Jim Carey downfall

[Danny46]

Did Jim Carey had one of the strangest careers of all time? He went undefeated in his first 7 games in Washington during his rookie season, became the starter and the season after won the Vezina when you had Belfour, Brodeur, Hasek and Roy, if not at their peak all of them pretty close.... But, both playoffs that he was in were a disaster, and after 1996 his carrer was never the same to the point that he retired in 1999 with 25 years old in St. Louis, are you kidding me??? His stay in Boston was a complete disaster to the point that he was send to the AHL.

What happen to him? Why his performance declined so much? And why Washington traded him? Was he already declining?

Click to read more...

 

[Hobnobs]

This has been discussed a few times. Like here

 

[sr edler]

He went on to pursue a movie career instead.

Seriously though, not all players are 100% into hockey. Players like Carey, Carson, Ken Dryden had other career alternatives off-ice and probably some (or a lot) of their hearts elsewhere.

Someone mentioning Carson being the all time teenage NHL goalscorer though should perhaps raise some concerns regarding Laine. He seems to have slightly different issues than Carson though (allegedly).

 

[Doctor No]

I don't believe that he ever fully recovered from the inner ear concussion.

 

[ShelbyZ]

The short story is that he was a decent but somewhat flawed goalie who played behind a pretty solid D in Washington which allowed the 2nd least shots against in the league both full seasons Carey played there. He struggled when he had to move laterally and the Lemieux and Jagr led Pens exposed this in 2 1st round series exits and wrote the book on him for the rest of the league.

He won a Vezina arguably because of his sexy 9 shutouts and it was a weird year for the top goalies in the league (IE Hasek and Brodeur both miss the playoffs, Roy traded mid year, etc.).

He struggled the next season and was moved to Boston in a blockbuster deal with the hope that him returning to his home state would bring him back to that 95 and 96 level. He apparently wasn't happy that Washington pretty much gave up on him. Was garbage in Boston and eventually lost the starting job to Byron Dafoe and then the backup job to Robbie Tallas. They buried him in the minors and then released him. He went to the Blues, but they apparently only brought him in as a way to motivate Fuhr.

Carey apparently didn't have the "drive" or whatever and wasn't a team guy and didn't feel like working on his game when the chips were down.

He made enough money to get into the business world and start a company and is doing pretty well now.

 

[Doctor No]

He went to the Blues, but they apparently only brought him in as a way to motivate Fuhr.

Fuhr was actually hurt when Carey was with the Blues parent club:

1998-1999 St. Louis Blues Goaltender Game-by-Game Performance

He then went to the IHL Cyclones, suffered the ear concussion and never played professionally again. I dispute the "drive" hypothesis (at least as a sole explanation).

 

[Doctor No]

Cincinnati Enquirer, March 29, 1999.

 

[Hobnobs]

Fuhr was actually hurt when Carey was with the Blues parent club:

1998-1999 St. Louis Blues Goaltender Game-by-Game Performance

He then went to the IHL Cyclones, suffered the ear concussion and never played professionally again. I dispute the "drive" hypothesis (at least as a sole explanation).

There were several sources saying he lost his drive before this. I just don't think he was mentally prepared to handle NHL and the business within it.

"When we traded Jim, it wasn't under normal circumstances,'' Poile said. ``We were struggling, and we traded three good, young players for three veterans. You could already sense that the passion, the drive wasn't there in Jim. He was a nice person, but he didn't really integrate with the team. Sure, there are loners in hockey, but it just seemed that Jim didn't really want it. And you have to want it.

"Jim told me he had to get away from hockey, that it wasn't fun anymore,'' said Wisconsin coach Jeff Sauer, who also has sent star goalies Curtis Joseph and Mike Richter to the NHL. ``Things weren't going well, and he just decided that he had had enough.

"We sold that trade on getting Jim,'' Sinden said. ``He was a local kid, and he had just won the Vezina the year before. Everyone in town was excited. When we got Jim, we thought there was a good chance that he could get back to where he had been. But he was pitiful in his first game, and by the end of that season after he played 18 games for us, I said to myself, `Wow. This guy can't stop anything.'

"The NHL is a little fraternity. The coaches and GMs are always moving around from team to team, and they gave Jim a bad rap. It's unbelievable that Jim's not in the NHL. But if you got jerked around for two years, you'd get tired of it, too.''

Carey got so tired of the games being played with his career that he had Lawton, a nine-year NHL veteran who was the top pick in the 1983 draft, decline all offers last summer.

"When the Blues said they couldn't keep Jim on their NHL roster after they had said they would, that might have been the final straw,'' Lawton said. ``Jim worked out a little bit that summer and then he told me, `I don't want to do this anymore.'

