Junior Hockey: Additions and Losses

[mk80]

Honestly, not the last junior/college/pro league that will be making this call and it is a smart one. Tough for all the players who intended to play on WSHL member teams this year but there is not much that can be done. I have my doubts the league will return at all, but we shall see what happens in the coming days with the member teams. I would have liked for a more in-depth comment from the league in regards to how all the teams leaving the league impacted this decision and the future, though an extra year now gives them that much more time to prepare for life after that mass exodus. Best of luck to the league.

I don't discount the virus having an impact on planning and preparation for the season, but I do think it provided an easy out for the league. If none of the teams had left, I think they would be moving forward to play next season, even if they had to push the start date back.

 

[BOS358]

I don't discount the virus having an impact on planning and preparation for the season, but I do think it provided an easy out for the league. If none of the teams had left, I think they would be moving forward to play next season, even if they had to push the start date back.

Ding! Ding! Ding! We have a winner!

It would not surprise me if some teams and/ or leagues take the year off. Right now, I'm preparing for my midget league to cancel its season (I hope it doesn't, but if the players can't attend school in person, there's no way we can play the fall season,) but pandemic or not, when most of your teams jump ship, the writing is on the wall.

 

[kij]

I don't discount the virus having an impact on planning and preparation for the season, but I do think it provided an easy out for the league. If none of the teams had left, I think they would be moving forward to play next season, even if they had to push the start date back.

But, in a world where the virus didn't destroy literally everything, it would be much easier to find expansion teams. Let me re-phrase my statement to say that this still was a definite copout, but I respect the decision that we all were expecting to be made.

Now for the true conspiracy theorist, what if the teams that left the league for the USPHL knew ahead of time that the WSHL was going to cancel the season and didn't want to lose the year, instead jumping ship?

 

[mk80]

Well the press release does make the great point about the abundance of WSHL players that come from other countries as opposed to other North American based junior leagues, even the USPHL to my knowledge doesn't have that many import players on their rosters. That is definitely a layer to consider in all this. But I'll still maintain my position that if the league hadn't lost as many teams as they have they would at worst just be pushing back the start date of the season instead of outright cancelling. Both losing a large majority of teams, and the virus has been an unexpected 1-2 punch.

 

[mk80]

I'm guessing the Rhinos definitely aren't staying the WSHL any longer.

 

[CB1]

NAHL?

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

NAHL?

It is probably NA3HL. Overall a much better fit, as much as I would like to see them in the NAHL.

Switching their business model from one that relies heavily on player dues and significantly less so in fan revenue to one that is entirely reliant on fan revenue with absolutely no player dues is probably what makes it certain, especially when no one has any idea in the United States if and when fans will be allowed in arenas. I can guarantee you they have looked at the finances of joining the NAHL at some point in their 14 year history, and they haven't done it. Joining the NA3HL when their old league is collapsing simply seems like the overwhelmingly more logical and probable answer.

 

[mk80]

It is probably NA3HL. Overall a much better fit, as much as I would like to see them in the NAHL.

Switching their business model from one that relies heavily on player dues and significantly less so in fan revenue to one that is entirely reliant on fan revenue with absolutely no player dues is probably what makes it certain, especially when no one has any idea in the United States if and when fans will be allowed in arenas. I can guarantee you they have looked at the finances of joining the NAHL at some point in their 14 year history, and they haven't done it. Joining the NA3HL when their old league is collapsing simply seems like the overwhelmingly more logical and probable answer.

I agree I think most likely they'll follow OKC into the 3HL. Maybe they'd move up at some point in the future if they see a better advantage and with better economic stability.

Also kind of sounds like the Bellingham Blazers are trying to work on something, their tweet isn't as clear cut as the Rhinos though.

 

[mjhfb]

Anyone heard anything about Boston Advantage getting the Monarchs NCDC slot? Also that they will affililiate with some midget/junior programs?

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Anyone heard anything about Boston Advantage getting the Monarchs NCDC slot? Also that they will affililiate with some midget/junior programs?

source that says NH Junior Monarchs are done in the NCDC

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

Anyone heard anything about Boston Advantage getting the Monarchs NCDC slot? Also that they will affililiate with some midget/junior programs?

Boston Advantage To Field NCDC, Four Additional USPHL Teams For 2020-21

They are joining at the NCDC, Premier, and midget levels for this upcoming season. It does not specify if they are taking the Rochester Monarchs spot, but it is entirely possible.

 

[BOS358]

source that says NH Junior Monarchs are done in the NCDC

Please post.

As Barclay noted, the Rochester Monarchs are finished, but I haven't heard anything on the NH Jr. Monarchs, who are still listed on the USPHL website as members.

Also, this is speculation, but I wonder if the Northeast Generals (NAHL/ NA3HL) and New England Knights (NA3HL) are on borrowed time. The Lovells were major investors in the Generals and Knights and are taking their money elsewhere. Plus, I can't imagine that USA Hockey would be too pleased with a junior team owner operating in an independent league. It will be interesting to see what happens.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

Please post.

