Value of: Jonathan Drouin

Discussion in 'Trade Rumors and Free Agent Talk' started by BigDaddyLurch, Oct 16, 2020.

  1. angry pirate Registered User

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    The bolded needs to stop being said. Drouin is 25 years old, we know what he is. An inconsistent 50+ point winger with an 80 point skillset who will leave fans wanting more. The problem lies in people putting too much stock in the "wanting more".

    In general, people need to stop focusing on what a player isn't instead of what a player is. If you are 6'4, put up 50 points but play soft you are a detriment to your team, yet a 5'8 player who could play the exact same way would be lauded. People put too much stock into what a player "could be" and when they don't live up to it, ignore the things they actually do.

    Jonathan Drouin is a skilled winger who lacks the ability to maintain a consistent high level of play. Could he put up an 80 point season? Absolutely. Will he do it more than once? Unlikely. Will he do it ever? Quite possibly not. No team should target Drouin with the idea that he leads their offense night in night out. But if you have talent up and down your roster to insulate his inconsistency than there will be success.

    Do teams have interest right now without moving money? Hard to say. Covid is strange times and there are still some FA's out there who may make more financial sense. But the Habs would absolutely not have to pay to get rid of Drouin. They may have to be willing to take some bad $$ back to make it work financially. There is no world where he has negative value right now. He's still as is said, a 50+ point winger on a contract representative of that level.
     
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  2. SadEugeneOregonDonor Registered User

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    Lets put it this way:

    Schmidt got a 3rd. Vancouver is in the market for offensive wingers. If Vancouver could clone Schmidt, do you think they would take Drouin + 3rd for Schmidt, or even add to Schmidt for Drouin + 3rd? I suspect the answer is a resounding and whole-hearted "hell no!". Sure, the Habs could get an asset in addition to Eriksson or Lucic, but it would almost certainly be less than if they just took Eriksson/Lucic for free.
     
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  3. NOTENOUGHJOSTTHINGS Registered User

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    You need to remember that most American NHL teams in the economic climate cannot afford to pay Mete 700k to play in the AHL. That's most than their entire budget.

    There are some analysts who suggest if the Aves had a Mete or two type contract in the AHL they may need to trade MacGinnon. Their other high paid players have NMC and are not positive value players (Elton Johnson, JT Compher, etc). MacGinnon has more value than Mete to most teams.

    So Mete is not a good investment to the Aves.
     
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  4. angry pirate Registered User

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    Schmidt got a 3rd because Vegas needed to move money fast, and not take any in return. Vancouver could shop Schmidt now and take their time and get a much better value.
     
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  5. SadEugeneOregonDonor Registered User

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    Teams can go over the cap during the offseason, so thats really only partially true. If Vancouver wanted to trade Schmidt without taking salary back, the market would still be extremely limited. That said, I will agree that the less term Drouin has remaining, the more value he will have, but you could say that about any undesirable contract.
     
  6. angry pirate Registered User

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    They were already over the cap I believe, and Petro would have put them over the 10% allowance. To get him signed the needed to move money immediately and take none back.

    Do you think his contract is overall undesirable or just because of Covid and the current financial situation? Because personally, I don't think the Habs have any problem with his contract, nor do I think most teams around the league have issues with their own similar contracts. I can understand the context that it's undesirable simply because teams can't afford to add any contracts right now. Hypothetically, if we weren't in a flat cap, I don't think the Habs would have any trouble at all in moving Drouin's contract.

    Ultimately, I think the Habs would get value back in any Drouin trade because they don't trade him otherwise. They aren't going to cap dump him ala Schmidt. At least not in my opinion. So really, I think that whole line of conversation is moot.
     
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  7. tsujimoto74 Moderator

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    There's nothing "untapped" there. Drouin is what he is: an inconsistent offensive player who actively harms his team any time he's not scoring.
     
  8. Junohockeyfan Registered User

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    Untapped probably wasn't a good word. The offense is there but consistency and injuries have held him back. I see this coming season as make or break for Drouin. There are no excuses now. He will have a capable and talented C in Suzuki and a big-body power forward in Josh Anderson. Alternatively he could have Kotkaniemi with Toffoli/Anderson/Armia. At this stage, if he can't make it work with the talent available, then he's not close to the player he was designed to be.

    Either way, Habs have zero interest in trading Drouin as of now. The potential he showed with Suzuki in the playins is encouraging. They were dynamite together against the Flyers. They led the Habs in points. The only line that was producing offense against the Flyers stifling D.

    Habs will have 3 x 2nd lines. They will be able to give Suzuki's line favorable matchups. Danault's line will get the heavy matchups as always.
     
  9. SadEugeneOregonDonor Registered User

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    To your first point, I believe you are incorrect - with Pie signed, VGK is just barely over the cap. With Schmidt, they would still be under the allocation. That said, doing so would obviously lower their leverage a lot so I'm not really proposing it as a viable alternative.

