Value of: Kevin Hayes - Jets

[TS Quint]

I'd agree with what you're saying, but how do any of us know that whoever trades for Hayes has zero intention of signing him?

that’s a separate transaction.

 

[Hunter368]

Chevy traded for Stastny with the intention of re-signing him, just didn't work out. I have no idea what the plan is after this season with regards to all the contracts that will need to be re-signed at significant pay increases, but the likelihood of the Jet's being able to re-sign Hayes would be slim to none and at the bottom of the priority list if so. Now is a time that our 1st's would be extremely valuable for us moving forward as we're going to need to plug in holes with ELC players and to maintain any kind of prospect cupboard. Hayes is a good player and if we had the available cap space to re-sign him i'd be interested. But to spend a 1st knowing that he's only here for a run, that very well could end in the first round, just isn't worth it. Doesn't mean the Jet's couldn't make an offer with ready now prospects and picks outside the 1st round. and example of prospects/picks that could be available:

Logan Stanley
Jansen Harkins
Nic Petan
Brendan Lemieux
Michael Spacek
Luke Green
2nd-7th picks

Rangers may get better offer's from other teams that include a 1st, but someone mentioned that the Ranger's have had a numerous amount of recent 1st's and most of the above prospects were picked in the 2nd round (Stanley 1st round) and are NHL ready or close to NHL ready (Stanley maybe next year, most likely the year after). This isn't meant to diminish Hayes value or to be an insult, but more of a reality from what WPG could offer. If WPG is going to break the bank with a 1st and high end prospect, I doubt that Hayes would be that guy.

Totally agree with this post. I would also augment that list of potential candidates going to the Rangers could include:

- Tanev, useful bottom six player & great PK guy on a contender

- Copp, useful bottom six player & great PK guy & centre on a contender

- Lowry....not sure the Jets would part with him without a extension in place for Hayes at a reasonable rate. Great 3C & PK guy with elite defensive stats in areas, drives the 3rd line, very physical and part of the leadership group. The organization loves him, trading him would change the look of the team....possibly for the worse. This season to-date Lowry arguably has been our 2nd best & consistent forward over the 200’ of ice

 

[Pongs21]

Totally agree with this post. I would also augment that list of potential candidates going to the Rangers could include:

- Tanev, useful bottom six player & great PK guy on a contender

- Copp, useful bottom six player & great PK guy & centre on a contender

- Lowry....not sure the Jets would part with him without a extension in place for Hayes at a reasonable rate. Great 3C & PK guy with elite defensive stats in areas, drives the 3rd line, very physical and part of the leadership group. The organization loves him, trading him would change the look of the team....possibly for the worse. This season to-date Lowry arguably has been our 2nd best & consistent forward over the 200’ of ice

Copp I could see being available, but I'm not so sure on Tanev, unless he prices himself out. Lowry I can't see being moved.

 

[Zhamnov5GoalGame]

Totally agree with this post. I would also augment that list of potential candidates going to the Rangers could include:

- Tanev, useful bottom six player & great PK guy on a contender

- Copp, useful bottom six player & great PK guy & centre on a contender

- Lowry....not sure the Jets would part with him without a extension in place for Hayes at a reasonable rate. Great 3C & PK guy with elite defensive stats in areas, drives the 3rd line, very physical and part of the leadership group. The organization loves him, trading him would change the look of the team....possibly for the worse. This season to-date Lowry likely has been our 2nd best & consistent forward over the 200’ of ice

No way Lowry gets moved for anything even close to fair value. He’s on an awesome contract and is close to the most important cog in Maurice’s machine.

I don’t see the Jets even considering a move until January. That will also depend on how they are doing. The organization will likely be very hesitant to move their first again. Another thing to consider is they may decide to add a bigger piece (rental or otherwise) on defence instead. Depending how injuries and the season unfold.

Chevy pulled Stastny out of no where so who knows what he’s looking at?

No guarantee that Hayes is on their radar.
The Jets would likely need to be in a very strong position heading into the deadline to make a big move.

As people have said WPG needs to keep re-stocking the ELC cupboard for the cap crunch.

 

[One Winged Angel]

that’s a separate transaction.

While you're technically correct, it still factors into the trade.

 

[One Winged Angel]

that’s a separate transaction.

But, you also didn't answer the question.

How do any of us know a GM has or does not have intent to sign a player?

 

[TS Quint]

But, you also didn't answer the question.

How do any of us know a GM has or does not have intent to sign a player?

The question is irrelevant to his value. It’s possible but it doesn’t make any difference.

