Player Discussion Josh Norris C 6’1”

[Sweatred]

I'm hoping Norris stays up for the rest of the year. My sense is he is highly motivated and getting a feel for the gap between the AHL and the NHL and what he might need to address in this summer's training is a good thing.

I think PD said on the team he was only called up because of injuries to White etc.

 

[JD1]

I think PD said on the team he was only called up because of injuries to White etc.

That's fair but he might make it hard to send him down

 

[JD1]

I think PD said on the team he was only called up because of injuries to White etc.

I see what you did there....you're getting more clever making threads about White...lol

Joking

 

[Sweatred]

lmao, nope, not even close.

Keep watching ... still time to retract that.

 

[guyzeur]

I heard last night he was 6,2 now. Change that title NOW ... cause Aragorn

TheAHL.com | The American Hockey League

 

[TheDebater]

I see what you did there....you're getting more clever making threads about White...lol

Joking

We are highly privileged to be a part of this rebuild knowing such skilled and super talented prospects are killing it in our system.

@Sweatred

 

[The Devilish Buffoon]

I'm hoping Norris stays up for the rest of the year. My sense is he is highly motivated and getting a feel for the gap between the AHL and the NHL and what he might need to address in this summer's training is a good thing.

I'd take it game by game (or two by two, whatever)… but he looks very polished and he definitely deserves an extended look. I think Formenton deserves a handful of games, too. I think he will benefit from getting a feel for DJs system, as I think it's one that he can really shine in... while they have different skillsets, I think Formentons mindset is probably quite similar to Browns (although a bit pestier) and they play the game somewhat similarly - very north-south, always angling towards the net, willing to play physical and battle and grind out the little victories. The fact that he is three levels above Brown in skating while having better hands, creativity, and probably better goal scoring ability is just a cherry on top.

But yeah, back to the topic at hand, Norris has a pro polish and I think he will soon (read: within the next yr) be able to play with a high degree of confidence. He might not have special offensive ability, but he has enough offensive ability that, combined with the other elements in his game, he has the ability to be an incredible important & special player.

 

[Micklebot]

Norris' progression could make roster decisions very difficult next season, particularly if L.Brown forces his way into the lines and we win the lottery to draft 2nd OA...

 

[guyzeur]

Detroit would not take the big Byfield?

 

[Xspyrit]

Why is everyone afraid to talk about Norris as a first line centre in the NHL? The kid is a blue chip prospect who looked really good at Michigan and at the World Juniors before he got hurt, and is now absolutely killing it as a 20 year old first year pro in the AHL. Why can't he be our first line centre of the future? It's so funny how we as fans always want to slot a prospect low - "Hopefully he can be a bottom pairing guy for us", "Solid third liner", etc. etc. To heck with that - at this stage, Norris looks like he could be a first line, first unit PP NHL centre, and he should get every opportunity to prove that he can do just that.

Sorry bro, I'm too busy debating which would be the 1st line

Tkachuk-Norris-Raymond
Lafreniere-Brown-Batherson

Because slotting a player too high leads to unrealistic expectations, and disappointment when the player doesn't meet them. Better to set a reasonable goal - both for him and us.

That's why we use ceiling and floor when talking about a prospect but it's true that a lot of people only talk about floors with maybe just a tiny little extra upside on top of it. That's why people don't see the Karlsson, Stone and Hoffmans coming.

I guess they've been disappointed too many times in their life, or they just still didn't accept yet that it's part of life.

Norris ceiling should be 1st line after the last 2 years, and his absolute floor still 3rd line C, but very likely to be at least a 2nd line C

Colin White was more 2nd line C as top ceiling and a 3rd line C floor

 

[SensFactor]

Norris > White.
Dorion would be in the hot seat if White turns out to be a bust. Too early to tell but that contract is going to be awful when it comes time to sign all the rest of our youth. Heck, I would argue that money would have been well spent on Pageau.

 

[Sweatred]

Norris has a heavy shot. Solid thump into the goalie pads.

 

[Sweatred]

Norris > White.
Dorion would be in the hot seat if White turns out to be a bust. Too early to tell but that contract is going to be awful when it comes time to sign all the rest of our youth. Heck, I would argue that money would have been well spent on Pageau.

I agree, I’ve constantly wondered how “the board” could love the $4.75 White contract but think $5.0 was too much for Pager. Either way ... looks like Norris may outplay both.