As Barclay noted, the Rochester Monarchs are finished, but I haven't heard anything on the NH Jr. Monarchs, who are still listed on the USPHL website as members.

Also, this is speculation, but I wonder if the Northeast Generals (NAHL/ NA3HL) and New England Knights (NA3HL) are on borrowed time. The Lovells were major investors in the Generals and Knights and are taking their money elsewhere. Plus, I can't imagine that USA Hockey would be too pleased with a junior team owner operating in an independent league. It will be interesting to see what happens.

I can't believe I am defending Hutch, but I think what happened was that he saw the previous post saying that the defunct Rochester Monarchs franchise was going to be used by Lovells for the Boston Advantage. Hutch saw that and thought "having two teams with the same name in the NCDC is ridiculous" *glances nervously at PAL Islanders and IHC.* And then because Hutch has the grammar skills of a pineapple, he then posted what he posted, making it seem that he stated that he thinks the NH Monarchs are done when he was actually asking for a source about the previous Monarchs post.

The Lovells have always gone where the money is. It would not be a stretch to say they are playing both sides of the conflict to come out on top if/when one side pulls out victorious.

 

[JMCx4]

You BOTH need therapy.

 

[BOS358]

The Lovells have always gone where the money is. It would not be a stretch to say they are playing both sides of the conflict to come out on top if/when one side pulls out victorious.

Bizarrely, this makes a lot of sense.

 

[kij]

The Lovells have so much sway in Boston/Mass hockey that I wouldn't be shocked to see USAHockey turn a blind eye to all of this. To go along with the fact that they turned over most of the power back to Erikson a little while back while shifting behind the scenes, They're definitely hedging their bets to try and stay ahead of the game. Not too sure how they plan to operate so many programs with the intention of siphoning off cash for a top team as most organizations tend to stretch too thin. Will be fun to watch.

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Please post.

As Barclay noted, the Rochester Monarchs are finished, but I haven't heard anything on the NH Jr. Monarchs, who are still listed on the USPHL website as members.

Also, this is speculation, but I wonder if the Northeast Generals (NAHL/ NA3HL) and New England Knights (NA3HL) are on borrowed time. The Lovells were major investors in the Generals and Knights and are taking their money elsewhere. Plus, I can't imagine that USA Hockey would be too pleased with a junior team owner operating in an independent league. It will be interesting to see what happens.

SOURCE required here, BOS..... both are still active

 

[mjhfb]

Bizarrely, this makes a lot of sense.

One downside I can see with all this is even more of the "loose affiliation" rhetoric that gets thrown out to players/parents when making decisions. With so many different tentacles, even in different leagues, it creates several unofficial "affiliations" which I would think is not only confusing to players trying to decide a path, but since they are "unoffical" the players/parents are making decisions on faith/trust, not an official league heirarchy.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

SOURCE required here, BOS..... both are still active

Generally you don’t need sources whenever you clearly, soundly, and specifically put “this is speculation.” Speculation literally means you have no firm evidence. If he was trying to pass it off as facts, then yes, of course you are correct. But he pretty clearly said “this is speculation”

 

[CHRDANHUTCH]

Generally you don’t need sources whenever you clearly, soundly, and specifically put “this is speculation.” Speculation literally means you have no firm evidence. If he was trying to pass it off as facts, then yes, of course you are correct. But he pretty clearly said “this is speculation”

I count everything as speculation, factual or not

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

I count everything as speculation, factual or not

That logically makes zero sense and has no realistic basis. Makes sense you would think like that.

 

[SemireliableSource]

I count everything as speculation, factual or not

This almost kinda explains why you insist the NA3EHL still exists

 

[kij]

I count everything as speculation, factual or not

Hey @CHRDANHUTCH, the USHL is coming to Lewiston/Auburn.

To everyone else, I see no way that the Lovells manage to get a USPHL Premier team off the ground this rapidly. NCDC is easy to fill, you tell kids it is free hockey and they can break any other tier 3 commitments made no problem but there aren't enough tier 3 kids to go around and many are already spoken for.

 

[Barclay Donaldson]

Hey @CHRDANHUTCH, the USHL is coming to Lewiston/Auburn.

To everyone else, I see no way that the Lovells manage to get a USPHL Premier team off the ground this rapidly. NCDC is easy to fill, you tell kids it is free hockey and they can break any other tier 3 commitments made no problem but there aren't enough tier 3 kids to go around and many are already spoken for.

Every USPHL organization with a NCDC team fills their Premier team with kids who tried and failed to make the NCDC team. As long as they have 50 or so kids looking to make their NCDC team, they will fill out a roster.

 

[mk80]

Hey @CHRDANHUTCH, the USHL is coming to Lewiston/Auburn.

I'll blame the fact I was working till 3am last night, but I definitely had to read that again before realizing it was joke.