Player Discussion Kaapo Kakko: Part III

[Kords]

Kakko's problem is that he couldn't skate and he wasn't conditioned.

If he can improve that that will make a world of difference.

He's got the skills.

Eh, he was struggling to read the game as well. If his positioning wasn't so terrible, you wouldn't even notice he was always a half step behind skating wise. Seldom in good position to receive even a simple pass. He looked straight up lost most nights.

Having said that, put me in the "absurd to call him a bust" column. He will be a huge cornerstone of this team for a very very very long time.

 

[Roo Returns]

Mikko Rantanen spent his entire first North American year in the minors.

There's no news some someone wrote an article this is ruffling feathers.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

wouldn't even go top 5 in a redraft.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

wouldn't even go top 5 in a redraft.

Which 5 players would be drafted ahead of him in a redraft?

 

[BB88]

Kakko's problem is that he couldn't skate and he wasn't conditioned.

If he can improve that that will make a world of difference.

He's got the skills.

That sadly seems to be the problem with guys who train in Turku.

They train hard but wrong

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

That sadly seems to be the problem with guys who train in Turku.

They train hard but wrong

It doesn't seem to be a problem with Rantanen, Aho, Laine etc who train with the same guy as Kakko has for the last few summers.

 

[BB88]

It doesn't seem to be a problem with Rantanen, Aho, Laine etc who train with the same guy as Kakko has for the last few summers.

Aho doesn’t belong on that group.

Laine has had massive on ice condition issues during his NHL career. His skating hasn’t really improved and affects his chances of hitting full potential. His skating is just too heavy.
Rantanen not as bad but he had similar skating weaknessess on his 1st few years. Later he made some changes to his training. Addedd skating to his program

They train hard, but it’s all off ice.

Karpat guys like Aho rent a rink during the summer and skate. Barkov hired a figure skating coach, Kotka works with an ex olympic skater.

I heard every damm excuse with Laines bad on ice shape, and it’s scarily similar to Kakkos

 

[Rangerfan4life90]

wouldn't even go top 5 in a redraft.

Doing a redraft after one season? Lol

In that case, Hughes wouldn't be top 5 either.

 

[klingsor]

wouldn't even go top 5 in a redraft.

Possibly, but I'd be signifantly more interested in a redraft after this season.

 

[Maximus]

Damn that’s a lazy written article. This dude a professional? If so he should be embarrassed.

To be frank and I usually agree with most of your posts so don't take offense, but totally disagree with you here.

I didn't think that article was to far off the reality at all of what was Kakko's season, which let's be honest was as disappointing as it possibly could have been.

Now that said, at the very least Kakko after he finally had gotten his batteries recharged over the covid break which obviously helped his stamina so that at the very least he could keep up with his teamates and not be so gassed after 20-30 seconds as it was pre covid break.

I know for me, had I not seen the improved post covid Kakko, I'd still be wondering if Kakko was going to do the things necessary in the off season to improve to the point where he could be a 50-60 point guy which you hope is the floor for a guy picked 2nd overall.

I'm still hopeful and confident that Kakko will end up being just fine and the author of the article doesn't appear to not think that as well. So once again I enjoyed the article very much and I thought it was a very solid and succinct analysis of Kakko and it was very informative as well as it pretty much spelled out what we all saw and said about Kakko last year which was a guy who wasn't in good enough shape to play in the NHL.

This upcoming season whenever it starts should prove to be the kind of Kakko we all thought we were getting last year and who we saw glimpses of the final 5 games of the regular season into the bubble games where he probably was one of the Rangers better forwards.

Not worried whatsoever about Kakko going forward but this wasn't a hatchet job by the author...he was spot on with his analysis IMO.

 

[LokiDog]

Also of note, of the previous 12 #2 picks that I posted earlier, only Nolan Patrick (health) and Ryan Murray (health, plus he’s a defenseman) have failed to hit at least 60 points in their career. Even Reinhart has a 65 point season, sandwiched between two 50s. So there really hasn’t been a #2 that’s busted in over a decade.

 

[usekakkorightquinn]

Kakko's problem is that he couldn't skate and he wasn't conditioned.

If he can improve that that will make a world of difference.

He's got the skills.

Absurd and completely wrong statement. His skating was excellent. His problem as I said above was obvious to anybody who knows anything about hockey. He wanted to play a game like Jagr where he held onto the puck. Worked opponents in the corners. Drew penalties. He did that against players his own age. In the NHL he was not strong enough to play that way. Quinn was right and wrong when he said he needed to change the way he played. He needed to change because he wasn't strong enough to play that way. However, as his strength increased, he was starting to be able to play that way. Either way, if Quinn has any clue he will put Kakko and Lafreniere on the first two lines and move Buchnevich down. He is not worthy of top line minutes. I pray Gorton trades him soon. Sadly, I could Gorton keep Buchnevich just so a team claims him instead of somebody else he wants to keep.

 

[Maximus]

Kakko's problem is that he couldn't skate and he wasn't conditioned.

If he can improve that that will make a world of difference.

He's got the skills.

I recall distinctly after watching Kakko after his first 10 or so games as a Ranger posting that this guy simply cannot keep up with his teamates. He looks gassed after 20-30 seconds and looks slow as shit. I think I had read, Kakko hasn't had a break of more than a few weeks in the past year and change due to his playing in all those junior tournaments for Finland and in the Finnish hockey league he played in.

