KHL business aspects discussion

Jumptheshark

Rebooting myself
Oct 12, 2003
99,859
13,840
Somewhere on Uranus
Oh such a shame he ONLY received $250k for living in Russia...

I mean I see your point, if they agreed one 1 amount they changed it its abit shady but lets be honest, nobody is losing out here. These foreign players come and chase the easy oil money then complain because living in Yugra isn't the same as living in LA.


the problem is the team did pay the amount in the contract. Problem was the players and agents saw that US or Canadian amount and were expecting that when they got home. When the ruble went in the crapper players still the exchange rate prior to the dive in their mind
 

vorky

@vorkywh24
Jan 23, 2010
11,404
1,269
Biznis Online made Fan Cost Index, here (a link at the end of the article with FCI for every team). They collected a data from 22 teams. Jokerit-Slovan-Traktor-Admiral-Severstal did not participate.

3a6a-f1a5fb72a3b418523592f82b08ade4d7.jpg


from left: ticket, kid ticket, parking, beer, soda, pizza/hot dog, scarf, jersey, cap

Can anybody write a sum of the items from the missing clubs?
 

RossiyaSport

Registered User
Aug 18, 2017
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True, some players can't resist give into the temptation of playing up to Russophobia to try to get a job in the Western hockey media establishment. Ryan Whitney is a good example of that. He put out so many lies and bs in that Players Tribune thing and all the Russophobes in the Western hockey establishment were joyously tweeting it out like it was the greatest thing written since the bible. Then when called out on their bs they will just respond with like "oh I was being snarky".

I will give an example of how big of a liar Ryan Whitney is. When he was there he put out a tweet something like "its December and I haven't seen so much as a wreath". Anyone familiar with Russia knows the Christmas/New Years decorations start going up in mid November and are fully up at the end of November or first week in December. Red Square has one of the biggest Christmas villages in the world. Every city square and point of interest has a tree. Every big shopping mall, hotel, airport etc does as well. Just steps from where Whitney played was a gigantic tree in the Olympic park.
 

Exarz

Registered User
Jan 1, 2014
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Helsinki
True, some players can't resist give into the temptation of playing up to Russophobia to try to get a job in the Western hockey media establishment. Ryan Whitney is a good example of that. He put out so many lies and bs in that Players Tribune thing and all the Russophobes in the Western hockey establishment were joyously tweeting it out like it was the greatest thing written since the bible. Then when called out on their bs they will just respond with like "oh I was being snarky".

I will give an example of how big of a liar Ryan Whitney is. When he was there he put out a tweet something like "its December and I haven't seen so much as a wreath". Anyone familiar with Russia knows the Christmas/New Years decorations start going up in mid November and are fully up at the end of November or first week in December. Red Square has one of the biggest Christmas villages in the world. Every city square and point of interest has a tree. Every big shopping mall, hotel, airport etc does as well. Just steps from where Whitney played was a gigantic tree in the Olympic park.
I've read it before and I read it again. Could you please tell me what's a bunch of lies in his Player's Tribune? A lot of things are different in Russia compared to the West and from my experience, I don't see anything that different that could be a lie.
 

RossiyaSport

Registered User
Aug 18, 2017
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At a quick glance..

- Implying you can't get a haircut in Russia

- Acting like the clinic he went to was like something out of Somalia. Sochi and all the KHL and RFPL teams take photos of players getting their medical exams on social media. Its completely normal faclilities and they aren't hiding anything.

- Saying you can't get milk, breakfast sandwhiches, chicken parm or chicken fingers in Russia.

- Implying that the head coach (Butsayev) couldn't speak English when he can.

- Acting as if the import players were shell shocked in a war zone. In the KHL, RFPL, and Russia's mens and womens basketball leagues theres a ton of foreign players and they are doing just fine and most can't speak a lick of Russian.

- Acting like going to a grocery store was some wild adventure. Theres a nice Magnit (big chain in Russia) store about a mile from where he lived.

Down the street from the Olympic park is an Irish Pub. They had a special event for Whitney where people asked him questions in English. Of course he doesn't mention that. No, instead he portrays their city as a post Apocalypse Barbarian cesspool.

He just played on every goofy stereotype to try to get attention and parlay his anti Russian snarkiness into a media job.
 