 

[SensFactor]

I agree, I’ve constantly wondered how “the board” could love the $4.75 White contract but think $5.0 was too much for Pager. Either way ... looks like Norris may outplay both.

Karlsson trade looks absolutely amazing right now! Sharks going to regret that contract for years to come.

 

[Xspyrit]

That's because you guys think way too low of Tierney. I swear, nobody on this team get more unjustified hate than Tierney. He's a solid middle-6 player.

There's about 650 regular spots in the NHL. Chris Tierney is the 325th best hockey player in the league.

He's fine but that's it. We'll have a lot of better options in the near future, even for the bottom 6. Guys like C.Brown, Formenton, White, Paul, Chlapik, Abramov, Pinto, Crookshank, Gruden, Davidsson, etc won't really have a chance to crack the top-6 with guys about to be drafted and Tkachuk, Batherson, Norris, L.Brown, Duclair?... so Tierney who is about to be more expensive won't be hard to replace.

Maybe they should trade him at the draft.

This link shows how impressive Norris' production has been in his 20YR old season: Elite Prospects - AHL Stats All-time season

Only 20YR olds with a higher PPG than Norris with a decent amount of games played are Getzlaf, Perry, Kucherov, Strome, Couture, Brassard and Palmieri.

Damn that's pretty good company

Norris has been really impressive, and I think he's going to be a solid 65+ point center for a long time here.

However, you have to factor in that in the NHL of the last 10 years, most future all-stars are already in the NHL at 20 years old.

Even if you look at his draft year, you have Heiskanen, Makar and Pettersson who've already established themselves as superstars. And then guys like Hischier, Necas, Suzuki, Thomas, Chytil and Yamamoto who are already contributors at the NHL level.

Context though. On a solid team surrounded by good/great veterans, Norris could have graduated this season but the Sens are rebuilding (and not a small rebuild). Sens took the luxury to cook their best prospects a little longer in the AHL. Guys like Brannstrom, Batherson, Balcers, Formenton, Brown and Norris could play in the NHL and improve from there but we want them to develop further and hope Belleville goes on a long playoffs run. Sens are also "tanking" since they only had the 19th OA pick last year (instead of 4th) so they couldn't afford to have some of these guy breakout. That's why guys like Ennis, Hainsey, Namestnikov, even Reilly were brought in : buy more time.

Edit : oh yeah and Norris lost months of development last year.

Being excited is exciting! Good feelings are good!

What are talking about?

Being miserable >>>> happiness

AINEC

 

[Do Make Say Think]

Two games in the NHL people.

So far so good but some of you would do well to keep that in mind before blowing your load.

 

[Micklebot]

Karlsson trade looks absolutely amazing right now! Sharks going to regret that contract for years to come.

I think the contract and the trade are separate issues. They will certainly regret the trade, that's for sure. The contract really depends on how Karlsson's career goes going forward, though I suppose an argument can be made that even if he does bounce back to his perennial Norris candidate form, they as a team are no longer in a good position to take advantage.

I wonder if opinions on the trade would change had they won the cup in 2019 (which would have meant another 1st for us instead of a 2nd).

 

[TkachukNorris79]

I agree, I’ve constantly wondered how “the board” could love the $4.75 White contract but think $5.0 was too much for Pager. Either way ... looks like Norris may outplay both.

White signed a 6 year deal, taking him through his prime, making him a UFA at 29 years old.

JGP will be 28 by the time his new deal starts, and will be 34 at UFA.

Fits in way better with the rebuild, and *no one* could have predicted his sophomore slump...

 

[JD1]

There's about 650 regular spots in the NHL. Chris Tierney is the 325th best hockey player in the league.

He's fine but that's it



Damn that's pretty good company



Context though. On a solid team surrounded by good/great veterans, Norris could have graduated this season but the Sens are rebuilding (and not a small rebuild). Sens took the luxury to cook their best prospects a little longer in the AHL. Guys like Brannstrom, Batherson, Balcers, Formenton, Brown and Norris could play in the NHL and improve from there but we want them to develop further and hope Belleville goes on a long playoffs run. Sens are also "tanking" since they only had the 9th OA pick last year (instead of 4th) so they couldn't afford to have some of these guy breakout. That's why guys like Ennis, Hainsey, Namestnikov, even Reilly were brought in : buy more time.

Edit : oh yeah and Norris lost months of development last year.



What are talking about?

