsey and Gardiner (presumably), we need players to fill those spots. Zaitsev and Ozighanov aren't really beacons of hope on the right side.

If anything I could see Dubas doing absolutely nothing until the draft, then seeing where we stand there in regards to cap and signing our RFAs.

If we don't get it done in the playoffs, then the pieces will start to be moved around.

One thing is for sure, we cannot go into next year with Zaitsev as our #1 RHD. Presuming Hainsey isn't back, which isn't any better, really.

I am very interested as to what Dubas is going to do here, and I think he was really trying to get a deal done with Nylander, but when he couldn't, he is going to ride it out until the draft, imo.

 

[The List Of Jericho]

To Toronto:
Radko Gudas (1M retained)
Wayne Simmonds (1.5M retained)
Alex Lyon


To Philadelphia:
Connor Brown
Pontus Holmberg
1st round pick - 2019
2nd round pick - 2020 (switch to 1st if TML reach ECF in any of the next 2 seasonsS

I would only do that if we manage to re-sign Simmonds

 

[zeke]

Brown has looked fine when moved up the lineup.

no he hasn't. the Tavares Line looks much worse with him on there, and the kadri line looks much better without him.

And 4th line players are easier to replace.

we're talking about replacing Kapanen.

Trading our 2 best D prospects to fill the same need at the NHL level is kind of silly.

Liljegren will make the team next year.
And Sandin might very well as well.
If not the year after.
Rosen was signed as an insurance policy but I he doesn't have the ceiling of the other two.

we can go back and forth on the price, but none of these guys should be considered untouchable if we're talking about upgrading to a #1 dman.

It seems Dubas is at a bit of a crossroads here.
Our prospect depth is not very good, our picks will be late and thus not having huge value.

no crossroads at all, imo. he has stacked young team with plenty of good prospects - in a perfect position to consolidate some of those prospects into an elite dman.

We need to maximize our window here and stay within the cap.
Trading players like Liljegren is a bad idea IMO, more so than Sandin.
We are going to lose Hainsey and Gardiner (presumably), we need players to fill those spots. Zaitsev and Ozighanov aren't really beacons of hope on the right side.

If anything I could see Dubas doing absolutely nothing until the draft, then seeing where we stand there in regards to cap and signing our RFAs.

If we don't get it done in the playoffs, then the pieces will start to be moved around.

One thing is for sure, we cannot go into next year with Zaitsev as our #1 RHD. Presuming Hainsey isn't back, which isn't any better, really.

I am very interested as to what Dubas is going to do here, and I think he was really trying to get a deal done with Nylander, but when he couldn't, he is going to ride it out until the draft, imo.

I think you missed the part where we would be trading for a top pair dman.

 

[TheScandal89]

Anyone think theres any value to this,

To Toronto

-Chris Tanev
-Erik Gudbranson (50% retained)

To Vancity

-Nikita Zaitsev
-Connor Brown
-Yegor Korshkov/Sean Durzi
-1st round pick

Our right side gets a boost and toughness gets a major boost with Gudbranson

 

[Big Daddy Cane]

imagine for a second you had a 22yr old 1st round pick, with elite skating, a great shot and gritty two way play, who was a ppg player in the AHL at age 20 and was now producing at a 30/60 pace in his FIRST shot at an Nhl scoring role - with no PP time to boot.

would you ever even consider trading that player for a 2nd pair defensive dman?

It depends. If you have any doubt about that upside, you do it. Even if you think Kapanen is going to be that guy, I think you still do it. The goal of the sport is to win, not to lead the league in goals. Pesce is just a really good fit for the Leafs financially, positionally and stylistically. I take Toronto seriously with Pesce in a way I don't now. You wouldn't have to give up any crown jewels in the process. Kapanen is effectively found money.

Judging from your posts, you’re bearish on the guy. That’s fine. I hope Dubas shares your point of view. Save Carolina from itself.