I recall comparing how Lemieux over the off season came back to camp and last season looked like he had jets in his skates his skating improved so much over the offseason.

That's what Kakko needed I thought...an offseason where he could work on his stamina, do some power skating drills and get stronger in the gym. During the covid break, y0u could see when Kakko came back, he was able to keep up with his teamates finally....he was able to actually win races to some loose pucks something he never did pre covid and started to shoot the puck more another thing he was hesitant to do pre covid.

I have to believe ever since the Rangers were eliminated from the bubble, the Rangers have given Kakko a specific off season workout regimen specifically targeting him to improve his skating and strength. I'd be shocked if when we see Kakko again in camp, he doesn't pull off what Lemieux did and look a hell of alot faster than he did last year which IMO will help his game and is confidence enormously.

Not worried about Kakko whatsoever.!

 

[The Crypto Guy]

wouldn't even go top 5 in a redraft.

Who does a redraft after 1 year?

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Also of note, of the previous 12 #2 picks that I posted earlier, only Nolan Patrick (health) and Ryan Murray (health, plus he’s a defenseman) have failed to hit at least 60 points. Even Reinhart has a 65 point season, sandwiched between two 50s. So there really hasn’t been a #2 that’s busted in over a decade.

Tyler Seguin had 22 in 74 GP

 

[Thirty One]

wouldn't even go top 5 in a redraft.

lol ok

 

[Irishguy42]

Which 5 players would be drafted ahead of him in a redraft?

Dustin Wolf
Arvid Costmar
Massimo Rizzo
Jeremy Michel
Eric Ciccolini

 

[007]

A couple things from Kakko's draft year need to be taken into account. He was regarded as a top talent going into the season, but he wasn't really a top-line Liiga player yet. In the second half of the season, something clicked and he reached a new level. Then he was dominant in the playoffs, and afterward he was spectacular in the first few games of the WC.

His draft stock soared and he went from being #2 to being...#2 and NHL-ready. The mistake, if you ask me, is thinking that he was NHL-ready. The leap from Liiga to the NHL, especially if you're a fatigued 18-year old, is immense. I am the least hockey-expert here, but my impression was he should spend another year in Europe and dominate for an entire season, and I'm sure he would have.

I'm not too worried -- by all accounts, he's a proud and very hard-working kid, who lives and breathes hockey. He was better in the bubble-offs, and I think he'll be good (not great) in the next couple seasons. I'm prepared for it to take a little while before he really puts it all together.

 

[RGY]

I love Kakko and will defend him but will do it fairly. Before the pause his skating did not look good. Whether that was due to conditioning, or adjusting to a new league with the smaller surface and less time to think, or both, he just looked a step behind and slower every game. When he did have the puck on his stick with some open space you can clearly see the talent and ability. If any of you thought his skating looked “excellent” then I question your judgement as it clearly sounds biased. During the Return to Play, after having some time off to reset and collect himself, he looked like a different player. His first step looked a lot quicker, he had more jump. His skating looked smoother and more effortless because his motor just kept going. He was a different player. He was in on the play at the right times. He was getting shots off. That is the player we need to see moving forward and I have no doubt we will.

 

[SA16]

the nhl ready argument is so tiring almost every single 1 or 2 pick the last ten years has started in the nhl immediately. his expectations were no different than anyone taken where he was.

 

[ArPanet]

Wouldn’t surprise me if Kappo struggled emotionally, significantly. The faces he would make after so many shifts certainly made me struggle emotionally. We’ll never know, of course, since discussing difficulties emotionally is taboo.

 

[LokiDog]

Tyler Seguin had 22 in 74 GP

I posted all of their first seasons. The post you’re responding to is pointing out that all of them went on to be 60+ point players. Reinhart was sent down after 9 his first year but has had a couple 50 and a 65. Only Patrick, due to barely playing and not really developing because of his issues and Murray, who was supposed to be more of a defensive Dman anyway and has also been injury plagued didn’t hit 60 points. But in the past 12 years every one else selected has reached at least 65 points, including the defenseman. Kakko did have a bottom 3 season for the past decade as far as rookie #2s go, but the point of the post was that even the guys behind him became 65 point players. No #2 has busted in over 12 years.

 

[LokiDog]

@Amazing Kreiderman

Kakko (2019) 23pts 66 games
Svechnikov (2018) 37pts 82 games
Nolan Patrick (2017) 30pts 70 games*
Laine (2016) 64pts 73 games
Eichel (2015) 56pts 81 games
Reinhart (2014) 9 games sent down
Barkov (2013) 24pts 54 games
Ryan Murray (2012) 21pts 66 games Dman
Landeskog (2011) 52pts 82 games
Seguin (2010) 22pts 74 games
Hedman (2009) 20pts 74 games Dman
Doughty (2008) 27pts 81 games Dman

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Which 5 players would be drafted ahead of him in a redraft?

Well according to the main boards:

Dach
Seider
Bryam
Cozens
Hughes
and then Dach again because he’s sooo amazing

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Wouldn’t surprise me if Kappo struggled emotionally, significantly. The faces he would make after so many shifts certainly made me struggle emotionally. We’ll never know, of course, since discussing difficulties emotionally is taboo.

We tend to draft mentally weak forwards . Hopefully Lafreniere breaks that streak