Player Discussion John Carlson - Vol. 1

[MrGone]

Mr Gone or Trashcat change his name maybe?

Nope, but happy to see more people are waking up.

 

[Raikkonen]

Nope, but happy to see more people are waking up.

Waking up? Man, wake up yourself. Many ppl stating they would like to get Green back on a friendly contract. This is it, the end of time.

 

[MrGone]

I hope they bring him back. It will be nice to laugh at failure for a change. People that resist change in the present always love living in the past.

 

[Alexander the Gr8]

I hope they bring him back. It will be nice to laugh at failure for a change. People that resist change in the present always love living in the past.

I don't want him back because I think he doesn't address any need but let's not act like bringing him back would be the end of the world.

 

[Hivemind]

I want him back mostly to watch Mr Gone have an aneurysm.

 

[MrGone]

I would become the biggest home grown troll. And be content with first round exits until it was all burnt to the ground.

 

[Jags]

BINGO. The "does he even care about hockey" stuff was definitely secondary to me and I think I was one of his more vocal critic at times here. As a sports fan, it stings knowing one of your favorites doesn't care enough to turn his natural talents into on-ice (or field) greatness and that was my biggest beef with him. He should have been much more dominant as a player and for that I will forever feel like he was an underachiever in DC.

Take someone who's introverted then add in a move to another country, a language barrier, and being surrounded by bigger personalities, and that introversion has a tendency to grow. He never said much, was always quiet in interviews, even in Russia. At a couple of the fan events I attended, he seemed really nice, just quiet and shy.

So you have this blank slate onto which the media could project whatever they wanted to, because he'd never speak up to argue. So a quiet, reserved kid uncomfortable with the spotlight and language became "enigmatic" and "eccentric." And it had to be a story, so the more elusive he was the more the media tried to figure him out, and that scrutiny can make someone with that kind of temperament check out. His game crumbled under the weight of that pressure, so the more scrutiny there was the more he withdrew.

The organization also struggled to build a real line around him, and that curtailed his performance. So there was probably some anger and frustration in the mix there, too, but I still think the narrative surrounding him was far more a media creation than what was really going on.

 

[Ajax1995]

I would become the biggest home grown troll. And be content with first round exits until it was all burnt to the ground.

Would become...?

 

[Jags]

Tell me what us wrong with my view. I dont think signing a 31 year old player to an 8 year 5.75 m per season contract is a very good deal.

This is his age-31 season, so you're exaggerating this a little. And pretty much everyone here agreed at the time that the term was unfortunate. Not sure you were here for that.

Given all the talk about how the cap is supposed to grow over the next few years, the type of motor Oshie has, his tremendous versatility, the kind of player teams look to add come TDL time, and the decline in actual salary the last few years of the deal, it isn't crazy to think Oshie could be traded at some point.

Barring major injury, there's no reason to think he wouldn't be regarded 5 years from now the way Justin Williams is while performing at a similar level, at a time where a 5.75 cap hit and 4.5 in actual salary will literally be less significant than Williams' current deal.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Take someone who's introverted then add in a move to another country, a language barrier, and being surrounded by bigger personalities, and that introversion has a tendency to grow. He never said much, was always quiet in interviews, even in Russia. At a couple of the fan events I attended, he seemed really nice, just quiet and shy.

So you have this blank slate onto which the media could project whatever they wanted to, because he'd never speak up to argue. So a quiet, reserved kid uncomfortable with the spotlight and language became "enigmatic" and "eccentric." And it had to be a story, so the more elusive he was the more the media tried to figure him out, and that scrutiny can make someone with that kind of temperament check out. His game crumbled under the weight of that pressure, so the more scrutiny there was the more he withdrew.

The organization also struggled to build a real line around him, and that curtailed his performance. So there was probably some anger and frustration in the mix there, too, but I still think the narrative surrounding him was far more a media creation than what was really going on.

Too many teammates and people behind the scenes say he was a bigger part of the problem. Sure, maybe he was misunderstood because he was introverted, I'll give you that.

 

[Jags]

Too many teammates and people behind the scenes say he was a bigger part of the problem.

Definitely, but a lot of that could easily be construed as a "chicken or the egg" situation. Was he always that way, or did he become that way after years of being the redheaded stepchild of the Young Guns? They didn't build a line around him (easily the #1 victim of our 2C wasteland), didn't commit to him at all despite giving huge deals to his contemporaries, and yet the expectation level was always super high.

"We're not going to give you the tools to succeed and are going to commit to and pay everyone but you, and in return we expect you to live up to your extraordinary potential."

I'm certain the organization had their reasons, but they handed him his third consecutive bridge deal despite him being nearly a point-per-game guy alongside a rotating cast of linemates. I'm not saying his perspective is the right one, but from his perspective, yes, I see plenty of reasons a guy might be frustated, distant, and ready to move on.

 

[txpd]

This is his age-31 season, so you're exaggerating this a little. And pretty much everyone here agreed at the time that the term was unfortunate. Not sure you were here for that.