    I personally wouldnt sign Drouin to that contract as a UFA (his remaining years at his remaining term), but I wouldnt say he would have no value, league-round, in a non-COVID landscape. Some team would give something up for him. I think the only way he returns actual "good" value, though, is in a fortuitous Pacioretty-type trade, though - a team has a high-salary player who just doesnt fit, and they add him to a late 2nd or equivalent prospect and he turns around and performs well in MTL. Now, with COVID, I don't think his value has changed much - he would now just return that player, and maybe a late pick or extra low-paid bottom 6 plug-n-play type. That's not what I would give, but I suspect it's what he would return.

    All of that is to say that I suspect youre correct and that the Habs won't move him because they won't get anything of value; I, however, would still personally trade him for another bad contract, because I think its easy to find an underperforming, unwanted 5m player who can provide more consistent & reliable play than Drouin can, even to a team like MTL that is heavy on those more intangible qualities while being lower on skill.
     
  10. Handlethepasses Registered User

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    Ristolainen for Drouin?
     
  11. Junohockeyfan Registered User

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    In a vacuum, they probably have similar value. But as of now, Habs are pretty much done and ready to drop the puck. They won't trade Drouin this off season.

    On D:

    Chiarot-Weber
    Edmunson - Petry
    Kulak - Romanov
    Mete

    (or Romanov - Fleury).

    I think Romanov will start his NHL career on the right side. He played RHD in the KHL and with Edmunson signed and Kulak, the best spot is being sheltered on the 3rd pairng.
     
  12. WetcoastOrca Registered User

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    I think it’s time that we stop talking about Drouin’s potential just because he was once a high draft pick. At this time we pretty well know what he is. A 50 point or so second line mainly offensive guy who is somewhat overpaid in this flat cap environment. He’s simply not going to return anything of substance and teams will want some cap going back.
     
  13. Johnny Hoxville The Return of a Legend

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    You actually can’t defend that offer. No one is giving Montreal 3 quality futures and taking back virtually no cap. It’s laughable for anyone attempting to do so. My previous offer of Lucic and a 1st would likely be the best offer or similar offer to what a team would make.
     
  14. Zahra Starker Registered User

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    Mete is a cap dump at 750k? Hahahaha delusional. You think drouin is a dump??? If drouin is a dump. It would cost the shit flames about 10 1st to dump that disgusting lucic contract.
     
    Last edited: Oct 18, 2020
  15. tsujimoto74 Moderator

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    Yeah, hard pass on that. Even if you believe Risto is a catastrophe in his own end (I don't---I think he's been miscast through much of his career, and he's had good metrics in smaller sample sizes with more appropriate usage) and the only value either brings is in the offensive zone, a 45 point d-man is a hell of a lot rarer than a 50-55 point winger. And Risto's also a huge physical presence. Plus, Drouin would have absolutely nowhere to play in the Sabres line-up. Hall, Olofsson, and Skinner have LW well covered.
     
  16. draft day Registered User

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    Guy has played 3 seasons in the NHL and you claim he's not of NHL calibre.:laugh::laugh:
    Please more we need more.:facepalm:
     
  17. Patagonia Keep Whining

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    Risto is a RHD. Significantly more valuable and difficult to replace to a immature Winger.
     
  18. KotkaCaufield Registered User

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    Time to reunite MacKinnon with Drouin.

    :habs
    1st Round Pick
    Nichushkin
    Timmins

    :avs
    Drouin
    Mete
    4th Round Pick

    Drouin back with Mackinnon would get Drouin going and Nichuskin could put up a career year beside Koko. Trevor Timmins re-unites with Timmins who has had injur troubles
     
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  19. draft day Registered User

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    No GM that had Drouin right now would trade him for Lucic and a 1st .
    You know that I know that and any knowledgeable hockey fan that isn't trolling just for the hell of it knows that.
     
  20. draft day Registered User

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    Avs won't and shouldn't even consider this.
     
  21. KotkaCaufield Registered User

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    Upgrade our 4th to a 2nd.
     
  22. draft day Registered User

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    Now maybe both teams decline.
     
  23. Patagonia Keep Whining

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    AVs need a moment. :laugh:

    Sandler - laughing cereal.gif
     
  24. Patagonia Keep Whining

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    AVs added Saad which is much better and cheaper player. Signed for 1 season before reaching UFA, so he would be extra motivated. Landy is among the best 2-way Forwards and Captain. Drouin is not better than either player and would be slotted on the 3rd line.

    Contract at $5.5M per is too high for the 3rd line which is normally a defensive role, but can't play defence. So he has no role on the team regardless if he was offered for free. Better value possibly with another team.
     
  25. Junohockeyfan Registered User

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    I think this is a fair statement. Obviously the Habs are not interested in moving Drouin and particularly this late in the offseason. With the chemistry Drouin and Suzuki demonstrated in the playins, coupled with the addition of J. Anderson / Toffoli, there is a good basis for Drouin breaking out. Danault's line will get all the heavy assignments leaving Drouin-Suzuki-Anderson to feast on other teams 2nd or 3rd lines. If Drouin doesn't produce / breakout this season, he never will IMO.

    Therefore, Habs are excited for the season to start. This is the most depth / top-6 players we have had in ages.
     

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