KESSEL:Fact or Fiction

Status
Not open for further replies.

stocktrader

Guest
pavel datsyuk said:
are you that blind?

its the same thing!!!!!!!!!

Kovalchuk taunted the oilers bench. Malkin taunted the USA's bench.

Whats the difference? :madfire:
It is not the same thing. Not even close.
 

Grave77digger

Registered User
Feb 27, 2004
2,590
7
profiles.sports.yahoo.com
stocktrader said:
Exactly. Calling him a kid is a poor excuse. He has been drafted into the NHL. I don't see him as the type of player who can lead a team to the Stanley Cup... I was actually a little dissapointed O'sullivan didn't lay a beating on him. He will learn in time...


didnt you see osullivan get layed out by that monster hit from malkin? :amazed:
 

rt

The Kinder, Gentler Version
May 13, 2004
96,890
45,263
A Rockwellian Pleasantville
Okay, so Kessel is a hockey player, and he plays a little dirty behind the referee's back, right? That's what this thread is about? I have just three words in response to that. They are; BIG, ****ING and DEAL!
 

stocktrader

Guest
rt said:
Okay, so Kessel is a hockey player, and he plays a little dirty behind the referee's back, right? That's what this thread is about? I have just three words in response to that. They are; BIG, ****ING and DEAL!
But don't forget the article says you can easily fluster him if you play him physical. This is certainly a weakness.
 

timlap

Registered User
Jun 19, 2002
9,218
41
FLYLine4LIFE said:
Its poor sportsmanship is what it is..and if he hasnt learned it yet then i feel for the kid because he going to get a beating in the NHL if he pulls any of that s***.
I remember Doug Gilmour doing that in the NHL, but then it was called "leadership" not "poor sportsmanship."
 

espo*

Guest
stocktrader said:
But don't forget the article says you can easily fluster him if you play him physical. This is certainly a weakness.
That would appear to be the key with him,you always want to see if these rocket wheeled pretty boy goal scorer types can stand up to consistent pounding and a guy or two who can skate with him and be able to bother him by engaging him in a game you know he has no desire to play and has'nt much if any experience with since he's probably been skating circles around the rest of the pack from his first or second year of minor hockey.

There is a good chance he initially would'nt deal with it very well and get frustrated quickly,then he'll either adjust in time or he'll not be as great as he could be if he can't.The problem is,up to this point,no-one has been able to skate and move with the kid to put that kind of uncomfortablity on him.But someone somewhere will,maybe next year in the ncaa or at the juniors next year in Vancouver.
It'll be interesting to see if/when he gets this challenge how he reacts.He'll always score goals and make plays this kid,his top end talent is too high for him not to turn into a dangerous player in the nhl imo.But,there is always the chance yet that he may not be a super-star until people who watch hockey see what he's made of when presented with real challenges and a nasty physical pain in the ass game will be a challenge(at least initially) for this kid i would suspect.

Now,to find the right players to give him that challenge!!! I would suspect junior coaches from the big seven who are going to Vancouver are thinking of that right now from time to time.They had better.Taking him off his game will go a long way in taking out the squad the U.s sends to that tourney next year.

Having said that..............the little knicks and knacks he apparently does behind the play don't mean much to me.How many thousands of players over the years do that.Can he play or not play? That's the issue.The only way that stuff would raise any bells with me is if it meant guys who get in his head bother him and take him off his game.....................but that did'nt happen at the under 18's.Now,maybe a physical pest who can stay with him over the course of 3 periods..........maybe there COULD be something there to read into his flustered behind the play stuff.

But the two will have to be linked up for us to see if it can take him off his game.Until that happens it just sounds like a young player which has taken a shot or two or had somebody say something to him and responded.And then went out and continued to dominate the tournament..... Not an issue yet imo............... though i'd love to find out if it is...................but he's made that tough for anyone to do so far. We'll all keep watching,stay tuned.
 