Given all the talk about how the cap is supposed to grow over the next few years, the type of motor Oshie has, his tremendous versatility, the kind of player teams look to add come TDL time, and the decline in actual salary the last few years of the deal, it isn't crazy to think Oshie could be traded at some point.

Barring major injury, there's no reason to think he wouldn't be regarded 5 years from now the way Justin Williams is while performing at a similar level, at a time where a 5.75 cap hit and 4.5 in actual salary will literally be less significant than Williams' current deal.

Its fair to bet that Oshie would be a productive player on this team for as long as Ovechkin is on it. I think its also fair to suggest that with Oshie its even money that his style of play will possibly have him in LTIR retirement for some of the later part of that contract. Right now with the team still trying to win, they needed to keep Oshie. Like they will need to keep Carlson

 

[MrGone]

Would become...?

I have unpopular opinions that I stand by. Still you have no idea what it will be like if they bring him back.

 

[txpd]

I hope they bring him back. It will be nice to laugh at failure for a change. People that resist change in the present always love living in the past.

What will be interesting is the things you could blame on Green that has nothing to do with Green. ive been kicking around some possibilities. Mitch Korn retired as goalie coach because he knew Green was coming back. Ov is rolling up goals now because he knows he wont score again after Green arrives. They were laughing about that during the hardest shot competition in fact. That's just some quick thoughts. Feel free to add yours

 

[MrGone]

We all have said what the team has always been missing is a true #1 defender. And Mike Green was not and will never be that guy. Maybe he comes back and turns the team into the Huston Rockets of the NHL again. A team that scores a lot and is fun to watch in the regular season but does not do well in the playoffs. That's not a road I want to go back down.

But..But.. The PP will be so much better with Green Life back (Puke)

The PP has always been one of the best in the league. And it has not got the team past the second round.

 

[CapitalsCupReality]

Definitely, but a lot of that could easily be construed as a "chicken or the egg" situation. Was he always that way, or did he become that way after years of being the redheaded stepchild of the Young Guns? They didn't build a line around him (easily the #1 victim of our 2C wasteland), didn't commit to him at all despite giving huge deals to his contemporaries, and yet the expectation level was always super high.

"We're not going to give you the tools to succeed and are going to commit to and pay everyone but you, and in return we expect you to live up to your extraordinary potential."

I'm certain the organization had their reasons, but they handed him his third consecutive bridge deal despite him being nearly a point-per-game guy alongside a rotating cast of linemates. I'm not saying his perspective is the right one, but from his perspective, yes, I see plenty of reasons a guy might be frustated, distant, and ready to move on.

Ill save my response for another thread another time, since this is the JC thread.

 

[ovikovy817]

Imagine that scenario.
Green comes back, scores the series winning goal in ROUND 2, wins the Cup and the Conn Smythe. Ovi, Backstrom and Orpik all three miss the last game of the playoffs, so Green will raise the Cup.
@Mr Gone , what's your action/reaction/... ?

 

[MrGone]

Imagine that scenario.
Green comes back, scores the series winning goal in ROUND 2, wins the Cup and the Conn Smythe. Ovi, Backstrom and Orpik all three miss the last game of the playoffs, so Green will raise the Cup.
@Mr Gone , what's your action/reaction/... ?

I will be happy to be wrong. And believe it or not it would not be the first time.

 

[txpd]

I will be happy to be wrong. And believe it or not it would not be the first time.

At the same time you will be convinced that Green will drop the Cup and curse the team for another 50 years.

 

[AlexBrovechkin8]

At the same time you will be convinced that Green will drop the Cup and curse the team for another 50 years.

 

[thelebaron]

last few pages almost had me thinking this was an oshie or green thread.

 

[Raikkonen]

last few pages almost had me thinking this was an oshie or green thread.

We have some meta going on through all threads. We are talking about same things mostly for some time now, and I'm talking years already.

All difference is in really small nuances like names of rookies.

So doesn't really matter what's the thread name.

 

[maacoshark]

Waking up? Man, wake up yourself. Many ppl stating they would like to get Green back on a friendly contract. This is it, the end of time.

Greens overall game has improved since his time here but I'm not sure he is what we need. He is still a pp specialist, much like Shattenkirk was supposed to be for us last year. That isn't our biggest need especially for the playoffs where pp's are usually down. We need a shut down dman. Green doesn't fit that criteria.

 

[thelebaron]

Greens overall game has improved since his time here but I'm not sure he is what we need. He is still a pp specialist, much like Shattenkirk was supposed to be for us last year. That isn't our biggest need especially for the playoffs where pp's are usually down. We need a shut down dman. Green doesn't fit that criteria.

Mcdonagh might soon be available according to rmnb, id imagine we'd have to give up a kings ransom for him.

 

[maacoshark]

Mcdonagh might soon be available according to rmnb, id imagine we'd have to give up a kings ransom for him.

Thats the kind of player we need.