Laine’s off-season training (see warning in post 832)

[Psych0dad]

Anything is better than eating Cheetos and playing NHL 17/18 all summer.

Insanity: doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results.

Yeah but wjat does that have to do with the topic at hand?

 

[Howard Chuck]

From: @Se829ne of HFBoards:
To: [email protected]

"Dear Mr. Rautala

We Laine fans hanging online at hfboards.mandatory.com feel concerned about Patrik Laine's summer training methods, namely about a lack of on-ice skating hours in it. We enthusiast would save about 1000 pages of post in various threads here in the site, if Patrik's training schedule would include at least few hours of skating per a week, so our horrors about Laine starting with cement-boots oncoming next NHL season wouldnt' become the reality.

Respecting your decades long experience in sport training, while hoping extra strength to Patrik's legs and particularly explosiveness to his few first strides. Thank you,

Sincerely,

Se829ne

P.S. More information about the debate here:
https://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/patrik-laine-mod-warning-in-post-150.2514961/ and here
https://hfboards.mandatory.com/threads/laine’s-off-season-training.2516019/
and tens other threads following same veins.

"

Not yet sent.

Awesome.....

 

[RageQuit77]

Patrik's leg training tune (repeat). The original mix is ok "to".

 

[llwyd]

It is just normal for fans to criticize manegement, trainers and players. If a fan criticizes a player it doesn’t mean that the fan would be a better NHLer. It’s the same when a fan criticizes a trainer, it doesn’t mean that the fan would be a better trainer. Of course I wouldn’t be a better trainer than Rautala, but that doesn’t mean I can’t criticize his methods.

Of course it is, but there is usually a very good reason why fans are fans and professionals are professionals. Obviously experts can make mistakes and the best way to measure that is to see the results of their work. So far Laine has been phenomenal for his age and frame, so I would say that so far so very good. If this changes, then I might join you in criticizing his training methods, but at the moment it would feel rather ridiculous.

 

[abax44]

Yeah but wjat does that have to do with the topic at hand?

What doesn't it have to do with it?

 

[Psych0dad]

What doesn't it have to do with it?

I see no correlation with your imaginary scenario and Laine's summer training (which is the topic) so you would need to explain that.

 

[gearmex]

I saw an interview from Laine in Finnish magazine and he talked about his training in it also: Everything will be trained but maybe most i think will be legs and their explosiveness, my aim is to have overall comprehensive (Kokonaisvaltainen in Finnish, not sure i translated it correct, Finns correct me if i was wrong) development.

 

[abax44]

I see no correlation with your imaginary scenario and Laine's summer training (which is the topic) so you would need to explain that.

Would I?

 

[Ippenator]

Would I?

Are you going to discuss something, or rather just keep throwing some completely meaningless oneliners?

 

[Asiantuntija]

I think Laine should be working with Yrjövuori. Rautala has good understanding about off-season training but Yrjövuori is professor of human body. He was Kobe Bryant 1st man for 10 years and that should be tell more than enough.

 

[Kaako Kappo]

I think Laine should be working with Yrjövuori. Rautala has good understanding about off-season training but Yrjövuori is professor of human body. He was Kobe Bryant 1st man for 10 years and that should be tell more than enough.

Ahh, Kobe Bryant, the famous hockey player.

 

[Nate070]

Wow, good read. I’d really recommend everyone to at least skim through it. For example Austin Matthews goes to this guy:

“Belfry attacks the game from a research perspective, using video to track game habits and skill execution to answer the question: what does a player do the most and how successful is he in those situations? Belfry also looks at less efficient areas of a player’s game and problem-solves with him to build a new skill or evolve his game.”

Compare that with Rautala who’s not even a hockey player coach, the extent of development he can do is to add more weights in his gym, while Matthews gets personalized treatment with the aim to make him better at his weak areas.

I envy Matthews’s training a bit after reading that, while Laine spends his time in a group with no personalization or focus on his weak areas and plays badminton and lifts weights.

Maybe Matthews is more physically ready than Laine? Never thought about that? Maybe Laine wants to be home during the summer? He's a young guy still.

 

[nobody imp0rtant]

Wow, good read. I’d really recommend everyone to at least skim through it. For example Austin Matthews goes to this guy:

“Belfry attacks the game from a research perspective, using video to track game habits and skill execution to answer the question: what does a player do the most and how successful is he in those situations? Belfry also looks at less efficient areas of a player’s game and problem-solves with him to build a new skill or evolve his game.”

