Confirmed with Link: Kasperi Kapanen traded back to Pittsburgh - Part II

CheckingLineCenter

Registered User
Aug 10, 2018
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I was pretty pissed earlier but my take is this.

Pros:

- better today
- no consequence to current roster
- LW/RW balance
- speed, talent

Cons:

- overpayment
- yet again putting a lot of eggs in the “he’ll be better in our system” basket, banking on improvement
- feels like another case of tunnel vision on a player Rutherford has history with
- continued lack of asset management and measured approach/plan


My questions are “does this player move the needle?” and what the opportunity cost was here? Wish I could be in JR’s bubble and know who else was out there and available.
 

SouthGeorge

Registered User
May 2, 2018
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I hope they see something in Jesper. I don't know how you watch this team in playoffs last 2 years and go.. We need Kapanen again to fix this.
 

Turin

Registered User
Feb 27, 2018
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A reply to those comparisons to Kase’s value- Kase makes Letang look like an iron man
 

Tacitus Kilgore

Registered User
May 26, 2010
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Potomac, MD
@NeedleInTheHay "Boston missed the playoffs 2 years in a row recently, did you factor that into the comparison?"

Actually yes I did, they drafted Pastrnak in 2014, 25th overall. Pretty good idea keeping that late 1st rounder. Then in 2015 the other year they missed the po's they picked Jake Debrusk in the 1st round (14th overall, pretty close the 15th) also in the later rounds added Brandon Carlo a great defensemen for them.

My point stands, is that they may have traded a 1st here for there but they drafted very well otherwise and were able to surround Marchand and Bergeron and Chara and Krejci with enough talent to keep them relevant. They could win it all this year, they couldve had it last year, they literally might have been/be good enough to back to back. Barzal could've been our Pastrnak, this 15th overall in a very deep draft could've been used much better. Whether it was in another package or simply drafting the pick
 

Sidney the Kidney

One last time
Jun 29, 2009
55,515
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I was pretty pissed earlier but my take is this.

Pros:

- better today
- no consequence to current roster
- LW/RW balance
- speed, talent

Cons:

- overpayment
- yet again putting a lot of eggs in the “he’ll be better in our system” basket, banking on improvement
- feels like another case of tunnel vision on a player Rutherford has history with
- continued lack of asset management and measured approach/plan


My questions are “does this player move the needle?” and what the opportunity cost was here? Wish I could be in JR’s bubble and know who else was out there and available.

My issue isn't with the player, but with the price.

And it's not even necessarily because I think the 15OA and Hallander will become stars for us. It's because I think JR could have used those assets to land someone more proven/better than Kapanen.

As a player, I like what Kapanen brings.
Two things I disagree with:

1. The Penguins gave up a lot of value. 15th OA and an ok prospect. Chances are both never do anything in the NHL. The Penguins did not give up a ton of value.

2. Kapanen does not fit a team need. The Penguins are built on speed. They have to be one of the fastest teams to win another cup. They have to get younger and faster, which is exactly what Kap is.

Whether Kap is the right player or not, time will tell. The Pens have little time to get younger and faster. They have to change probably 4 or 5 guys to add speed while their cup window is still open.

The trade is not without a good amount of risk, but I like it.

Are a lot of people saying #2? Because as a player, Kapanen certainly fits into the Pens' style (or at least the style they claim to want to play). I'm pretty sure 95% of the complaints/concerns have to do with #1.
 

Empoleon8771

Registered User
Aug 25, 2015
80,382
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Redmond, WA
There was some talk comparing the Zucker and Kapanen trades. I think Zucker is a better player at this point, but you also need to factor in that Kapanen is 4 years younger, makes $2.3M less per year, and will still be a RFA after his current deal.

It's also worth pointing out that Kapanen in his first 2 years in the NHL has produced very similarly to how Zucker did in Minnesota in his last few years before the trade. Zucker is the better play driver, but I don't see why Kapanen can't develop further into a Zucker caliber player.

By Kapanen's age, Zucker had 61 points in 169 games. Kapanen has 90 in 202, and 80 in 147 in the last 2 years.
 

Tacitus Kilgore

Registered User
May 26, 2010
6,669
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Potomac, MD
Has there been another GM that has traded for former draft picks and roster players more than JR?

Trades Sheary, then trades for him back
Trades Hagelin, tries to undo to trade
Signed Matt Cullen for us twice
Drafted Jack Johnson with the Canes
Signs Jack Johnson on the Pens
Drafted Kapanen and Kapanens f***ing father
The Oleksiak swap

I might be missing some too
 

Mr Jiggyfly

Registered User
Jan 29, 2004
34,234
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JackFr said:
Ok, to clarify: Kapanen is a low IQ for an NHL player. Especially relative to his speed.

