News Article: Leafs Analysis at Centre - Kadri,Bolland,Bozak

Goonface2k14

Registered User
Nov 25, 2009
2,649
1,011
Maple Leaf Gardens
To everyone saying Kadri should be playing with Lupul... what happens when Lupul is injured? (As he is so often) Is Kadri doomed to play with random wingers like he was last season? It would kinda be putting his talents to waste. Lupul is awesome, but first he's gotta show that he's a regular.

And in the meantime, let Lupuls talent go to waste? I think as long as the "big four" are healthy, you keep them in pairs.

Thing is they're winning right now so Carlyle likely won't break up the big line.
 

DD03

3D
Mar 15, 2010
21,734
9
All these people saying we can easily replace Bozak, but not a single person has dropped a name with a player who we have that could replace him.

And don't say Grabovski because Grabovski wasn't getting along with our coach which isn't good for the locker room.
 

thewave

Registered User
Jun 17, 2011
39,875
9,713
All these people saying we can easily replace Bozak, but not a single person has dropped a name with a player who we have that could replace him.

And don't say Grabovski because Grabovski wasn't getting along with our coach which isn't good for the locker room.

Jake Gardiner. There you go problem solved.
 

Diatomic

Mitch Matthewlander
Mar 12, 2013
9,178
81
Air Canada Centre
All these people saying we can easily replace Bozak, but not a single person has dropped a name with a player who we have that could replace him.

And don't say Grabovski because Grabovski wasn't getting along with our coach which isn't good for the locker room.

Replace Bozak with Bolland. Make Bolland the #2C, McClement the checking line center. Bolland brings everything Bozak offers and much more
 

thewave

Registered User
Jun 17, 2011
39,875
9,713
Replace Bozak with Bolland. Make Bolland the #2C, McClement the checking line center. Bolland brings everything Bozak offers and much more

You got that right. You could even put Bolland on first and leave Kadri as is if you want.
 

Crispy Crust

Registered User
Jul 6, 2007
18,250
996
Toronto
What the heck does Bozak bring to the table? He really isn't good at anything besides being relatively decent at faceoffs. He is a weak offensive player, not a good passer, handles the puck like a grenade, can't drive possession forward, and isn't even great defensively. There isn't any reason to defend a below average talent playing almost 20 minutes a night.
 

agropop

Registered User
Mar 3, 2011
1,559
0
Windsor
All these people saying we can easily replace Bozak, but not a single person has dropped a name with a player who we have that could replace him.

And don't say Grabovski because Grabovski wasn't getting along with our coach which isn't good for the locker room.

Let's trade'm to Calgary for Joe Colborne.
 

PuckMagi

Registered User
Apr 13, 2013
5,459
1,965
Toronto
Overall team record doesn't prove how good or bad a player is. Bottom line is Grabovski is a top 6 player and would be great on our 2nd line.

grabo would be a good centre to have if we had crappy wingers. cause grabo likes to skate the puck up the ice... do two laps around the net... and then take a weak shot. and if you have bad wingers, they just have to get in front of the net and shoot the puck 4 feet into the net.

not saying that macA was a bad player (i liked him) ... but i remember him getting a lot of goals sort of just hanging out in front of the net and letting grabo make the play to get the puck on net.

with skilled wingers, we don't want a centre who is going to be a puck hog. in the case of kessel and jvr... we need a centre to just pass them the puck and let them do their thing.

also, grabo is SOFT. he's tough enough in the sense that he gets up when he gets hit... but he gets crushed and gets knocked off the puck.

i prefer bozak over grabo cause bozak just passes to the better players and lets them do their thing. and bozak is good a faceoffs, good on the PK, good at shootouts, etc.

and i prefer bolland over grabo. bolland might not have his skill and speed... but come playoff time, i'll take bolland over grabo in a heart beat.

also, when grabo got knocked over... he was always the last guy back. and that seems to be kessel's job most of the time. at least bozak and bolland are pretty responsible defensively, which allow our wingers to put on more offensive pressure.
 

A1LeafNation

Obsession beats talent everytime!!
Oct 17, 2010
27,284
17,190
I have the solution to all our problems:

Turn:

JVR Bozak Kessel
Lupul Kadri Clarkson
Raymond Bollland Kulemin

into:

JVR Kadri Kessel
Lupul Bozak Clarkson
Raymond Bollland Kulemin


Taaa Daaaa
 

Nithoniniel

Registered User
Sep 7, 2012
20,913
16,749
Skövde, Sweden
I have the solution to all our problems:

Turn:

JVR Bozak Kessel
Lupul Kadri Clarkson
Raymond Bollland Kulemin

into:

JVR Kadri Kessel
Lupul Bozak Clarkson
Raymond Bollland Kulemin


Taaa Daaaa

That would make our first line better and the team overall worse in my opinion. That second line has a versatile but offensively mediocre Bozak and a grinder in Clarkson, it would leave way too much on Lupuls shoulders alone.