Compare that with Rautala who’s not even a hockey player coach, the extent of development he can do is to add more weights in his gym, while Matthews gets personalized treatment with the aim to make him better at his weak areas.

I envy Matthews’s training a bit after reading that, while Laine spends his time in a group with no personalization or focus on his weak areas and plays badminton and lifts weights.

I think you're comparing apples and oranges. Belfry is more like Adam Oates (who works with Scheif) than Rautala. Maybe Laine should consider both. Work with Rautala on his physical development, and Oates for skills coaching.

Sportsnet article

 

[ps241]

I just noticed they have added an ignore thread option. I am thrilled and am going to start out exercising my option to muting free speech with this howler.

Enjoy the off season.......I love you guys

 

[gearmex]

Patrik Laine löi vitsiksi - sai selkäsaunan Barkovin kanssa Tampere Openissa: ”Nyt loppui pelaaminen”

Laine and Barkov got their asses handed to them again haha they are not good in Tennis Tampere Open cup last year they lost to Selänne/Kurri Duo and now lost to Tuukka Rask (BOS) and Jani Jokinen (Non Hockey guy)

 

[Board Bard]

Patrik Laine löi vitsiksi - sai selkäsaunan Barkovin kanssa Tampere Openissa: ”Nyt loppui pelaaminen”

Laine and Barkov got their asses handed to them again haha they are not good in Tennis Tampere Open cup last year they lost to Selänne/Kurri Duo and now lost to Tuukka Rask (BOS) and Jani Jokinen (Non Hockey guy)

But they'd kill them at badminton, right?

 

[Ippenator]

But they'd kill them at badminton, right?

Probably not, as they both play more tennis than badminton during the summer.

 

[Tommigun]

Probably not, as they both play more tennis than badminton during the summer.

How about skating then? Laine wouldn’t do well because he plays all the sports during summer except ones including skating.

 

[Ippenator]

How about skating then? Laine wouldn’t do well because he plays all the sports during summer except ones including skating.

If you have already good skating technique but not so good explosive power in the legs, you train like Laine is doing at the moment. You just won’t ever get it I guess. You think you know what he needs, but you don’t. He, his trainer and the Jets coaches know what he needs to do. You just need to be more patient and probably concentrate on thinking about something else while waiting.

 

[Hunter368]

I saw an interview from Laine in Finnish magazine and he talked about his training in it also: Everything will be trained but maybe most i think will be legs and their explosiveness, my aim is to have overall comprehensive (Kokonaisvaltainen in Finnish, not sure i translated it correct, Finns correct me if i was wrong) development.

Good to hear......he needs to improve his explosiveness and speed overall allowing him to drive play more.

 

[Ippenator]

How about skating then? Laine wouldn’t do well because he plays all the sports during summer except ones including skating.

And once again, Laine has skated still every off season just a few weeks before he has gone to the Jets training camp. He has had plenty of time to get used to skating again. He just does not need any extra skating lessons at the moment. He needs to fix his explosiveness and stamina and he will not do anything for that with skating at the same time when he is concentrating in the explosiveness and stamina training.

No one who is in special need of strengthening their leg explosiveness and leg stamina are doing skating exercises during the hard physical training period. Just believe me on this, or start getting more info about players that have had the same situation as Laine. Matthews is not an example, as he has had strong and explosive legs naturally. McDavid is even a worse example, as he is the most physically gifted skater there probably is. Just compare Laine to players that have had the same situation and you should realize that what he is doing, is in fact what is usually done with big kids with similar development challenges. Draisaitl, Rantanen and Barkov are good examples. None of them were skating at the same time with their strength training, but went for a few weeks to light skating AFTER the more intensive physical training was done for the summer.

There is a an order how to do training to be enough efficient with results from each training. The more intensive the physical training is, the less there is a reason to mix technical training with it at the same time with the intensive strength training. This is why the Olympic speedskaters also have no skating while they are doing their most intensive physical training in the off season.

You are seriously worrying for nothing. Anyway there is not seriously that big difference between all the top trainers in the world. It’s a placebo effect when people think that some player gets a HUGE development spurt while training with a certain trainer. The same player would have most probably got very similar results with training with any top trainers from any of the top hockey countries.