Wisent

Registered User
Nov 15, 2003
3,667
2
Mannheim
Visit site
snafu said:
Okay, thanks. I remember thinking the same about Ovechkin's taunts- just try that in the NHL and someone will roll out a real nice "welcome" mat....
Now that would be sportsmanship. Answer with violence to a joke someone made. That's real sportmanship. So mature. Can't see another solution.
 

Levitate

Registered User
Jul 29, 2004
30,948
7,655
But don't forget the article says you can easily fluster him if you play him physical. This is certainly a weakness.

apparently ovechkin shares that weakness with him then :dunno: i seem to remember canada playing him mighty physical during the WJC and neutralizing him at least somewhat

eh frankly just about any player doesn't perform as well when they're played physical, unless they're just bigger than anyone else.
 

Sp5618

Registered User
Nov 26, 2004
7,191
0
Wisent said:
Now that would be sportsmanship. Answer with violence to a joke someone made. That's real sportmanship. So mature. Can't see another solution.

What are you talking about? I don't write the laws of the jungle, nor do I get to edit "the Code"...

And what joke are you talking about? People were talking about the WJC's and that certain players enjoyed taunting the opposition. Is that representative of sportsmanship in your book?
 

Twist and Shout

Registered User
Dec 30, 2003
12,538
0
Calgary, Alberta
snafu said:
What are you talking about? I don't write the laws of the jungle, nor do I get to edit "the Code"...

And what joke are you talking about? People were talking about the WJC's and that certain players enjoyed taunting the opposition. Is that representative of sportsmanship in your book?

I'm pretty sure that's a representative of a joke in the books of unbiased people.
 

Sp5618

Registered User
Nov 26, 2004
7,191
0
sevenSteen said:
I'm pretty sure that's a representative of a joke in the books of unbiased people.

Sorry, taunting and joking (humor enjoyed by all parties) has different meanings. Please check the English definitions...this is not a cultural slam, just my understanding that the meaning of some words can get lost in translation from one language to another. No one else turned this into an anti-Euro thread except apparently those who seem to be from Europe. I personally believe Russian players are of exceptional skill (skating, passing, stick handling)...so I am amazed that some of you choose to take this somewhere it does not need to go.
 

Vatican Roulette

Baile de Los Locos
Feb 28, 2002
14,007
2
Gorillaz-EPWRID
Visit site
stocktrader said:
It is not the same thing. Not even close.


then please explain the difference to me.

Only one i see is that one was the NHL and the other was the WJC. Other than that, nothing.


stocktrader said:
That was funny when Kovalchuk checked his stick after scoring right after he was given a penalty for using an illegal stick. I give him credit. :biglaugh:

However If Malkin pulled that stunt of going over and pretending to high five the opposing players bench, he will get his a... kicked.


actually, kovalchuk skated by the bench and asked MacTavish "hows this stick?"

You dont call that taunting?
 
Last edited:

Vatican Roulette

Baile de Los Locos
Feb 28, 2002
14,007
2
Gorillaz-EPWRID
Visit site
snafu said:
What are you talking about? I don't write the laws of the jungle, nor do I get to edit "the Code"...

And what joke are you talking about? People were talking about the WJC's and that certain players enjoyed taunting the opposition. Is that representative of sportsmanship in your book?


usually, and please correct me if i am wrong, a player taunts when the other team has done something. Whether is be a joke on the ice, calling someone's mother a name, telling them they suck, or what have you.

Most players do not have the balls(especially europeans) to go over to the other teams bench and taunt. I say only europeans because usually they do not have players(or the talent themselves) to back it up in a fight.

by the way, i dont see any other players besides Malkin and Ovechkin being called classless around here.


How come no one has mentioned Mr. Steve Ott as being a classless prospect? He runs people, learned other languages to taunt the other team, etc.


