Player Discussion Klefbom

[Bryanbryoil]

I don't buy the injury excuse.

None of his struggles stem from something physical.

He's somehow forgot how to play defense at even the most basic level. Bad passes, bad reads, bad pinches. Just a bad hockey player.

I think that he is injured. IF his pain is so bad that he isn't able to think clearly then that could explain a lot of things. Without knowing his injury or pain threshold I can't say one way or another. That said if it is that bad he should not be playing period. Whatever the case, he has been terrible this season.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

AS per guidelines a team can not instruct a player to have surgery. As I understand it an employer cannot force any employee to have any medical procedure or surgery. This extends of course to professional players. In a lot of instances where there is hesitation to have procedures done this can emanate from the players decision as well.

Don't want to play doctor here but with Klefboms history of post op complications and infections he might have had concerns with having more medical treatments and might be averse to the same. I mean this guy has had several nightmare complications and infections in that regard. If I'm him I don't even want to be walking by a hospital...There might even be medical precautions and contraindications based on his known post op infection history. Many patients are considered not able to have surgery until other conditions are satisfactorily resolved. its all plausible.

In anycase we all just be guessing.

Was his infection from surgery? I thought he just got t out of the blue? If he is against having surgery and this is what he's like without it then you trade him or bench him. His play does not warrant staying in the lineup.

 

[Drivesaitl]

One thing that could be mentioned is that pain really does interfere with the thinking process. Many studies have cited that pain can appreciably impact decisions, concentration, and even to lethal degrees. For instance to use an example is many fatalities in traffic accident get killed subsequent to the initial collision. Pain response can be so severe that in countless tragic instances people have been hit after getting out of vehicles subsequent to a pain inducing accident in which they were not irreparably hurt. Basically people will get out of a vehicle and try to get away from what the non conscious part of the brain is sensing as the localized source of the pain. People have been observed walking right into traffic.

Soldiers shot on a battle field will often get up and start walking around until they are fatally shot. In the WW's this was such a constant that military training had to continually remind soldiers of this phenomenon. That soldiers hit will climb right out of bunkers or cover, right into more imminent danger. Pain does this. It prevents the brain from making logical decisions. The brain misperceives that the bunker is unsafe and walks into danger and open fire. Its an inate animal response to try to escape pain. To try to run from it..this is hardwired caveman type behavior.

Similarly people inhaling fumes in a tower fire will jump right out a window to escape what the brain perceives as the danger without factoring in any other danger such as gravity...

Anyway, that's a tangent but just examples where pain impacts severely. Lots of studies indicate that decision making and thought process is severely impacted by recurring and ongoing pain.

 

[Little Fury]

I don't buy the injury excuse.

None of his struggles stem from something physical.

He's somehow forgot how to play defense at even the most basic level. Bad passes, bad reads, bad pinches. Just a bad hockey player.

If you think a physical ailment doesn't impact the mental side, I don't know what to tell you except "watch more sports."

 

[Drivesaitl]

Was his infection from surgery? I thought he just got t out of the blue? If he is against having surgery and this is what he's like without it then you trade him or bench him. His play does not warrant staying in the lineup.

As I understand it from information presented the shoulder injury developed exterior or interior abssess which can often occur if there is appreciable swelling, constant use, and rubbing from equipment and such. Also repeated movements very subject to getting sores, swelling and infections. The bodies natural response to injury is to create swelling to immobilize an area. You shouldn't continue to keep using it if it is swelling a lot.

My understanding it is was either an infection that occurred at skin surface or in muscle matter due to contusion, swelling etc. It does compound things if theres any open sores and continual use. Hockey equipment is notoriously unclean and an infectious mechanism. Even pro equipment that is cleaned and sanitized a lot.

In anycase Bryan I did not state that Klef is averse to surgery. I just explained how he could be. Nor would I blame him at all. The fellow had a traumatic infection, series of them, that became a very serious medical situation in which potentially could have involved worst scenario amputation or worse. His infection was quite severe. His antibiotics regimen as reported was quite significant and he had several relapses of the prior foot infection.

 

[McDNicks17]

If you think a physical ailment doesn't impact the mental side, I don't know what to tell you except "watch more sports."