Sure you can keep believing that there is a huge difference between all these top trainers from different countries, but honestly I think that you are wasting your time with the worrying.

 

[Tommigun]

And once again, Laine has skated still every off season just a few weeks before he has gone to the Jets training camp. He has had plenty of time to get used to skating again. He just does not need any extra skating lessons at the moment. He needs to fix his explosiveness and stamina and he will not do anything for that with skating at the same time when he is concentrating in the explosiveness and stamina training.

No one who is in special need of strengthening their leg explosiveness and leg stamina are doing skating exercises during the hard physical training period. Just believe me on this, or start getting more info about players that have had the same situation as Laine. Matthews is not an example, as he has had strong and explosive legs naturally. McDavid is even a worse example, as he is the most physically gifted skater there probably is. Just compare Laine to players that have had the same situation and you should realize that what he is doing, is in fact what is usually done with big kids with similar development challenges. Draisaitl, Rantanen and Barkov are good examples. None of them were skating at the same time with their strength training, but went for a few weeks to light skating AFTER the more intensive physical training was done for the summer.

There is a an order how to do training to be enough efficient with results from each training. The more intensive the physical training is, the less there is a reason to mix technical training with it at the same time with the intensive strength training. This is why the Olympic speedskaters also have no skating while they are doing their most intensive physical training in the off season.

You are seriously worrying for nothing. Anyway there is not seriously that big difference between all the top trainers in the world. It’s a placebo effect when people think that some player gets a HUGE development spurt while training with a certain trainer. The same player would have most probably got very similar results with training with any top trainers from any of the top hockey countries.

Sure you can keep believing that there is a huge difference between all these top trainers from different countries, but honestly I think that you are wasting your time with the worrying.

But does he really have such good technique? He bends his knees inwards awkwardly a lot and seems to have some trouble skating backwards at times. His skating is pretty odd looking with the knee bending and I’m sure he could gain large improvements if someone worked with him on his stride etc.

 

[DashingDane]

And once again, Laine has skated still every off season just a few weeks before he has gone to the Jets training camp. He has had plenty of time to get used to skating again. He just does not need any extra skating lessons at the moment. He needs to fix his explosiveness and stamina and he will not do anything for that with skating at the same time when he is concentrating in the explosiveness and stamina training.

No one who is in special need of strengthening their leg explosiveness and leg stamina are doing skating exercises during the hard physical training period. Just believe me on this, or start getting more info about players that have had the same situation as Laine. Matthews is not an example, as he has had strong and explosive legs naturally. McDavid is even a worse example, as he is the most physically gifted skater there probably is. Just compare Laine to players that have had the same situation and you should realize that what he is doing, is in fact what is usually done with big kids with similar development challenges. Draisaitl, Rantanen and Barkov are good examples. None of them were skating at the same time with their strength training, but went for a few weeks to light skating AFTER the more intensive physical training was done for the summer.

There is a an order how to do training to be enough efficient with results from each training. The more intensive the physical training is, the less there is a reason to mix technical training with it at the same time with the intensive strength training. This is why the Olympic speedskaters also have no skating while they are doing their most intensive physical training in the off season.

You are seriously worrying for nothing. Anyway there is not seriously that big difference between all the top trainers in the world. It’s a placebo effect when people think that some player gets a HUGE development spurt while training with a certain trainer. The same player would have most probably got very similar results with training with any top trainers from any of the top hockey countries.

Sure you can keep believing that there is a huge difference between all these top trainers from different countries, but honestly I think that you are wasting your time with the worrying.

I really don't want to get into another long discussion that doesn't go anywhere... but please tell me why Rautala would be considered among the top trainers in the world? I can't find anything that remotely suggests that is the case.

 

[Tommigun]

I really don't want to get into another long discussion that doesn't go anywhere... but please tell me why Rautala would be considered among the top trainers in the world? I can't find anything that remotely suggests that is the case.

That’s the biggest problem I have as well, some people seem to swear by him but he’s not recognized in any way, and he isn’t even a hockey trainer. He’s a pure strength trainer and doesn’t personalize the programs at all for the trainees. It’s just a big group lifting weights, playing badminton etc. He’s also very old and his methods are like from the 70s-80s. Top trainers nowadays watch videos of the players to find areas of weakness, consult stats etc. to personalize the training further, but Rautala doesn’t probably even watch hockey

 

[Howard Chuck]