Kitchener Rangers 2018-19 Season Thread (Part 2)

[Coaches Coroner]

Agreed. Missed the game last night but it sounds like the last couple of Fridays. My manta is "Stick with Pfeil, dump the coach and scouting team, now". Then time to trade off some assets. It is not going to happen next year as you cannot build a team around one player (Damiani) and OA er's. As I mentioned earlier, I don't want to see us trade our way into a contender as we did last year. Let's hire someone that can identify raw talent.

Or someone who can develop raw talent.

The only remotely positive take away from that game (although I expected a blow out to a true contender) is that, unlike past years, we didn't take the loss lying down. You saw guys getting physical and chippy in the third, perhaps those players showing they care and that they don't like losing. In the past we would have taken the beating on the scoreboard and been docile and cordial to the other team to finish the game.

 

[bobber]

Man I don't know if we could even watch a game if things got worse. It's like watching the same boring movie over and over. Other than a couple of dust ups the last couple of games it's like watching paint dry at the Aud. It's not all about winning a game. It's about being competitive. You have to see some talent on your roster. Every team that comes in regardless of the standings seems to have bigger stronger players peppered through out their roster. One of our bigger defensemen Jack Eye sat out. Good thing the Dogs took it easy in the third or the place would have been a ghost town.

 

[Rangers True Blue]

Nothing surprising last night. Once it went 4-0, Rangers sagged. They knew the outcome but hey, it's teams like Niagara's turn this year. 18 and 19 years olds up against 16 and 17 year olds. Was it ever going to turn out any other way?

Saying that though, one has to wonder if it would have at least been closer if Richardson had been pulled earlier (as in MUCH earlier) in favour of Pfeil. He looked great in the 3rd against a stacked team and was aggressive on the puck. He doesn't wait for it. He goes after it.

Speaking of going after it, what was THAT in the 3rd? Bumping Pfeil behind the net when you could have skated right past (and don't tell me he couldn't have). Seriously. You're up 6-1 and you have to pull crap like that?

I do give the boys credit for coming back in the 3rd and not giving up. I was surprised actually but did like their feisty attitude which created some "festivities" on the ice that woke up what Rangers fans that were left in the building.

And I'm not going to jump on the "scrap the team, dump the coaching staff, get rid of the scouts" bandwagon. All of this is "as expected" and frankly, as it should be during a rebuild. Why is anyone surprised??

 

[Rangers True Blue]

Man I don't know if we could even watch a game if things got worse. It's like watching the same boring movie over and over. Other than a couple of dust ups the last couple of games it's like watching paint dry at the Aud. It's not all about winning a game. It's about being competitive. You have to see some talent on your roster. Every team that comes in regardless of the standings seems to have bigger stronger players peppered through out their roster. One of our bigger defensemen Jack Eye sat out. Good thing the Dogs took it easy in the third or the place would have been a ghost town.

Yes, sit out X because having Gareffa on D instead of up front is working out so well...

 

[Kenny Chu]

Yes, sit out X because having Gareffa on D instead of up front is working out so well...

One predication. This coach wont last the season because the GM will fire the coach to save himself. I think this will play out and if it doesn't happen during the season it'll happen in the off season.

 

[EvenSteven]

As a hockey fan, watching the Ice Dogs was a thing of beauty. As a Rangers fan, it's a reminder of of pre-season prediction of a mid conference finish.

The Ice Dogs have it all, speed. skill, defense and size. It will be interesting seeing them play the Knights after the Knights make their moves. Sure gives the Rangers something to aim for. Might be time to add some more scouts or make some changes in that staff.

I'm still not discounting Guelph in the west and Ottawa in the east. A lot can happen between now and the deadline.

 

[bobber]

Nothing surprising last night. Once it went 4-0, Rangers sagged. They knew the outcome but hey, it's teams like Niagara's turn this year. 18 and 19 years olds up against 16 and 17 year olds. Was it ever going to turn out any other way?

Saying that though, one has to wonder if it would have at least been closer if Richardson had been pulled earlier (as in MUCH earlier) in favour of Pfeil. He looked great in the 3rd against a stacked team and was aggressive on the puck. He doesn't wait for it. He goes after it.

Speaking of going after it, what was THAT in the 3rd? Bumping Pfeil behind the net when you could have skated right past (and don't tell me he couldn't have). Seriously. You're up 6-1 and you have to pull crap like that?