Jussi

Registered User
Feb 28, 2002
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Butsayev played 10 years in America. Yet he says that he doesn't speak English...

Actually some Finnish players have said similar things about some former Russian NHL players who are part of the coaching staff. They clearly understand and speak English but for some reason refuse to use it or in some cases only do so with "star players".
 

Rigafan

Registered User
Jul 28, 2016
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Europe
Actually some Finnish players have said similar things about some former Russian NHL players who are part of the coaching staff. They clearly understand and speak English but for some reason refuse to use it or in some cases only do so with "star players".
Shouldn't it be the players who are chasing the money be the ones making the effort to learn the local language? Or with their money they make hire a translator?

You'd never see a Finn or whatever complain that the NHL team staff don't speak Finnish would you?
 
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SoundAndFury

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May 28, 2012
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Shouldn't the teams chasing the players be the ones making the effort?

How is your argument better than this one? How are the players "chasing money" and not the teams chasing the players?

At the end of the day, any company in whatever field when acquiring services of professional worker makes it their responsibility to communicate with him properly because it's in their best interests. Your argument belittles the players in such a disgusting way. You are talking about them like they were some immigrant construction worker. That's bush league.

Not to mention that there is a difference between speaking Finnish and speaking the language which is universally understood by the western world.
 

Jussi

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Feb 28, 2002
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Shouldn't it be the players who are chasing the money be the ones making the effort to learn the local language? Or with their money they make hire a translator?

You'd never see a Finn or whatever complain that the NHL team staff don't speak Finnish would you?

You do understand that English is the easiest lnguage to learn where as Russian is not? My friends sister studied Russian since 7th grade and she said she considered herself a fluent speaker after about 6 years, just before going to university. How about you spend a year in Finland and we'll see how well you speak or understnad Finnish. :laugh:
 

vorky

@vorkywh24
Jan 23, 2010
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You do understand that English is the easiest lnguage to learn where as Russian is not? My friends sister studied Russian since 7th grade and she said she considered herself a fluent speaker after about 6 years, just before going to university. How about you spend a year in Finland and we'll see how well you speak or understnad Finnish. :laugh:
Your typical generalisation. It differs person by person. For someone is English easier, for another it is Russian or Spanish or French or other language.

On the other hand, it should be normal that you learn a language where you work and live. There are only two "major hockey languages", English and Russian. Should not be a problem for a prospect to learn both since childhood. Russian is an official language of the KHL, so it is normal they use it in communication. Even if a Russian guy knows English, still it is not a native language for him, perhaps he feels more confident when speaking Russian.

And yes, Russian is not Finnish. Russian language is one of world languages, Finnish is not.
 

Jussi

Registered User
Feb 28, 2002
91,022
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Mojo Dojo Casa House
Your typical generalisation. It differs person by person. For someone is English easier, for another it is Russian or Spanish or French or other language.

On the other hand, it should be normal that you learn a language where you work and live. There are only two "major hockey languages", English and Russian. Should not be a problem for a prospect to learn both since childhood. Russian is an official language of the KHL, so it is normal they use it in communication. Even if a Russian guy knows English, still it is not a native language for him, perhaps he feels more confident when speaking Russian.

And yes, Russian is not Finnish. Russian language is one of world languages, Finnish is not.

For "Western people" Russian is a difficult language, that was the point.

There's only one major hockey language and that is English. Period.
 

vorky

@vorkywh24
Jan 23, 2010
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For "Western people" Russian is a difficult language, that was the point.

There's only one major hockey language and that is English. Period.

Darren Dietz was born in Canada, he has no problem to learn a language and a culture of a region where his KHL team is located.
 
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Rigafan

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Jul 28, 2016
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Europe
For "Western people" Russian is a difficult language, that was the point.

There's only one major hockey language and that is English. Period.

I'd argue there is 3. English, Russian and French - which we can thank Montreal/Quebec for.

In response to my 'belittling' of players. I'd disagree. I see your point but if a company in X country wanted to hire me for my skills, they'd still expect me to work and operate in their language and not make reservations for mine. Why should a sportsman/woman get any other treatment?
 