Being miserable >>>> happiness

AINEC

Re Tierney... being better than half the guys in the league isn't a bad thing

ReNorris...people saying guys are already making an impact in the league at 20...well they are but that sentiment is kind of the last little thread of negativity to hang on to and it ignores the separated shoulder and the rehab as opposed to strength training. Having watched Norris play live last night, I've no doubt had the injury not happened and he had a regular summer and regular dev camp, he'd have more nhl games on his resume and would have made an impact this year, how big an impact who knows

 

[Sweatred]

White signed a 6 year deal, taking him through his prime, making him a UFA at 29 years old.

JGP will be 28 by the time his new deal starts, and will be 34 at UFA.

Fits in way better with the rebuild, and *no one* could have predicted his sophomore slump...

I *disagree*, but not looking for a debate. Anyone know if Norris is playing tomorrow (NHL) ?

 

[Xspyrit]

Norris > White.
Dorion would be in the hot seat if White turns out to be a bust. Too early to tell but that contract is going to be awful when it comes time to sign all the rest of our youth. Heck, I would argue that money would have been well spent on Pageau.

4.75 for White was based on his play last season (48 pts pace). Not for a big regress in his 22 y/o sophomore season. He will have a chance to rebound next season. His contract won't really affect others. If not, every forward flirting with 50 pts would ask for Hayes money

Re Tierney... being better than half the guys in the league isn't a bad thing

ReNorris...people saying guys are already making an impact in the league at 20...well they are but that sentiment is kind of the last little thread of negativity to hang on to and it ignores the separated shoulder and the rehab as opposed to strength training. Having watched Norris play live last night, I've no doubt had the injury not happened and he had a regular summer and regular dev camp, he'd have more nhl games on his resume and would have made an impact this year, how big an impact who knows

I'm not saying it's bad thing. Being an average player at the NHL level makes you actually pretty damn good at hockey. Personally, he's not in my long term plans that's all but good young/cheap stop gap while Norris, Brown, Chlapik, Pinto, etc develop. Also, will we draft a Center?

Basically, Sens chose to have White long term. Similar money could have been given to Pageau or Tierney. I really wanted Pageau in an ideal world but age was THE factor here. After this draft, all our important players of the future will be 18-25 so they want as many as possible to peak at the same time.

 

[Hinterland]

I *disagree*, but not looking for a debate. Anyone know if Norris is playing tomorrow (NHL) ?

Well, they didn't make moves after the game...and if they wanted to send him down they'd have done that yesterday so he can play in Cleveland today. Never say never but they're not keeping him up to eat Nachos in the press box.

 

[h2]

Norris > White.
Dorion would be in the hot seat if White turns out to be a bust. Too early to tell but that contract is going to be awful when it comes time to sign all the rest of our youth. Heck, I would argue that money would have been well spent on Pageau.

Agree. I was all for signing Chabot long-term. But Colin White was not worthy even last summer at locking up for the length we did. I've never been high on him as a prospect and always disliked that draft selection the second it was made. I hope he proves me wrong but I don't think he will.

 

[TkachukNorris79]

Agree. I was all for signing Chabot long-term. But Colin White was not worthy even last summer at locking up for the length we did. I've never been high on him as a prospect and always disliked that draft selection the second it was made. I hope he proves me wrong but I don't think he will.

He should have been on a bridge deal. But there were special circumstances. The team needed to show the fan base that they were committed to keeping the young kids for the long run. So they upped the term and tried to get to a salary that made sense. 4.75M is high-end 3rd liner at this day in age. That's all he needs to be.

Also, I don't really care about AAV. Won't until 2023-2024, which is when we'll have to pay the 2020 top 7 guys, at the earliest. Until then, we're laughing in terms of cap space.

 

[h2]

He should have been on a bridge deal. But there were special circumstances. The team needed to show the fan base that they were committed to keeping the young kids for the long run. So they upped the term and tried to get to a salary that made sense. 4.75M is high-end 3rd liner at this day in age. That's all he needs to be.

Also, I don't really care about AAV. Won't until 2023-2024, which is when we'll have to pay the 2020 top 7 guys, at the earliest. Until then, we're laughing in terms of cap space.

Agree. It's not a crippling deal, but I don't think we're going to get a bargain here. If he can play at a high-end 3rd liner level as you say, we'll be okay. St. Louis just won a cup with Bozak making 5m, I think we can get similar value, hopefully better though.