 

[One Winged Angel]

The question is irrelevant to his value. It’s possible but it doesn’t make any difference.

It's not irrelevant. You're dodging the question because it doesn't fit your narrative.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

It is irrelevant......Hayes is signed for just this year. His negotiating rights for a month or two as an UFA hold next to zero value....

 

[TS Quint]

It's not irrelevant. You're dodging the question because it doesn't fit your narrative.

I answered. It’s possible. It’s still irrelevant. It has no impact on his value. It also takes leaps of him wanting resign with the team, the team wanting to resign him and the Rangers letting the discussion take place. That’s a lot of hypotheticals and then at the end it’s irrelevant.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

It's pretty crazy how loaded WPG is with the big club and the farm.

Could Appleton realistically make an impact in the NHL?

 

[One Winged Angel]

I answered. It’s possible. It’s still irrelevant. It has no impact on his value. It also takes leaps of him wanting resign with the team, the team wanting to resign him and the Rangers letting the discussion take place. That’s a lot of hypotheticals and then at the end it’s irrelevant.

It isn't irrelevant, you don't make a move to trade for a player and right off the bat resign to the fact that the player is clearly a rental player and there's no intention of bringing that player back whatsoever.

If that's the case, San Jose just traded a bunch of assets for Erik Karlsson to have him play there for a year?

Not buying it. Stop speaking in absolutes in which you can't confirm.

 

[One Winged Angel]

I answered. It’s possible. It’s still irrelevant. It has no impact on his value. It also takes leaps of him wanting resign with the team, the team wanting to resign him and the Rangers letting the discussion take place. That’s a lot of hypotheticals and then at the end it’s irrelevant.

Oh and one other thing, hypotheticals take place quite often in sports and in business.

Drafting a player, is a hypothetical.
Making a trade, is a hypothetical.
Hiring a coach, is a hypothetical.

No one can predict the future. They're hypothetical situations in which a move is made to help create the best possible outcome for the organization.

 

[TS Quint]

It isn't irrelevant, you don't make a move to trade for a player and right off the bat resign to the fact that the player is clearly a rental player and there's no intention of bringing that player back whatsoever.

If that's the case, San Jose just traded a bunch of assets for Erik Karlsson to have him play there for a year?

Not buying it. Stop speaking in absolutes in which you can't confirm.

You’re the one saying Karlsson is going to resign in SJ with no prof there have even been discussions which is contrary to reports.

You are talking in silly hypotheticals with no supporting evidence. He’s a rental. A resigning is a separate transaction.

If you want to be taken somewhat seriously you could present the E. Kane trade as an example instead of some made up jibberish about Karlsson. But no one is doing that for Kevin Hayes.

 

[DJBiffWPG]

Copp I could see being available, but I'm not so sure on Tanev, unless he prices himself out. Lowry I can't see being moved.

Tanev is a replaceable player who’s going into UFA. Copp is RFA.

 

[Huffer]

It's pretty crazy how loaded WPG is with the big club and the farm.

Could Appleton realistically make an impact in the NHL?

Hard to say about Apples. He's looked very good in the AHL. Next question is, is he one of those guys that can make the jump?

In regards to this thread, I really hope the Jets don't move a 1st this year. We've traded a 1st, Foley, and Armia in the last year. I'd rather add a depth piece or 2 at the trade deadline for a lesser cost.

 

[Filthy Dangles]

Hard to say about Apples. He's looked very good in the AHL. Next question is, is he one of those guys that can make the jump?

In regards to this thread, I really hope the Jets don't move a 1st this year. We've traded a 1st, Foley, and Armia in the last year. I'd rather add a depth piece or 2 at the trade deadline for a lesser cost.

I'd agree. Hayes wouldn't be worth the price for you guys.

 

[One Winged Angel]

You’re the one saying Karlsson is going to resign in SJ with no prof there have even been discussions which is contrary to reports.

Moving the goalposts yet again? Feel free to quote where I said those specific words. I won't hold my breath.

What I did ask is if San Jose made the trade with the preface that they were trading for him with the intent of keeping him for just this one season, which although is technically possible, you could ask anyone who knows anything about hockey and they'd echo my sentiment, not yours.

You are talking in silly hypotheticals with no supporting evidence. He’s a rental. A resigning is a separate transaction.

What you're doing is assuming that a team is going to make a trade for a player with zero intent on signing that player from the get go, which is absolutely ridiculous. If you can't see that, you're lost and this conversation isn't worth continuing.