SoundAndFury

Registered User
May 28, 2012
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I see your point but if a company in X country wanted to hire me for my skills, they'd still expect me to work and operate in their language and not make reservations for mine. Why should a sportsman/woman get any other treatment?
I can a can assure you from my personal experiences, literally nobody expects you to operate in their language. They either talk English or don't hire you. And if you get paid 300k euros per year they make sure they can communicate with you. That's what makes hockey players different from others - the size of investment made to get them and the nature of business. This applies from German Oberliga to SHL, to, I assume, KHL as well.

Or do you really think someone signed to play in Romania for a year starts learning Romanian real fast?
 

malkinfan

Registered User
Aug 20, 2006
4,315
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Canada
the problem is the team did pay the amount in the contract. Problem was the players and agents saw that US or Canadian amount and were expecting that when they got home. When the ruble went in the crapper players still the exchange rate prior to the dive in their mind

In this scenario 100% the agents fault. If contract is denominated in rubles you immediately go the bank and take out foreign exchange forward contracts to hedge against FX rate movements. If the rate goes up, you gain on your hockey contract and suffer offsetting loss on the FX contracts, if the rate goes down, the opposite happens. Therefore you are locking in the exchange rate at whatever the rate was when you signed the contract. If we see a cross border business without hedge contracts we immediately recommend, but bank usually is on top of it before we are. So this guy must have had a bad agent and bad banker. Not KHL problem here

Simple story of having to much exposure to risk. Like I said, these guys need to have proper financial advisors and agents, not just blame KHL for everything.
 
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vorky

@vorkywh24
Jan 23, 2010
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I will put it here ...



Was the KHL broadcasted in UK before?

As I read, this channel is brand new. We will see how it will develop. Now, it is only Gagarin Cup 2018. I guess, it is a starting package, like with Chinese CCTV two (?) years ago, they will make a deal for next season or more seasons during summer. I think.
 

Tuoppi

Registered User
Sep 9, 2016
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Pori
I'd argue there is 3. English, Russian and French - which we can thank Montreal/Quebec for.

In response to my 'belittling' of players. I'd disagree. I see your point but if a company in X country wanted to hire me for my skills, they'd still expect me to work and operate in their language and not make reservations for mine. Why should a sportsman/woman get any other treatment?
Also German in Germany, Switzerland and Austria and is well understood in eastern central Europe.
 
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Rigafan

Registered User
Jul 28, 2016
902
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I will put it here ...



Was the KHL broadcasted in UK before?

As I read, this channel is brand new. We will see how it will develop. Now, it is only Gagarin Cup 2018. I guess, it is a starting package, like with Chinese CCTV two (?) years ago, they will make a deal for next season or more seasons during summer. I think.

Hi Vorky I will explain...

Yes we briefly had KHL during the last NHL lockout. Premier Sports own the rights to NHL here in the UK and they filled the void with NHL. Although they promised to continue the coverage they didn't.

They then had a vote and SHL won over KHL, Swiss and some others so we get SHL games also and NHL games.

Freesport is also run by Premier Sports and is obviously a free to air channel that is now showing all the NHL/SHL etc games.

I just REALLY REALLY hope the KHL don't block out the KHL Gamecentre because of this. Premier Sports are rubbish and unreliable (cutting NHL games short to so other random crap and forcing us to have blackouts on NHL TV)
 

vorky

@vorkywh24
Jan 23, 2010
11,404
1,269
Hi Vorky I will explain...

Yes we briefly had KHL during the last NHL lockout. Premier Sports own the rights to NHL here in the UK and they filled the void with NHL. Although they promised to continue the coverage they didn't.

They then had a vote and SHL won over KHL, Swiss and some others so we get SHL games also and NHL games.

Freesport is also run by Premier Sports and is obviously a free to air channel that is now showing all the NHL/SHL etc games.

I just REALLY REALLY hope the KHL don't block out the KHL Gamecentre because of this. Premier Sports are rubbish and unreliable (cutting NHL games short to so other random crap and forcing us to have blackouts on NHL TV)
Thanks for informations.