We all know Bozak is not great offensively, but I just don't know why people have such an obsession about who is the #1C. I care more for how our lines work. As long as we have several lines that work and can play a specific role then I'm happy, no matter who plays in between JVR and Kessel.
 

Purity*

Registered User
Jan 29, 2010
8,446
1
Our forward group isn't as conventional as other teams setup, does it work? I think we find out this year. No doubt we are insanely strong on wing, as long as our centers can be defensively responsible (Bolland, Bozak, and McClement are all good defensively), we should be able to contend...

Think about it, the massive over-expectation around these forums is that a #1 center needs to be 2-way dominant, but what's wrong with having your centers having the defensive responsibility while letting the wingers who happen to be very offensively talented handle the offensive side of things? We aren't the Boston Bruins where everyone is a 2-way monster..
 

thewave

Registered User
Jun 17, 2011
39,875
9,713
I would play it by who has earned it. Producers get more chance to produce.

JVR Kadri Kessel
Lupul Bolland Raymond
Kules Bozak Clarkson

There you go. Easy as pie, Bolland is grit and is clutch, Lupul makes the magic and Raymond has wings. Kules is defensive monster Bozak brings the face off in line and Clarkson is the sandpaper.
First line is still the duo plus a dynamic C who butters the sandwich. It all makes sense.

Mc Orr and whomever makes for 3b line just with Mc alone, just add a competent winger
 

ConnorTO

Registered User
Jul 20, 2010
5,869
0
Toronto
people have to understand Kadri is still new, this is some what his second real year

going to take a few more years until he can impact the League
no rush...
 

thewave

Registered User
Jun 17, 2011
39,875
9,713
people have to understand Kadri is still new, this is some what his second real year

going to take a few more years until he can impact the League
no rush...

He is a point per Game Center who is crafty and can put the puck in the net. What do you want him to walk on water?
 

The Winter Soldier

Registered User
Apr 4, 2011
70,803
21,006
I was really into Sarah Palin a few years back, she really had a unique perspective on things political. You remind me of her a lot, I guess that's why I enjoy reading your posts.

I am really excited about Kadri on the first line, how about you?

Well Skinnyfish(Your Twitter Handle), if you liked what Palin had to say, I guess this is why you read and participate on Pension Puppets. Not much credibility for both. Suggest getting your info from more credible sources like Siegel(read his article today and compare it to this one). Night and day.
 

Jeffler

See You At Game 3
Dec 7, 2006
15,746
0
North York
theleafsnation.com
100% agreed, I've had to unfollow PPP, Jeffler, Steve Dangle and that whole annoying crew. They think they're edgy or funny or something by making stupid little snide remarks about Bozak every other tweet. Was getting unbearable.

:cry:

Personally, I don't think I'm edgy. People just legitimately yell at me about how great they think he is non-stop. I got just under 75 "TOLD YOU SO" messages within 3 or 4 minutes of his first goal of the year.

Mind you, there are people who still try to tell me the Leafs lost the JVR trade and that Orr and McLaren are good defensive forwards, so...

Does Don Cherry run a Parody twitter account pretending to be Bozak? Does Don Cherry manage to bring up Bozak every coaches corner whether it is relevant or not?

I'm just saying, if these guys want any air of legitimacy they need drop the Bozak obsession and stop trying so hard to be cynical and edgy.

The parody account isn't even really about him, just an experiment on how parody accounts work and he was the most relevant person at the time that didn't have one.

I also try to avoid mentioning about him at all unless brought up to me. Hell, even during games, I've tried to point out good things instead of bad. The issue, of course, is that the only way for me to go three hours without him being brought up to me is for me to go to sleep
 

The Mauve Avenger

Registered User
Sep 20, 2009
696
0
Toronto
Most of the backlash of that article I'm getting in this thread is:

"LEAVE BOZAK ALONE" *cries*

When the numbers show that you are right, you support it in every way possible. However, when numbers show that your preconceived notions are flawed, you bash it. You are no different from folks like Damien Cox and Steve Simmons.
 

Areathrasher

Registered User
Jan 11, 2012
122
0
Port Credit, ON
Well Skinnyfish(Your Twitter Handle), if you liked what Palin had to say, I guess this is why you read and participate on Pension Puppets. Not much credibility for both. Suggest getting your info from more credible sources like Siegel(read his article today and compare it to this one). Night and day.

tumblr_lg6bygCciY1qztjn5o1_500.png
 

zeke

The Dube Abides
Mar 14, 2005
66,937
36,957
:cry:

Personally, I don't think I'm edgy. People just legitimately yell at me about how great they think he is non-stop. I got just under 75 "TOLD YOU SO" messages within 3 or 4 minutes of his first goal of the year.

