Joe Sakic - Record as Colorado Avalanche GM - Part II (Updates in First Post)

[S E P H]

I don't think I've ever been this down on the Avs, ever. I just don't see any light at the end of the tunnel.

I do see a light at the end of the tunnel, but that tunnel is going to be filled with a ton of Edmonton Oiler-esque top 3 selections eventually leading to great players. Sakic has shown us that he's quite good when it comes to contract negotiating so there's something I guess.

 

[InjuredChoker]

I do see a light at the end of the tunnel, but that tunnel is going to be filled with a ton of Edmonton Oiler-esque top 3 selections eventually leading to great players. Sakic has shown us that he's quite good when it comes to contract negotiating so there's something I guess.

that's probably the most realistic way out of this. suck long and bad enough to find a generational player/too much talent for even incompetence by management to prevent the team from succeeding.

 

[cgf]

I don't think that plays a factor in people's opinions really. I know for me, I was more a fan of Joe than Patrick as players, but I've been more critical of Joe than Patrick.

I think the same is probably true for those that are more critical of Patrick. I don't think their opinions of them as players come into play much.

At least as far as Av fans go. I do think a lot of the criticism of Roy from those outside of Av fans stems from their feelings of him during his playing career.

I was the opposite. Foppa & Roy are what drew me into NHL hockey, with Sakic landing behind guys like Drury & pre-Mueller-hit-Blake in terms of my personal favorites list. Yet I'm far less vociferous in my criticism of Sakic than many on here.

that's probably the most realistic way out of this. suck long and bad enough to find a generational player/too much talent for even incompetence by management to prevent the team from succeeding.

aka the Nordiques strategem

 

[ABasin]

that's probably the most realistic way out of this. suck long and bad enough to find a generational player/too much talent for even incompetence by management to prevent the team from succeeding.

How long is 'long enough'? They've been at this sucking thing for 9 years (minus the one anomaly).

 

[Nalens Oga]

I do see a light at the end of the tunnel, but that tunnel is going to be filled with a ton of Edmonton Oiler-esque top 3 selections eventually leading to great players. Sakic has shown us that he's quite good when it comes to contract negotiating so there's something I guess.

We don't need to do that. If they get a 1st line forward from this draft, a top pairing dman like Dahlin in the next draft, and some of our other prospects pan out while guys like Mac/Rantanen/Zadorov stay the course then we're good to go. Only issue is adding the goalie.

The problem is Sakic and co screw-up with filling out the roster in terms of the peripheral players that ruin the rest of the line-up along with the coaching.

 

[Gigantor The Goalie]

You guys are taking all the fun stuff. All I want to see is the Front Office taken out back and thrown in the dumpster. I gave them a chance with Lacriox, Sacco, Sakic, etc. hoping they could surround our high picks with the talent needed to be perennial playoff contenders. I'm sick and tired of all this losing and the team looking like a ship in an ocean without a rudder. There's no leadership in the Front Office. I like the amateur scouts but everyone else can go.

Everyone really hit it on the head here. There is a very small chance that the FO as of now can lead this team to consistent success. They might fluke into it like Edmonton did as mentioned before. Even if they got Dahlin I still don't see how the FO makes anything happen. It's frustrating looking back at history and seeing no plans, no vision, anything. Why should I or anyone believe anything will change?

 

[avspatti]

Could we start with a new coach?

 

[Gigantor The Goalie]

Could we start with a new coach?

Need a new everything really. Changing the coach won't matter when the team is just a bunch of players on the ice. Coach can only squeeze so much water out of a rock. I'm not a big fan of Bednar but if we got rid of Bednar and the majority of the FO stays, nothing will chance. Might get a fluke run but it will be followed by more pain.

 

[Sea Eagles]

For me, the biggest disappointment with Sakic, is in past years, I'd at least be excited to watch the games (even in the Sacco era), and I'd be waiting by the clock for the next season to roll around.

Sakic has created a formula that drives none of that. Someone very wisely on this board (apologies for forgetting who that is), is sports offers two things. One is winning. The other is hope. Avs have none of these things.

I literally think it would take someone to beat Joe Sakic up (maybe Doug Gilmour in a Revenge of the Sith type of deal) to get him to talk about the fans of this team, and what they mean to him / the club.

 

[tigervixxxen]

I'm sorry they broke your spirit, Sea Eagles

 

[LTC Pain]

For me, the biggest disappointment with Sakic, is in past years, I'd at least be excited to watch the games (even in the Sacco era), and I'd be waiting by the clock for the next season to roll around.

Sakic has created a formula that drives none of that. Someone very wisely on this board (apologies for forgetting who that is), is sports offers two things. One is winning. The other is hope. Avs have none of these things.

I literally think it would take someone to beat Joe Sakic up (maybe Doug Gilmour in a Revenge of the Sith type of deal) to get him to talk about the fans of this team, and what they mean to him / the club.

Joe Suckic needs to go.

 

[AnimalMother73]

Agreed he has to go. But what is going to take to get the Kroenke's to do it? If they won't do anything to a franchise's leadership after a season like this then I've lost all hope that the Avs will ever have sustained success while they own the team.

 

[cgf]

You guys realize that if Joe goes he'kk be replaced by a one now Lacroix clone that trades away what youth we have for vets to try n squeeze into a WC spot with...right?