I do give the boys credit for coming back in the 3rd and not giving up. I was surprised actually but did like their feisty attitude which created some "festivities" on the ice that woke up what Rangers fans that were left in the building.

And I'm not going to jump on the "scrap the team, dump the coaching staff, get rid of the scouts" bandwagon. All of this is "as expected" and frankly, as it should be during a rebuild. Why is anyone surprised??

Just to add a point. Rangers have ten players not counting Hall who shows on their roster that are 99's and 98's. In a so called rebuild season they should be showing better than they have with that many older players.

 

[EvenSteven]

Last night we saw the difference between a contender and a team struggling to compete. The Ice Dogs are a contender this year. I had the impression the Rangers had some speed on their roster. The Dogs skated circles around the Rangers and seem to score at will. IMO it's time for the coach to give Pfeil the reins. The Richardson experiment is over. Rangers are what they are this year. They should get a good pick in the draft if the scouts know what they are doing but recently I have my doubts.

I figured we'd start Richardson last night. No point in starting Pfiel against that onslaught of offence. Save him and his confidence for Guelph on Sunday.

 

[EvenSteven]

Just to add a point. Rangers have ten players not counting Hall who shows on their roster that are 99's and 98's. In a so called rebuild season they should be showing better than they have with that many older players.

True in a way. But we had almost the same amount of 97's and 98's last year. Quality trumps quantity.

It's telling when every one of your 99's are virtual locks to play OA seasons.

 

[EvenSteven]

Nothing surprising last night. Once it went 4-0, Rangers sagged. They knew the outcome but hey, it's teams like Niagara's turn this year. 18 and 19 years olds up against 16 and 17 year olds. Was it ever going to turn out any other way?

Saying that though, one has to wonder if it would have at least been closer if Richardson had been pulled earlier (as in MUCH earlier) in favour of Pfeil. He looked great in the 3rd against a stacked team and was aggressive on the puck. He doesn't wait for it. He goes after it.

Speaking of going after it, what was THAT in the 3rd? Bumping Pfeil behind the net when you could have skated right past (and don't tell me he couldn't have). Seriously. You're up 6-1 and you have to pull crap like that?

I do give the boys credit for coming back in the 3rd and not giving up. I was surprised actually but did like their feisty attitude which created some "festivities" on the ice that woke up what Rangers fans that were left in the building.

And I'm not going to jump on the "scrap the team, dump the coaching staff, get rid of the scouts" bandwagon. All of this is "as expected" and frankly, as it should be during a rebuild. Why is anyone surprised??

I'm not so sure Pfiel fares much better in the first two periods had he started. As was said, Niagara eased off in the third as their bottom six saw most of the minutes.

 

[K2]

The Richardson experiment is over.

Agreed, it's time to lead with whoever is playing better ... though I don't expect we've secretly been stifling a saviour in Pfeil and even if I'm wrong, Pfeil won't be making any passes or scoring any goals. I think last night's bronx cheers for Richardson upon saving a couple long clearing passes we're really disappointing and not something I readily recall another Ranger G receiving in the Aud during the 5 decades that I've attended games. Drop Gibson/Mason/Edwards in there and we still don't likely have much chance to win that one IMO, especially if the Dogs keep their foot on the gas for 60min.

 

[GeoBlue]

... though I don't expect we've secretly been stifling a saviour in Pfeil

Not a saviour but definitely the better goalie at this point. Final year next year and Ritchie will be an OA. Makes sense perhaps to move Richardson for whatever we can get for him. Let's bring in our future goaltender, whomever that may be.

 

[EvenSteven]

Not a saviour but definitely the better goalie at this point. Final year next year and Ritchie will be an OA. Makes sense perhaps to move Richardson for whatever we can get for him. Let's bring in our future goaltender, whomever that may be.

I'd like to develop our own #1 goaltender for a change instead of trading for one. The last time we developed our own goaltender from a young rookie into his graduation as a true #1 was Scott Dickie.

That's a long time ago. Almost 20 years since he was drafted.

 

[Rangers True Blue]

Not a saviour but definitely the better goalie at this point. Final year next year and Ritchie will be an OA. Makes sense perhaps to move Richardson for whatever we can get for him. Let's bring in our future goaltender, whomever that may be.

Pfeil needs to develop this season if Rangers hope to have an even better goalie next season. And agreed, get our future goalie into the mix somewhere along the way.

 

[EvenSteven]

One predication. This coach wont last the season because the GM will fire the coach to save himself. I think this will play out and if it doesn't happen during the season it'll happen in the off season.