New broadcasting policy of the KHL, run by Lagardere, is to sell streaming rights in one package with classic TV broadcasting. Hence, geoblocking. This happened in China (CCTV and other broadcasters like Tencent), Nordic countries (Viasat) & Central Europe (Sport TV). So, I expect the same in the UK if they make a deal for 2018/19 & following seasons. I do not think they will block gamecenter in the UK during Gagarin Cup 2018. But it may happen in the future. Of course, I can be wrong, just my feelings based on a knowledge of the league.
 

vorky

@vorkywh24
Jan 23, 2010
11,404
1,269
I will put it here, not to spam elsewhere

I believe it would be CSKA, again, by a big margin. Their final series against Ak Bars would probably a little bit more competitive but still there would be no stage of disbelief throughout the series. I'm not sure whether KHL actually wants to create a competitive league in terms of parity but personally, as a huge fan of the league, I think this is an aspect they need improvements in if they want to be a successful international brand.

For years, I followed the league day and night. From Amur to Spartak, I've watched pretty much every single game I could. But now I'm having troubles concentrating - it just feels like I'm wasting my time, knowing how everything will end. Jokerit, Sochi, Loko, Torpedo... All good teams with awesome on-ice product. But in a couple of weeks, all of them will be gone. What's the point?

Of course there will be stronger sides that are more likely to win it all - I'm not asking for a toss to determine the champion. Though the way the league is structured have been problematic. OK, enough pessimism for now. Hope my courageous effort of jinxing will work and it will be Severstal against Amur in Gagarin Cup Finals.

To reply you. Yes, Chernyshenko wants more parity & economically sustainable model. All new strategy is about it. We will see how it will work.
 
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vorky

@vorkywh24
Jan 23, 2010
11,404
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I won't deny I'm bitter. Of course I am. Same things have been repeated for years but honestly I enjoyed the play a lot five years ago. The league has been developing but this benefited only top guns so far. We saw a glimpse of hope from Sibir and boom, they got raided immediately. In terms of salaries and the quality of play, sure, KHL is a good league; but it has become extremely one-sided. That needs to be dealth with. It has been already 10 years since the inception of this league. I have no idea what they're waiting for to tackle problems.

I will reply here.

As I understand Russian mentality, they always start to solve problems when are under big pressure. That has always been like this. I do not know why it is so. Perhaps, because there are more centers of power in Russia & they unite themself only when the big pressure occur. The same has happened to the KHL. The league was just fine under Medvedev, no problem with financing sources. When the sanctions started, the problems started too. The league realised they need to solve the problems. Chernyshenko came. The first thing was to secure a financial stability of the league. This goal was achieved. Now, the league has to achieve the stability of the clubs. Therefore the new strategy is in progress.
 

malkinfan

Registered User
Aug 20, 2006
4,315
33
Canada
At a quick glance..

- Implying you can't get a haircut in Russia

- Acting like the clinic he went to was like something out of Somalia. Sochi and all the KHL and RFPL teams take photos of players getting their medical exams on social media. Its completely normal faclilities and they aren't hiding anything.

- Saying you can't get milk, breakfast sandwhiches, chicken parm or chicken fingers in Russia.

- Implying that the head coach (Butsayev) couldn't speak English when he can.

- Acting as if the import players were shell shocked in a war zone. In the KHL, RFPL, and Russia's mens and womens basketball leagues theres a ton of foreign players and they are doing just fine and most can't speak a lick of Russian.

- Acting like going to a grocery store was some wild adventure. Theres a nice Magnit (big chain in Russia) store about a mile from where he lived.

Down the street from the Olympic park is an Irish Pub. They had a special event for Whitney where people asked him questions in English. Of course he doesn't mention that. No, instead he portrays their city as a post Apocalypse Barbarian cesspool.

He just played on every goofy stereotype to try to get attention and parlay his anti Russian snarkiness into a media job.


I understand this perfectly. I listen to his podcast because my brother has it on while were doing work around the house. He bashes Russia and the KHL quite often, sometimes obviously over exaggerates to get laughs. Every once in a while one of his guests will talk about it being great hockey but he will immediately change the subject to some crazy story that happened. The last podcast was a huge rant about the latest Malamud twitter blow up. Like I said in another post, things arent perfect with the KHL, but they are on the right path to growing the league, young talent and stability in the league. No one ever wants to talk about those things.
Not all, but a lot of these guys are Primadonnas. In NA they are used to everyone kissing the ground they walk on. Whitney was complaining about having to carry his own hockey bag. Thats pathetic. NHL might have such luxuries but they have the excess funds to spoil there players, by no means is this an issue with the league where this doesnt happen.
 

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