And as a final thought. Who gives a flying **** what either one of these players do on the ice. I'm willing to bet that if Ovechkin and Malkin want to run their mouths off to the other team and taunt them, they will either A) give the other team a fire under their asses or B) get cheap-shotted by the other team.

Either way, i'm betting these two outscore most of the players in the league in 3 years.
 

Vatican Roulette

Baile de Los Locos
Feb 28, 2002
14,007
2
Gorillaz-EPWRID
Visit site
Levitate said:
apparently ovechkin shares that weakness with him then :dunno: i seem to remember canada playing him mighty physical during the WJC and neutralizing him at least somewhat

eh frankly just about any player doesn't perform as well when they're played physical, unless they're just bigger than anyone else.


IIRC, Ovechkin injured his shoulder in that game. I agree with the second part, any player that isn't 6'2, 225 pounds wears down by physical punishment. To add on, thats why bigger players are more coveted in the league today, to play both sides of the coin, hit, and be able to take hits.

Thats not to say that Theo Fluery, or any other averaged size guy can't hack it.
 

Sp5618

Registered User
Nov 26, 2004
7,191
0
pavel datsyuk said:
usually, and please correct me if i am wrong, a player taunts when the other team has done something. Whether is be a joke on the ice, calling someone's mother a name, telling them they suck, or what have you.

Most players do not have the balls(especially europeans) to go over to the other teams bench and taunt. I say only europeans because usually they do not have players(or the talent themselves) to back it up in a fight. by the way, i dont see any other players besides Malkin and Ovechkin being called classless around here.

How come no one has mentioned Mr. Steve Ott as being a classless prospect? He runs people, learned other languages to taunt the other team, etc.


And as a final thought. Who gives a flying **** what either one of these players do on the ice. I'm willing to bet that if Ovechkin and Malkin want to run their mouths off to the other team and taunt them, they will either A) give the other team a fire under their asses or B) get cheap-shotted by the other team.

Either way, i'm betting these two outscore most of the players in the league in 3 years.


Actually I agree with you that Malkin and Ovechkin have the potential to become top players in the NHL. Personally, I am looking forward to seeing them here- if only the NHL could get its act together. I'm a Red Wings fan, so you should believe me when I say I have appreciated the European talent we have been lucky enough to have here. Datsyuk and Fedorov are two of my personal favorites.

Now, a "taunt" means to start something (not respond to the actions of others). It is meant to incite (or instigate) in an insulting, mocking or contemptuous fashion.

I asked in an earlier reply if Malkin had done something because I did not see Malkin doing this, but I did remember one occasion against the US when Ovechkin "seemed" to be taunting the US team. I do not know if he started this...or if he was responding to something that had happened to him earlier.

I would never say that this only seen from one group of players or from a particular country. Case in point, Sean Avery was with the Wings and I couldn't stand the guy because it seemed all he did was taunt and instigate.

As for the original point of this post, Kessel is a great prospect. I've seen him here in Michigan when he was with the US NTDP U-18. I don't really think of him as a particularly dirty player, but he is a kid. All these guys are...as they develop, they will learn to control the emotion and their skills will take them to the top echelons of the league. None of these guys we have discussed here will need to rely on taunts or dirty play to achieve their potential.
 

Team_Spirit

95% Elliotte
Jul 3, 2002
37,211
16,337
wasent the same stuff written about Kovalchuk ?

who care he's the best thing the NHL got in the last 5 years . People need to sit back and enjoy the show :)
 

Zine

Registered User
Feb 28, 2002
11,958
1,774
Rostov-on-Don
snafu said:
I asked in an earlier reply if Malkin had done something because I did not see Malkin doing this, but I did remember one occasion against the US when Ovechkin "seemed" to be taunting the US team. I do not know if he started this...or if he was responding to something that had happened to him earlier.

That stuff started kicking off after the Russians got those empy net goals and the game was out of reach. Russia started their taunting/showboating at the same time as the U.S. started gooning it up. They just escalated eachother.