"jack johnson can skate. if you want to see guys who can't skate watch my son's timbits games"

A low IQ player struggles with assignments, positioning, and overall systematic play.

Are you suggesting KK struggles in these areas, because if you are...

If you are talking about his offensive instincts, that’s an entirely different issue.
 

Gurglesons

Registered User
Dec 18, 2009
91,427
73,617
San Diego, CA
last-train-tocool.blogspot.com
@NeedleInTheHay "Boston missed the playoffs 2 years in a row recently, did you factor that into the comparison?"

Actually yes I did, they drafted Pastrnak in 2014, 25th overall. Pretty good idea keeping that late 1st rounder. Then in 2015 the other year they missed the po's they picked Jake Debrusk in the 1st round (14th overall, pretty close the 15th) also in the later rounds added Brandon Carlo a great defensemen for them.

My point stands, is that they may have traded a 1st here for there but they drafted very well otherwise and were able to surround Marchand and Bergeron and Chara and Krejci with enough talent to keep them relevant. They could win it all this year, they couldve had it last year, they literally might have been/be good enough to back to back. Barzal could've been our Pastrnak, this 15th overall in a very deep draft could've been used much better. Whether it was in another package or simply drafting the pick

Hey man. We drafted a top six winger in the 1st that we just paid to bring back.
 

Turin

Registered User
Feb 27, 2018
21,869
25,271
@NeedleInTheHay "Boston missed the playoffs 2 years in a row recently, did you factor that into the comparison?"

Actually yes I did, they drafted Pastrnak in 2014, 25th overall. Pretty good idea keeping that late 1st rounder. Then in 2015 the other year they missed the po's they picked Jake Debrusk in the 1st round (14th overall, pretty close the 15th) also in the later rounds added Brandon Carlo a great defensemen for them.

My point stands, is that they may have traded a 1st here for there but they drafted very well otherwise and were able to surround Marchand and Bergeron and Chara and Krejci with enough talent to keep them relevant. They could win it all this year, they couldve had it last year, they literally might have been/be good enough to back to back. Barzal could've been our Pastrnak, this 15th overall in a very deep draft could've been used much better. Whether it was in another package or simply drafting the pick

But they have one Cup, in 2011, where they were like the worst roster in the Cap era to win. The Penguins have been trying to win since 2008, and still haven’t had the down seasons that Boston did, and have two more Cups.
 
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Jacob

as seen on TV
Feb 27, 2002
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Essentially 15th overall & Hallander for Kapanen. Big meh from me but I like Kapanen. Everything we need, and he’s become a good two-way player as well. Aberg & Lindgren are back to Sweden.

We still have salary to dump. With 1 fewer asset to package it with.
 
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ChrisKuuuunitz

4 time champ
Jan 14, 2015
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I like the trade, don't feel like we gave up much, and Kap is the best player in the trade.

But idk, it does seem like another buddy/buddy trade to get a known player on the team like the Jack Johnson trade since he's Sid's bff..
 

Tacitus Kilgore

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May 26, 2010
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Potomac, MD
But they have one Cup, in 2011, where they were like the worst roster in the Cap era to win. The Penguins have been trying to win since 2008, and still haven’t had the down season that Boston did, and have two more Cups.

They also kicked our asses in the confrence finals in 2013 which should be taken into account, they then missed the playoffs the next two years and drafted like 5 or 6 now roster players. And have stayed a playoff team and now contender for the last couple years.
 

Tacitus Kilgore

Registered User
May 26, 2010
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Potomac, MD
So you’d take Boston’s last 15 years over ours?

Not at all my point. My point was since their cup in 2011 they have drafted better than us and arguably set themselves up to stay relevant much longer. We have 2 generational players, they do not. I personally think that is a big factor as to why we have more cups than them, not our drafting since 09

Also no I would not take Boston's last 15 years over ours. I'm trying to use them as an example of a franchise that does better staying relavant through drafting well rather than rely on 2 generational players
 

Gurglesons

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Dec 18, 2009
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San Diego, CA
last-train-tocool.blogspot.com
Not at all my point. My point was since their cup in 2011 they have drafted better than us. We have 2 generational players, they do not. I personally think that is a big factor as to why we have more cups than them, not our drafting since 09

It’s easy to draft better when you miss the playoffs multiple times and sell off players like Dougie Hamilton for picks.

It’s not like the Bruins haven’t made some awful, awful trades and signings during this time.

Or not been embarrassed in the playoffs.
 

Bingo71

Registered User
Apr 3, 2018
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Corry, PA
Another trade involving a “decent/good” bottom 6 players that doesn’t really create anything on his own but COULD, MAYBE catch lightning in a bottle with Sid or Geno, but will likely be relegated to a 3rd line duties with a center who can’t really create offense on his own, leaving him in purgatory for his stint here...
 

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