Mind you, there are people who still try to tell me the Leafs lost the JVR trade and that Orr and McLaren are good defensive forwards, so...



The parody account isn't even really about him, just an experiment on how parody accounts work and he was the most relevant person at the time that didn't have one.

I also try to avoid mentioning about him at all unless brought up to me. Hell, even during games, I've tried to point out good things instead of bad. The issue, of course, is that the only way for me to go three hours without him being brought up to me is for me to go to sleep

The 'told you so' tweets sound like responses to your constant bozak heckling, not like instigators.

Bozak has centred one of the most productive lines in hockey three years running now, and is a good pk and faceoff man to boot. He simply cannot be deserving of the obsessive barrage of hate you guys give him.
 

BlueBaron

Registered User
May 29, 2006
15,669
6,302
Sarnia, On
The 'told you so' tweets sound like responses to your constant bozak heckling, not like instigators.

Bozak has centred one of the most productive lines in hockey three years running now, and is a good pk and faceoff man to boot. He simply cannot be deserving of the obsessive barrage of hate you guys give him.

Always we remember, because we have the biggest fan base we have the most idiots, as can be seen by reading this thread.

Bozak is a fine player. He is not paid to be a first line C or he would be getting Kessel money. He is basically getting 2nd line C money which will be his eventual role.

Though we would all like to see more offense from Bozak he does a lot of little things well and more importanly takes on responsibilites that allow others to focus on offense.

We know that in the past the Leafs were offered a 1rst round pick for him. We know Nonis has some clue what NHL market value is as demonstrated by his ability to sign Kadri and Franson. So I would have to conclude that most of the Bozak hate is irrational . Our posters who think they know market value better than the pro's are the same guys who kept telling us we had to trade Franson and that Kadri would be a 5 million dollar player.

It's fun to discuss and question why this guy plays here and gets paid that but so many posters here seem to be unable to grasp the concept of context. The same guys who moaned about Kostka playing big minutes while Carlyle let his more established players get into game shape after the lockout. Carlyle is a pretty good coach and has a much better idiea of what he is doing and why than HF posters do.

In the long run Bozak will probably get replaced by a bigger more offensively gifted center, but until then he is a great stop gap while Kadri prepares for the role as #1 C.
 

Jeffler

See You At Game 3
Dec 7, 2006
15,746
0
North York
theleafsnation.com
The 'told you so' tweets sound like responses to your constant bozak heckling, not like instigators.

Bozak has centred one of the most productive lines in hockey three years running now, and is a good pk and faceoff man to boot. He simply cannot be deserving of the obsessive barrage of hate you guys give him.

Probably; it's a self fulfilling prophecy that I'm kinda stuck with now, admittedly.

There's stuff I like about Bozak. He's good in the shootout, when his shot connects period it's pretty accurate, he doesn't take a lot of penalties, he appears to be a solid guy in the locker room and to fans (though he should really ignore his Twitter and forget Halloween is a thing). While his faceoff ability is grossly overstated (he paces out to an extra draw win a game above average, and less than a goal gained per season), he's still the guy on this team that you trust when you need a big draw.
I also don't blame him for taking his contract, and know that he tries his absolute best to try to live up to the expectations of his paycheque and role.

This is all stuff that I point out with frequency too, but it gets ignored because I'm "the Hates Bozak guy"

There are a lot of people who dislike him to the point of thinking he's not even an NHL level player, which is a stretch. I think he'd be a stellar third line centre that you can occasionally bump up to the second line, and would be awesome to have short term at 2-2.5M. Maybe more if you're a team that's not pushed up against the cap.

But I don't think it's deniable at this point that his line produces in spite of him, not because of him, and that his impact on Kessel's production dwindles by the year. Pretty much every time someone else has been tried next to Kessel, while the sample size is small, that player has out produced Bozak and Kessel's numbers have gone up. I don't think it's unrealstic to feel that other people should be used in that role if there's statistical evidence that there would be a benefit. Even the "he's the defensive cog" argument is starting to fade as Kessel and JVR's two way games improve and Bozak's defensive numbers seep towards the bottom half of Toronto's forwards.

I also don't think it's a coincidence that the PK improved when he became the centre of the second unit instead of the first. Not to say that he's bad, but he looks for the SHG more than McClement does which leads to more turnovers and fewer clears. I still think he has merit on the PK but he isn't a game changer.

Basically, his job is to play a high offensive role and there are other players, even internally, that seem like they'd be better at it. I think that while pointing this out can be tiresome to some, there's merit to expressing the info, especially since my audience/readership frequently changes.

The consequence, of course, is being typecast as being completely biased against a player like I am now. The reality is that I like him, I just really don't like the role he has on this team.
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->