"I was getting a few feelers from teams, but they were all looking for a No. 3 goalie. I wouldn't have let that keep me from my passion, but Jim didn't have that instinct. He had other ideas about how he could spend his time. He went back to Wisconsin so Stephanie could finish her degree, and then they moved back to the Sarasota area.

"Jim made $800,000 or $900,000 the year he won the Vezina and then he signed a four-year, $11 million contract. And Jim has done so well with his investments that he doesn't have to work. He's working on his business degree at the University of Tampa and looking to get involved in the financial world. It's disappointing that Jim didn't persevere because he still had a lot to give to the sport. Despite everything that had happened, 24 was too young to leave hockey.''

Befitting his loner mentality during his playing days, Carey hasn't spoken to Howard or Sauer in months. None of his former teams knew his exact whereabouts. And despite encouragement from Lawton, Carey declined to be interviewed for this story.

I mean thats pretty damning evidence. Now of course a concussion doesnt help and might have been the final straw but his career was over long before that.

 

[Doctor No]

That's fair - I have contemporary sources consistent with that.

"Lack of drive" in the late 1990s was still code for a lot of things within a spectrum - including being someone that doesn't quite fit into the group and isn't a "team guy" as a result.

 

[Hobnobs]

That's fair - I have contemporary sources consistent with that.

"Lack of drive" in the late 1990s was still code for a lot of things within a spectrum - including being someone that doesn't quite fit into the group and isn't a "team guy" as a result.

That's true. It mightve become a self fullfilling prophecy. But I think Carey just wasnt up for it. He hadnt hit a snag once during his career until his first and second playoffs with the caps. He had success at every level. 3 state championships, rookie of the year in both NCAA, AHL and NHL (nominated), Best goalie in the AHL. He was on the top until the 96 playoffs. The he got to experience NHL media and how hard it is being a goalie when things arent going right.

When he got to Boston he was called damaged good alreday before his first game and now he had the added pressure of that moron Sinden basically hyping him in the media as the answer to all of bruins problems.

The kid just got shell shocked. Stinks of PTSD.

 

[ShelbyZ]

Fuhr was actually hurt when Carey was with the Blues parent club:

1998-1999 St. Louis Blues Goaltender Game-by-Game Performance

That makes more sense then. While trying to quickly rattle off my TLDR summary, I only remembered it had something to do with Fuhr, but wasn't sure if it was injuries or not playing great.

Looking at that link... What a debut it was for Carey with the Blues... A 4-0 loss where his team allowed only 9 shots and the goalie he replaced finished the game with a .400 SV%

 

[McGarnagle]

I wonder how history would've changed if Sinden asked for Kolzig instead of Carey in the Oates deal

 

[SotasicA]

Carey was a beast. I did not think there was a better goalie in the league.

But I think he lost his focus. Real bad. Bad goals, bad games, bad stretches, then a bad downwards spiral of a career. It is not easy being a goalie in the NHL when things don't go your way. Maybe a personal/mental coach could have saved his career? But from what I understood, he wasn't that into hockey towards the end anyway. It was his time to go. He won the Vezina, he made a decent amount of money. To go on would have required more ambition, more hard work, and it's a tough, intense pressure you are under being an NHL goalie. The fear of another loss, the stress of allowing a goal. It's easier to sit back a little and enjoy what you've accomplished, and go do something else.

Just my take. I didn't know him personally.

 

[Big Phil]

I wanted to say that from memory Carey came out of nowhere to be a star goalie and when that happens it always makes me nervous when someone just sort of jumps up like that rather than progressively being on the radar for a long time. However, upon looking it up he was a decent draft pick in the 2nd round at 32nd overall. Played for USA in the WJC in 1993. So I guess he didn't just come out of nowhere. I just seem to remember him doing this though.

Interesting that Team USA snubbed him for the World Cup in 1996. You had Richter, an obvious choice, but it was just Carey and Hebert as back ups, who didn't play. Obviously in hindsight it makes sense, but at the time you would think the Vezina winner could have gotten a bit of ice time. Maybe they saw through him?

 

[ShelbyZ]

Poking around at some old articles, it looks like the Bruins were pretty much ready to wash their hands of Carey after the 97-98 season, but kept him around for insurance because Dafoe needed off season shoulder surgery and it would also potentially give them a goalie to expose to Atlanta if they felt they needed to protect Robbie Tallas.

 

[Hobnobs]

Poking around at some old articles, it looks like the Bruins were pretty much ready to wash their hands of Carey after the 97-98 season, but kept him around for insurance because Dafoe needed off season shoulder surgery and it would also potentially give them a goalie to expose to Atlanta if they felt they needed to protect Robbie Tallas.

Should also add that Cheveldae signed with that Bruins team as well.

 

[ShelbyZ]

Should also add that Cheveldae signed with that Bruins team as well.