If you want to be taken somewhat seriously you could present the E. Kane trade as an example instead of some made up jibberish about Karlsson. But no one is doing that for Kevin Hayes.

Don't throw stones in glass houses. Telling people that long term ramifications have zero impact on whether a team would make a trade or not is one of the most ridiculous things I've ever read on this site and then to boot, you call me asking you if you think San Jose made a trade for Karlsson with the mindset that he's only playing for them for a year "made up jibberish?"

You got caught cornering yourself in a terrible argument and couldn't admit it, so you resort to childish garbage like that and yet, you're trying to advise me on how to be taken seriously?

You should learn how to stick your foot in your mouth before you go playing life coach. Grow up and get over yourself.

 

[untouchable21]

I’m not against the Jets giving up a 1st. This could be a last best chance for a couple years considering the cap crunch that’s coming. Not that I think they are going down the drain with a cap crunch but obviously some choices are going to be made with so,e talented players.

You play to win the Cup not to be the Sharks or Blues.

I just don’t think Hayes is the guy you trade your 1st for though. Doubt he gels and makes a Stastny like impact on this team.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Incredibly foolish post.

NY would be a heck of a lot better if Hayes was good...?

The Rangers D is absolute ****. They have stop gaps on wing like Spooner and Namestnikov until their prospects are ready for a bigger role.

NY is a rebuilding team. They have holes up and down their roster. Kevin Hayes is not holding them back in any sense. The fact that you assume that is mind boggling. You clearly don’t watch Rangers games, nor do you know much about Kevin Hayes.

This post is just as silly as the guy who suggested WPG has bad offensive depth.

Not quite as foolish as the guy who said Jets have no depth after all everyone should know what's going on with the contenders not the bottom feeders but still pretty bad.

 

[One Winged Angel]

I'd hate for the Jets to trade for Hayes
If he was any good the NYR would be a heck a lot better than they are right now.

Want to tell us more about how you don't watch the Rangers at all?

Little is playing stronger than Hayes why would we downgrade and give a 1st while doing that?

How does trading for Hayes downgrade from Little? If anything, it allows you to move him back to wing and makes your forward group even stronger overall.

Washington did not have to give up any firsts on their run.

Washington already had an incredible 1-2 punch in place down the middle and one of the best goalscorers the game has ever seen. They also had a perennial Vezina candidate in net. They needed depth players and the ones that they acquired weren't the caliber of a Kevin Hayes.

DSP? Not even close. Kempny was a reclamation project trade, people thought nothing of that deal. They got contributions across the board and the breakouts of Kuznetsov, Kempny, Stephenson and DSP helped them win. Ovechkin became a completely different player playing on Kuznetsov's wing. Kuznetsov had a run that resembled Sergei Fedorov circa 94-96 type play.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Want to tell us more about how you don't watch the Rangers at all?



How does trading for Hayes downgrade from Little? If anything, it allows you to move him back to wing and makes your forward group even stronger overall.



Washington already had an incredible 1-2 punch in place down the middle and one of the best goalscorers the game has ever seen. They also had a perennial Vezina candidate in net. They needed depth players and the ones that they acquired weren't the caliber of a Kevin Hayes.

DSP? Not even close. Kempny was a reclamation project trade, people thought nothing of that deal. They got contributions across the board and the breakouts of Kuznetsov, Kempny, Stephenson and DSP helped them win. Ovechkin became a completely different player playing on Kuznetsov's wing. Kuznetsov had a run that resembled Sergei Fedorov circa 94-96 type play.

I already admitted that my comment was foolish. Sorry no I don't watch Rangers just like you probably didn't watch much Jets when we were out of playoff contention and before we had Laine.
We already have one of the best goalscorers the game has ever seen in Laine. We have a top 10 center in Schiefle. Ultimately, as many people have already said here I don't think we are in the position to sign Hayes long term. That said why would we give up a 1st round pick in one of the deepest drafts. We already have Ehlers, Connor, Schiefle, Wheeler, Laine. Why would we move Little to the wing when we already have one of the strongest, if not strongest teams when it comes to Wingers. All we really need is a D.

 

[Kupo]

We already have one of the best goalscorers the game has ever seen in Laine.

Laine is an exceptional scorer, but he has a very long way he go before you can back that statement up.

 

[major major]

I don't think Hayes is a much better bet than Little or Roslovic. In any case, the Jets have about 40-50 more games to watch and see how their centers shake out.

 

[Adam da bomb]

Laine is an exceptional scorer, but he has a very long way he go before you can back that statement up.

I don't need to back that statement up. Either he does or in 2 weeks this conversation will already be forgotten.