 

[JoemAvs]

You guys realize that if Joe goes he'kk be replaced by a one now Lacroix clone that trades away what youth we have for vets to try n squeeze into a WC spot with...right?

And thats different to Joe how?


Which of his great moves scream youth movement to you?

Beauch, Iggy, Berra, Comeau, Colborne, Soderberg?

Trading away all of those 2nds and hanging onto vets?

her
Or is it because he is talking about building for the future because there is simply no other excuse for our current performance? Not calling up more players from the AHL tells you all you need about our great transition year and our "plan" to develop our youth...


If the Kroenkes bring in another Lacroix who will try to quick fix this thing again at all cost (kind of like Sakic and Roy tried to do 2 years ago) will atleast make the "divorce" from this franchise easier for me.

So by all means. Go ahead Stan!

 

[AslanRH]

I'm not sure a really experienced GM would come here, but 2 guys who have worked for quite a long time under two very good GMs would be solid choices IMO..

- Mike Futa in LA who seems to have a good eye for talent and has seen how Lombardi manages to consistently make a competitive roster
or
- Paul Fenton who helped Poile build the Predators since the start

Both also would have ties to 2 assistant coaches who I think are going to be high caliber candidates for HC jobs soon in Stevens and Housley.

 

[Vaslof]

The only reason Bednar is still part of this organization is because they want the new coach to start on a clean slate, right? Even if they thought he still had potential, he has lost the locker room a long time ago and that isn't magically going to change in the off-season. I know next season will likely suck as well, but even if they're OK with a high pick in 2018, surely it would be best for long term to have a good coach start driving in his system and build up the confidence in our team. That is the absolute minimal I ask from Sakic. If Bednar is still here next season, I will lose all faith. At least things like blowing up the core or not, are things that are debatable.

 

[AnimalMother73]

A significant part to effective coaching is getting players to be in the right mental state to succeed on a regular basis. There are so many signs that suggest the team's horrid performance is at least in part due to their mental approach to the game. I don't really care about fare shake anymore I just can't see how Bednar can be given another year given the clearly damaged mental state of the team. How do you recover from this? Its one thing to have a few players quit on you or not play up to expectations but the entire team has quit and its totally apparent every time a new player is brought in. They stick out like a sore thumb for a few games, trying harder, applying more effort and whatnot. Socially and psychologically I simply don't think its possible to even speculate on progress w/ next year's squad if he is the coach, let alone if a core player or two is traded.

 

[Mupster]

I'm not sure if this is the right thread or not, so please feel free to move this post...

I've been lurking this site on a daily basis since something like 2009. Been an Avs fan since I can remember. And for the first time in my life, I have just now finally hit the point of true hopelessness in this team. And it's incredibly sad.

I guess I'm motivated to post here because I would really like to hear from some of you about any positives you are clinging to. I keep thinking we've hit rock bottom, but then somehow it gets worse. Right now, the only small spark of excitement I get from this team is watching Rantanen, Zadorov, Landeskog and EJ (the latter two because they are the only ones who truly do seem to care about how bad this team is). I was high on Bednar to start and want to give him the benefit of the doubt, but the results of the team speak for themselves. What really gets to me though is the fact that nothing seems to ever drastically change, and that has to come from the front office/ownership. I would like to think that Sakic is as emotionally destroyed as many of us are, but his actions and words don't portray that at all.

So, what coping mechanisms are you all using to get through this? I used to be a huge Rockies fan as well, but the ineptness of that organization finally pushed me over the edge and I haven't watched a game in 3+ years. I really don't want that to happen with the Avs.

 

[tigervixxxen]

I watch prospects to make me feel better. It's a dose of hope plus gives me a different team to follow and watch win from time to time. There are some good kids ready to come up in the next few years. They won't fix our issues single handedly but getting good pros into the system is a start.

 

[Mupster]

I watch prospects to make me feel better. It's a dose of hope plus gives me a different team to follow and watch win from time to time. There are some good kids ready to come up in the next few years. They won't fix our issues single handedly but getting good pros into the system is a start.

Are you confident that we won't screw them up? It's hard to tell whether or not its the player or the system, but seeing how many of our prospects stagnate or regress once they make the NHL makes me nervous.

 

[tigervixxxen]

Are you confident that we won't screw them up? It's hard to tell whether or not its the player or the system, but seeing how many of our prospects stagnate or regress once they make the NHL makes me nervous.

No I'm not unfortunately.

 

[Mupster]

No I'm not unfortunately.

Yeah me neither. The organization needs a culture shift in the worst way, especially as it pertains to development. I've seen you rant on here about the nostalgia factor, and while I loved the Sakic, Forsberg Roy days, it is long past due to move on. We need a completely clean break and a fresh start. Which for me means I think Sakic needs to relinquish GM duties and a total outsider needs to be brought in.

 

[Foppberg]

The thing is, how deep does the cleaning house need to really go? Deeper than just the GM level? Presidential level?

 

[Gigantor The Goalie]

The thing is, how deep does the cleaning house need to really go? Deeper than just the GM level? Presidential level?

Everyone but the owners...cause you can't fire the owners. Would like to see JIF and the amateur scouts stay around though.

 

[RoyIsALegend]

Well, in our case, the President is the Owner's son, so that's not really an option.