Jim Benning vs Kyle Dubas

[dukeofjive]

So did Montreal. Not the greatest of reasons.

And mtl has nothing to do with the topic...

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

So you mean that because Vancouver with lesser players made it farther in the playoffs, cant be the reason people voted for Benning, its only people hating leafs ?

Pretty much, because you can't look at his trades, you certainly can't look at his free agent signings, the results on the ice don't say he's better

The ONLY thing you can say is well he drafted Petterson and Hughes but the reason he was able to do that is because the on ice product sucked a product that he built.

 

[Holymakinaw]

Kyle Dubas, by a zillion.

 

[Rants Mulliniks]

And mtl has nothing to do with the topic...

Yet they are a perfect example of your reference.

 

[M2Beezy]

Kyle Dubas, by a zillion.

Canucks just won THREE games in a row old friend, its clearly this guy who has perfected sitting AND breathing at the SAME time

 

[Spirit of 67]

The poll is finally starting to right itself. Anyone picking Jim Benning in this is either letting their leaf hate cloud their judgement or they're completely out to lunch.

Thank you.

And you can also add Dubas hate.

 

[4Twenty]

Almost exactly 8 months since this poll came out, lots of people flip flopped but I'm shocked it's still this close.

Jim Benning had to reboot his roster 1 season after trading a 1st, 2nd, 3rd, top prospect to get into the playoffs (only happened because of the pandemic shutdown...)

Shocking system depth at center and defense and look miles off the pace of real contenders. Capped out with stars on ELC's, still has Jay Beagle, Loui Eriksson, Micheal Ferland, Brayden Holtby and Antoine Roussel taking up $20m of cap space NEXT SEASON!!!!

Imagine voting Benning, I don't get it.

 

[BlueBaron]

Dubas has put together a very good regular season team, but come playoff time they won't be able to compete with the league heavyweights. They have a lot of players who are proven passengers come playoff time.

I think you would find that playoff passenger statement difficult to support statistically.

Who are these passengers?

 

[stevo61]

I know its a bumped old thread but Dubas has done a lot of growing in his role since this was created. He was all about the skill and thought that was all you needed to win and now has a much better understanding of how to build an NHL team to succeed in the playoffs

 

[4Twenty]

I know its a bumped old thread but Dubas has done a lot of growing in his role since this was created. He was all about the skill and thought that was all you needed to win and now has a much better understanding of how to build an NHL team to succeed in the playoffs

It was 8 months ago lol.

 

[stevo61]

It was 8 months ago lol.

Yes and seeing what Tampa did was likely pretty eye opening. Yzerman was almost in the same boat where he built a team from within and was almost scared to make trades to take it to the next level. I have no doubt Dubas saw that and as you see by the Foligno trade and Simmonds signing is trying to replicate it and insulate his stars

 

[stevo61]

It was 8 months ago lol.

Double post

 

[gamer1035]

Dubas gets fleeced on every signing/trade, but at least he has a good vision/direction for the team. Benning doesn't even have that.

 

[CatchyTune]

This shouldn't be very close. Benning has done a fantastic job with the Canucks the past 2.5 years. Dubas has taken a team with massive potential and put them in the bottom 3rd of the league during that same span.

1st comment aged well lmao

 

[A1LeafNation]

I know its a bumped old thread but Dubas has done a lot of growing in his role since this was created. He was all about the skill and thought that was all you needed to win and now has a much better understanding of how to build an NHL team to succeed in the playoffs

His process was draft and sign skill, add grit and toughness once your team matures.

 

[rypper]

I stand by an earlier comment. The only reason Dubas isn't running away with this, is because of the blinding hatred some people have for the leafs.

Something like trading for Riley Nash to boost the leafs LTIR space to accommodate other trades, while also having Nash as an option in the playoffs is so far out of the realm of what Jim Benning could even wrap his head around. They are on two completely different levels.

 

[garbageteam]

Dubas is way, way better. I don't think even think he's a bad GM, he's not even in the bottom 10 of the 31 teams. He's got a tenacity and swagger that I have to respect even if it doesn't always work out.