Why would he be playing if he's in so much pain that he can't even think the game at near an NHL level?

 

[Drivesaitl]

Why would he be playing if he's in so much pain that he can't even think the game at near an NHL level?

Because oilers.

That is the scientific answer..

 

[Panda Bear]

Injuries affect the mental side.

If you're playing through injury, you're more hesitant. If you're hesitant, then your timing is off. If your timing is off, you will make mistakes and commit errors. If you keep playing through your injury, those mistakes and errors become your habits because that's your new normal.

It's a recipe to ruin confidence.

It's a rare player that doesn't have his game dramatically impacted by injury. Shoulder injuries are one of the worst to play through in hockey because it f***s with your mechanics.

I can't think of a single player with a hand or shoulder injury that required off-season surgery who had a good season leading up to it.

 

[Little Fury]

Why would he be playing if he's in so much pain that he can't even think the game at near an NHL level?

You're begging the question here. It's pretty easy to see how an injury can mess with a player's ability to physically execute and lead to mistakes that give the appearance of a mental lapse.

 

[Panda Bear]

Why would he be playing if he's in so much pain that he can't even think the game at near an NHL level?

He wouldn't be. He would be playing with cortisol injections.

 

[Drivesaitl]

He wouldn't be. He would be playing with cortisol injections.

Yep. But pain will still be experienced, just less, and later. Cortisol injections do not preclude pain or pain avoidance. They mitigate pain.

But this is NFL bad and should be similarly frowned upon. NHL and hockey really need to smarten up on stuff like this.

Players are not chattel. Several pro sports instances have revealed teams that encourage players to get shots, play through injuries, keep incurring that greater risk of serious injury.

These are never good ideas. I could see the incentive to do something like it in playoffs. To try to have the player in the lineup further to getting further in the playoffs.

Doing this for meaningless regular season games is imo poor form. I'd wonder whether it is due to a desperation of this org, and incumbent coaches and management, to try to get short term results while risking long term consequence.

 

[Jet Walters]

What if we put some of Karlsson's ankle into Klefbom's shoulder this offseason? Katz knows some science dudes, right?

 

[McDNicks17]

You're begging the question here. It's pretty easy to see how an injury can mess with a player's ability to physically execute and lead to mistakes that give the appearance of a mental lapse.

Obviously an injury can affect the mental side, but in Klefbom's case, this is a player who went from a good player to a player who very clearly shouldn't be in the NHL.

Either the player/coaches/doctors are idiots and allowing him to play through an incredibly serious injury or the injury isn't that serious and he isn't nearly affected by it as some think.

I lean toward the latter since the former would be absolutely nonsensical considering the season they're having, but I guess we are talking about the Oilers.

 

[Cloned]

Obviously an injury can affect the mental side, but in Klefbom's case, this is a player who went from a good player to a player who very clearly shouldn't be in the NHL.

Either the player/coaches/doctors are idiots and allowing him to play through an incredibly serious injury or the injury isn't that serious and he isn't nearly affected by it as some think.

#OilersSophiesChoice

 

[frag2]

I don't buy the injury excuse.

None of his struggles stem from something physical.

He's somehow forgot how to play defense at even the most basic level. Bad passes, bad reads, bad pinches. Just a bad hockey player.

Basically what I've been saying. I mean, I'm not saying he might not be sore but it's a physical sport-everyone will go through that.
He's a physical specimen. That said, his ability to play the game at the level expected of him isn't there. Even last year he was a mess at times but saved by Larsson.

I think that he is injured. IF his pain is so bad that he isn't able to think clearly then that could explain a lot of things. Without knowing his injury or pain threshold I can't say one way or another. That said if it is that bad he should not be playing period. Whatever the case, he has been terrible this season.

He shouldn't be playing if he's THAT injured. Hence why people questioning the injury angle. The bad plays, miscues, that's all mental.

 

[fuswald]

With the playoffs completely out of the picture, Klefbom should be benched if it's something he needs to heal from. If that doesn't happen there's two options: 1. resting/surgery won't actually solve the problem or 2. the oilers org is incompetent.

Third option he may possibly be traded and cannot go on the ir

 

[LaGu]

Why would he be playing if he's in so much pain that he can't even think the game at near an NHL level?