I don't believe for a minute that this GM has to worry about saving himself. He's regarded as one of the bright young minds in the OHL today.

On the other hand, I do believe a rejigging of the scouting department needs to be done.

 

[EvenSteven]

Or someone who can develop raw talent.

The only remotely positive take away from that game (although I expected a blow out to a true contender) is that, unlike past years, we didn't take the loss lying down. You saw guys getting physical and chippy in the third, perhaps those players showing they care and that they don't like losing. In the past we would have taken the beating on the scoreboard and been docile and cordial to the other team to finish the game.

In all honesty, the way we got chippy once the game was out of hand last night has been the MO of the London Knights in this league since the Hunters took the team over. We roasted them for it calling them sore losers etc etc.

However, if nothing else, it does send a message that if you're not going to win, you better at least make sure the opposition leaves the Aud with a few bruises along with the W. Also, it gives fans a reason to stick around in the event they may miss some extra curriculars.

I'm all for it.

 

[EvenSteven]

Then time to trade off some assets. It is not going to happen next year as you cannot build a team around one player (Damiani) and OA er's. As I mentioned earlier, I don't want to see us trade our way into a contender as we did last year. Let's hire someone that can identify raw talent.

I'm also of the opinion we likely won't contend next year. I've said it on here before. We need to sell anyone who won't be here to start the 2020-21 season. That's all the 99's and Damiani.

The return we got at the deadline for 19 year olds Mason Kohn (2nd, 3rd, 3rd) and Jacob Cascagnette (3rd, 4th) going into their OA seasons was more than I thought we'd get. We have four guys this year (Meireles, McHugh, Garreffa, and Yantsis) in the same boat as these guys who are all, in my opinion, more valuable than the two above. No reason we can't move all four in a fire sale and get very good return for them - especially since all four are destined to play OA seasons.

We need to test the market as to what we can get for Damiani at this deadline. The kid is a star in this league. He's the kind of character player teams win with. He should bring more in trade than he will in the off season or at next trade deadline. If the return at this deadline doesn't reflect that, then keep him until next deadline.

The return for Vallati wasn't what it should have been for a top pairing ( by next year), NHL drafted d-man with, at the time of the trade, two full years of eligibility left in this league plus a possible OA season.

Sure, he asked to be traded so that likely brings the price down a bit but in truth, we could have gotten that return for him at next year's trade deadline.

I'm more interested in why he asked for a trade. Whatever the reason, the fact he did request a trade is a failing of our management staff somehow. No way this player doesn't get top 4 minutes on this roster and that's before the latest Hall injury.

 

[EvenSteven]

Yes, sit out X because having Gareffa on D instead of up front is working out so well...

I don't want X out of the lineup either, but Garreffa is currently among the leaders in scoring for d-men - and that's on a crappy team. Moving him up won't change our fortunes.

Tough to move him back up to forward at this point. And to be honest, moving him up now would likely hurt his trade value. He's shown what he can do as a D on a contending team last spring. I suspect a contending team who may be looking for help on the blueline would've seen that as well.

IMO, as a forward, Joey G is average at this level. As a D he's above average.

 

[Coaches Coroner]

One predication. This coach wont last the season because the GM will fire the coach to save himself. I think this will play out and if it doesn't happen during the season it'll happen in the off season.

Whatever happens this season, MM's job is nowhere near in jeopardy imo. I think McKee's job is on the line because in the 2 seasons we weren't going for it, where development is the main goal, very little has occurred. If you want to keep a coach long term, they have to show they are solid at coaching to win games (he arguably demonstrated ability in that area last season in the playoffs) but so far this season and the one before last, he hasn't shown he can get players to take the next step in development. Other than that, I think he has to look at the scouting and see whose pulling their wait and who isn't and possibly make some changes there.

I'm still not discounting Guelph in the west and Ottawa in the east. A lot can happen between now and the deadline.

Ya, I'm pretty sure this is year is Guelphs window to go for it. Sure you have Merkley back next season, but there isn't much their beyond him and Hillis. 4 of their top 5 forward scorers are 19 (including big guns like Ratcliffe and Schnarr) are gone next year with no one to replace him and probably their best defending Dman in Samorukov is gone. They could add pieces to this squad to contend, not sure the same can be said for their squad next year.