Didn't Cheveldae retire halfway through 96-97 when the Bruins sent him back to the IHL? I think that was shortly before they made the deal to get Carey.

 

[vadim sharifijanov]

I wanted to say that from memory Carey came out of nowhere to be a star goalie and when that happens it always makes me nervous when someone just sort of jumps up like that rather than progressively being on the radar for a long time. However, upon looking it up he was a decent draft pick in the 2nd round at 32nd overall. Played for USA in the WJC in 1993. So I guess he didn't just come out of nowhere. I just seem to remember him doing this though.

i had no idea who he was either before he emerged as blaine lacher, part two.

but this is what really surprised me—

Lawton: “24 was too young to leave hockey.''

in my mind i’d remembered him as one of those overage college guys that does a few years in the A or IHL before breaking in. i did not realize that rookie and vezina carey were 20 and 21 years old.

 

[Danny46]

I remember that Carey in the NHL 1997 game was one of the 5 goalies that had 99% overall, the others were Belfour, Brodeur, Hasek and Roy...

 

[Passchendaele]

Was his Vezina year even that good?

Looking at the numbers, it seems Hasek or hell, even Darren Puppa (especially that Tampa Bay made it to their first playoff appearance) would have been better choices for the award.

 

[Stephen]

Blaine Lacher was another goalie from that era who had a similar career arc, albeit with much less of a peak. Great rookie year. Terrible sophomore year. Demotion to the AHL and never heard from again. No journeyman career, no battle back to the NHL, nothing.

 

[Big Phil]

Blaine Lacher was another goalie from that era who had a similar career arc, albeit with much less of a peak. Great rookie year. Terrible sophomore year. Demotion to the AHL and never heard from again. No journeyman career, no battle back to the NHL, nothing.

He is one of the weirdest cases. I remember him in that shortened season, he looked pretty good. I guess sports can be a funny business, especially as a goalie, but there wasn't even that feeling out period where a team figures him out after a "lucky" season where no one scouted him. He had that good year in 1995, then played 12 games the next year, was sent down and that was it. Granted he had a 3.94 GAA in those 12 games and was 3-5-2 which meant he was pulled a couple times by the looks of it.

Then just vanished quicker than Buster Douglas.

 

[seventieslord]

The short story is that he was a decent but somewhat flawed goalie who played behind a pretty solid D in Washington which allowed the 2nd least shots against in the league both full seasons Carey played there. He struggled when he had to move laterally and the Lemieux and Jagr led Pens exposed this in 2 1st round series exits and wrote the book on him for the rest of the league.

He won a Vezina arguably because of his sexy 9 shutouts and it was a weird year for the top goalies in the league (IE Hasek and Brodeur both miss the playoffs, Roy traded mid year, etc.).

He struggled the next season and was moved to Boston in a blockbuster deal with the hope that him returning to his home state would bring him back to that 95 and 96 level. He apparently wasn't happy that Washington pretty much gave up on him. Was garbage in Boston and eventually lost the starting job to Byron Dafoe and then the backup job to Robbie Tallas. They buried him in the minors and then released him. He went to the Blues, but they apparently only brought him in as a way to motivate Fuhr.

Carey apparently didn't have the "drive" or whatever and wasn't a team guy and didn't feel like working on his game when the chips were down.

He made enough money to get into the business world and start a company and is doing pretty well now.

....and if you buy what the media is selling, Fleury might win a Vezina with his sexy 9 shutouts this year, too.

Like Carey in 1996, his sv% is far from spectacular, but those shutouts, right?

Last time I checked, Fleury was sub-.900 in his non-shutout games. Freddy Andersen is .923 without a single shutout. Who deserves it more?

 

[Canadiens1958]

....and if you buy what the media is selling, Fleury might win a Vezina with his sexy 9 shutouts this year, too.

Like Carey in 1996, his sv% is far from spectacular, but those shutouts, right?

Last time I checked, Fleury was sub-.900 in his non-shutout games. Freddy Andersen is .923 without a single shutout. Who deserves it more?

9 shutouts are guaranteed wins. 0 shutouts, possible to go winless.

 

[Doctor No]

Poor Markus Mattsson - the Winnipeg Jets' first NHL shutout, and he didn't even get a win for his troubles.

Although I agree that shutouts are guaranteed wins (or at least overtime losses), if we consider two goaltenders, both with the same save percentage (let's say 90%). If one has zero shutouts and the other has nine shutouts, then the goalie with nine shutouts is making his offense work a lot harder in his non-shutout games just to be competitive.

Suppose you have two households, and they each save $100,000 per year for retirement. If one doesn't save *any* money in nine of the months, and the other doesn't save any money in zero of the months, then the folks who are more consistent don't have to strain at times. They both get to $100,000.