Again I am at a loss. His injury/bruise, or whatever you want to call it, affected him in that at times when hit or involved in physical play he got very sore and had to eat meds for the pain (or get injections). This is fairly clear from what he said. What is also clear, was said and makes sense (at least to me) is that the effects of this, or the consequences of it, was that he could not play his game, i.e. he was not 100%. When things went south (according to himself from game 2 and onwards) it went to his head and he didn't manage to get out of it... His confidence at an all time low according to TM and also the media/constant questioning getting to hjm.

Seeing as he had his break in end of December I suppose he had troubles until then, and I could imagine that he is still not 100% but I don't know that obviously.

He is struggling of course, it started out because of his injury and keeps on because it got to him. I don't see why that has to be contested by calling him stupid etc., it is easy to see how he got there as a young D supposed to be #1, imo of course. Same as any player having a down year he needs to get out of it, that is on him.

What I don't get is the constant questioning of how/why this started (which was evident to the majority even after 20 or some games even though he/TM didn't comment) and also how people don't see how a physical ailmemt can have severe impacts on the head, i.e. decision making.

See goalies, the biggest head cases of all. They can go from nothing to borderline Vezina (and back again) in no time. And they are the first to admit it is in their heads.

 

[Spawn]

Third option he may possibly be traded and cannot go on the ir

Players can be traded while on IR.

 

[KMart27]

Klefbom's decision making didn't just become a problem this season. It has always been a problem.

 

[MinimaMoralia]

Kinda reminds me a bunch of Joni Pitkanen.
Though, Pitkanen was a beautiful skater even at his worst.

 

[LaGu]

Klefbom's decision making didn't just become a problem this season. It has always been a problem.

It is something that many have indicated before, me too, and it is fairly normal for young D (keep in mind he's is 24 years old but has lost almost two seasons to injury already) . However, you cannot pretend that this season is even remotely similar to last or the one before.

Think what you want of him but it is getting amazingly annoying with hindsight kings on this sight. Give me more than a handful of posters/media who thought he'd regress in this manner from last season to this one because "he is just too stupid" and I'll buy you milk and cookies.

 

[Spawn]

Kinda reminds me a bunch of Joni Pitkanen.
Though, Pitkanen was a beautiful skater even at his worst.

Pitkanen would be a great example of what not to do with Klefbom. Traded him for Erik freaking Cole who was here for 3/4 a season while the Hurricanes ended up with a good top 4 d-man for a number of years before injuries unfortunately derailed his career.

 

[KMart27]

It is something that many have indicated before, me too, and it is fairly normal for young D (keep in mind he's is 24 years old but has lost almost two seasons to injury already) . However, you cannot pretend that this season is even remotely similar to last or the one before.

Think what you want of him but it is getting amazingly annoying with hindsight kings on this sight. Give more than a handful of posters/media who though he'd regress in this manner from last season to this one because "he is just too stupid" and I'll buy you milk and cookies.

He actually played well the last two seasons. This season he hasn't and the two major reasons why are his health and his decision making. Is it not concerning that both of these are recurring issues?

 

[MinimaMoralia]

Pitkanen would be a great example of what not to do with Klefbom. Traded him for Erik freaking Cole who was here for 3/4 a season while the Hurricanes ended up with a good top 4 d-man for a number of years before injuries unfortunately derailed his career.

Maaaan, that whole series of trading was terrible. Smith and Lupul for Pitkanen, who turned into Cole, who turned into O'Sullivan, who turned into Vandermeer..
Oilers gonna Oiler.

 

[LaGu]

He actually played well the last two seasons. This season he hasn't and the two major reasons why are his health and his decision making. Is it not concerning that both of these are recurring issues?

Well that depends, his health issues have not affected his on-ice performance until this year imho. In fact he has often surpassed expectations when coming back from them. His decision making has never been his forte, but it has led to a gaffe here and there which the team could afford in light of his positive contributions.

Anyhow, I see the connection you are doing but I don't see the history of such a connection in his case. So I will bet on him coming back to form similar to that of the last two years, a good D who even though he makes a gaffe now and again can play decent 1st pair game if paired with a good partner. Gaffes normally reduce when gaining experience so I wouldn't be too worried about it tbh.