York had another defensive stinker, while Vukojevic was decent in his end (one goal they scored York hung him out to dry on a 2 on 1) and showed some confidence jumping in on plays offensively...only for York to be rewarded with more PP time late in a blowout, instead of giving Vuk some time in a situation where there is 0 risk with the game out of hand. #FreeVuk.

 

[johnnyhockey1982]

Joey G is an incredibly skilled hockey player but I think he would add more value to the team if he goes back to playing forward….. last 16 games he is a minus 14 and put up 13 points however 8 of his 13 points have been on powerplay.
Should put Jack eye back on D and have Joey G play forward while Riley is out.

 

[bobber]

From Brown:
"Gentles picked up two for a bench minor. It looked like he grabbed an IceDog from the bench during a third period melee. Niagara staff say they have video and that a suspension could be on its way".

Just thought a team in contention would be more sportsman like if this is true. Kind of a low brow unprofessional thing to throw out there. It's not like the Dogs were wearing a halo when the banged Pfeil in the head behind the net.

 

[Medway Bear]

A few comments on last night.

The Ice Dogs looked good and the Rangers pretty much what I expected at the start of the season. I expect more of the same as the season progresses.

Richardson was hung out to dry by his team mates for 2 periods. If Pfeil had started Richardson would have played the 3rd.

Who is running the team? The coach or the players? Garreffa is playing D because he asked the coach if he could? I love how much time he gets to carry the puck up the ice, but come on, he scores 20 goals mainly playing forward as a 17 year old. The Rangers need more scoring depth, put him up front now Gentles is back.

 

[Gondrex]

True in a way. But we had almost the same amount of 97's and 98's last year. Quality trumps quantity.

It's telling when every one of your 99's are virtual locks to play OA seasons.

I definitely agree with both of you guys. My question is, if this is called a rebuild year with similar numbers of 19 & 20 year-olds, what do we call next year when there will actually be fewer "older" players. Mind you, as you point out Even, I fully expect that rebuild process to start within the next few weeks already.

My one concern is what this team receives in return. Are there more sellers than buyers? Has Owen Sound decided to become one of those sellers and trade their superior quality assets, and watering down the value of less talented players in the process? It will be interesting to see how this plays out.

All I know is that this experiment of drafting smaller finesse players almost exclusively needs to change. Last time I checked they haven't taken body checking out of the rule book......ummm.... at least not completely.

 

[bobber]

A few comments on last night.

The Ice Dogs looked good and the Rangers pretty much what I expected at the start of the season. I expect more of the same as the season progresses.

Richardson was hung out to dry by his team mates for 2 periods. If Pfeil had started Richardson would have played the 3rd.

Who is running the team? The coach or the players? Garreffa is playing D because he asked the coach if he could? I love how much time he gets to carry the puck up the ice, but come on, he scores 20 goals mainly playing forward as a 17 year old. The Rangers need more scoring depth, put him up front now Gentles is back.

Medway just a point on Garreffa asking to play defense. Not to beat the proverbial dead horse but when Deboer was here no player would dare go to his office and ask to play another position or even ask for more ice.
On Richy I never like fans being sarcastic cheering a Ranger goalie. If they were pros and you paid 300 bucks for your seat go for it. But these are teenagers. Richy is playing on a team with an extemely weak defense. Watch the Dmen when opposing forwards come at them with speed. They panic and in many instances leave opponents alone in front of the net with no coverage. In saying that I thought at the beginning of the season the team was playing great defense and Richardson was actually getting noticed. On a very average skilled team we are presently watching he is the last line of defense. As an example in minor hockey if the team is weak the goalie always takes it on the chin by the players parents. Teams like the Ice Dogs will always expose every weakness on your squad.

 

[ohloutsider]

Watched the game against Niagara and yes it was a struggle but what concerned me the most was how your TV personalities handled it. They kept saying Kitchener is a "young" team and with all this youth it was a learning curve for the young players and team. Now not sure why it bothered me but they kept throwing it out there so I decided to check - turns out Kitchener is the 8th oldest team with 12 other teams being younger than Kitchener ( from Elite Prospects). So if anything Kitchener is one of the older teams in the league. I have no bone to grind with you guys it is more of my frustration across the league on how either the TV guys don't know the facts or tend to stretch numbers to suit their needs. Yes this is every city and all broadcast teams and yes they are volunteers for the most part but I just wish they would not put misleading info out there. Again nothing to do with you guys, enjoy the posts on this thread just needed to rant somewhere and that game was my best example.