Not to excuse Malkin's actions, but I think his taunting was in reaction to the cheap slash that Suter gave him after he scored his goal. I don't think he has a history of doing stuff like that.
 

Form and Substance

Registered User
Jun 11, 2004
5,670
0
pavel datsyuk said:
usually, and please correct me if i am wrong, a player taunts when the other team has done something. Whether is be a joke on the ice, calling someone's mother a name, telling them they suck, or what have you.

Most players do not have the balls(especially europeans) to go over to the other teams bench and taunt. I say only europeans because usually they do not have players(or the talent themselves) to back it up in a fight.

by the way, i dont see any other players besides Malkin and Ovechkin being called classless around here.


How come no one has mentioned Mr. Steve Ott as being a classless prospect? He runs people, learned other languages to taunt the other team, etc.


And as a final thought. Who gives a flying **** what either one of these players do on the ice. I'm willing to bet that if Ovechkin and Malkin want to run their mouths off to the other team and taunt them, they will either A) give the other team a fire under their asses or B) get cheap-shotted by the other team.

Either way, i'm betting these two outscore most of the players in the league in 3 years.

Well hear on hfboards and in most of the hockey community, there is a caste system whereby a player who isn't a scorer but plays dirty is a hero, and a scorer who gets frustrated fighting through countless checks is a coward.
 

loadie

Official Beer Taster
Sponsor
Jan 1, 2003
7,833
238
New Brunswick
Who gives a S**** what Kessel did behind the Refs back, did he injure anyone? Things get heated in a Hockey game, and if that's all the writer could pick on, this kid will be damn good. Lack of leadership, my ass. :shakehead
 

MN_Gopher

Registered User
May 2, 2002
3,628
21
Mpls
Visit site
I love it when a scorer play chippy, Really stirs the pot and seems to get the team going. In Mn he can do all he wants. He will have Chucko and Harrington out there to run a guy if the cheap shot him.
As far as weaknesses go he is sometimes takes a play off. Yeah i know no big deal right, everyone does it. But when a team realizes they have a 50/50 shot of being scored on vs. scoring a goal they may go for it. He could have that i am better than u all and when i have to i can get a chance for my team attitude. This is based on seeing him in one game against the gophers. He had 2g and 2a but on one play if he moved his feet a bit more our player would not have wrapped around the puck and on the rebound we score. He may do that in other games, he could have been late in his shift, but he seems to pretty well rounded.
 

alecfromtherock

Registered User
Feb 2, 2004
507
0
rt said:
I would not call Phil Kessel pretty. Unless, of course, ''pretty'' was immediately followed by ''damned'' and ''ugly''.

As opposed to Sidney ‘Brad Pitt’ Crosby? :)

Lets form the Worst Attitude Ever team starting with the games 21 & U’s

Nash cause he is willing to ‘drop the gloves’ with the officials
Malkin cause he taunted the US junior team(that right belongs to hockey fans not foreign hockey players!)
AO cause he is way too cocky and also taunted the US junior team + he is Russian(shame!)
Kessel cause he plays dirty and shows poor leadership(as opposed to the always classy, clean and valiant current NHL player)
Crosby cause he is from NOVA SCOTIA plus he missed the Prospects game AND Don Cherry does not like him/ thinks he is a Hot Dog.

Nash-Malkin-AO
Nash-Malkin-Kessel
Nash-Malkin-Crosby
Nash-AO-Kessel
Nash-AO-Crosby
Nash-Kessel-Crosby

Crosby-Kessel-AO
Crosby-Kessel-Malkin

Kessel-AO-Malkin...

What crappy lines the above would be in the NHL! Damn if they did not bring the NHL skill level down several notches.

AO was head-hunted by Canada(double/triple teamed) in the WJC, any NHL team have their goons/policemen to retaliate/prevent their ‘Cocky stars’ from the head-hunters of the league.

Continue with the Worst Attitude Ever player pool
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->