Benning is truly one of the worst in the entire league. He has some staff that helps him out with good drafting, but his management, long term planning, understanding of roster rules and cap space, negotiation skills, especially at trades, is in the bottom quadrant of the league. It would be hyperbolic to say he's the worst in every aspect of being a GM in the NHL, but I would like to see if someone can even name five GMs that are clearly worse in the league right now.

 

[BlueBaron]

Dubas gets fleeced on every signing/trade, but at least he has a good vision/direction for the team. Benning doesn't even have that.

LOL.

If you don't know what you are talking about it is better to stay silent. Add up all the money not playing for Vancouver and tell me how great their signings are. We don't have a contract we couldn't move, no "negative value players". Vancouver has what 20+mil not playing for them? So obviously your words are empty.

ROFL.

 

[Mats13]

This poll is embarrassingly close.

Can’t be surprised with Hf tho.

 

[M2Beezy]

This poll is embarrassingly close.

Can’t be surprised with Hf tho.

I think this was done before this Canucks train reck of a season. A new poll would be closed within hours. However those contracts to Eriksson, Beagle, Sutter, Roussell, Spooner, Gudbranson, Gagner, Baertchi, Holtby, Sbisa, Myers, Virtanen and Ferland are looking pretty good right now.....

 

[gamer1035]

LOL.

If you don't know what you are talking about it is better to stay silent. Add up all the money not playing for Vancouver and tell me how great their signings are. We don't have a contract we couldn't move, no "negative value players". Vancouver has what 20+mil not playing for them? So obviously your words are empty.

ROFL.

When did I say Vancouver has good signings? Did you even bother reading my post?

I know what I'm talking about, but clearly you don't, thanks.

 

[shaner82]

The "All speed and skill" model is what Dubas haters think his plan is. As do the media. Or at least sell that as their opinion.

It is not. Nor was it ever.

Nobody makes it to the NHL without realizing what it takes to win. Having nothing but small, skilled guys who can't take a hit isn't what Dubas built, nor did he ever say that's what he wanted. What he has said many times is the game has changed and he's not interested in enforcers that can't play the game. Dubas has brought in plenty of grit over the years, and no, not just this past off season. The acquisitions are out there for anyone to see, if they care to know the truth.

The Kadri one wasn't a great trade. He'd be a far better fit than Kerfoot I think, but there were problems with keeping him. He had been suspended twice in 2 years during the playoffs. With all his other suspensions, I don't think management trusted him to do the right thing. He had hurt the team too many times. He also didn't want to play on the 3rd line, but was never going to beat out JT or AM. So it was switch to wing or play the 3rd line.

No GM is perfect, but the good ones see their mistakes and quickly address them. Ceci and Barrie didn't pan out. Dubas quickly addressed it. He felt like we needed some more defensive, gritty players for the playoffs so he has addressed it. He added 2 goalies, 1 of which may end up our long term starter.

GM's can't just go out and get whoever they want. It doesn't work that way. Dubas has brought in players he could afford without destroying the future of the team. He has a plan to be competitive long term and is trying to balance that with short term success. He's not going to trade away the farm to get players that HF leaf haters think he should just go acquire. Pretty sure other teams get to decide who to part with and who not to.

 

[shaner82]

Yeah. It took what? 10 games to move him up? They were so starved for that type of skill set to play regular minutes. As a former player himself, Keefe understands the value in this type of player.

I was more speaking to how misleading it is to call Simmonds a 4th line grit guy. He’s a good player who adds physicality and competitiveness, and can play almost anywhere in the lineup. The Leafs were sorely lacking a player like this prior to this season.

Simmons can play on the 2nd line, but it's not an ideal fit. He's clearly in over his head on the top 2 lines. He's a much better fit on the bottom 6.

 

[jc17]

This poll is embarrassingly close.

Can’t be surprised with Hf tho.

Pretty sure dubas was losing for a few months too

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Leafs 60 points, tied for #2 in the league.

Vancouver 35 points #27 in the league.

There should not be a single vote for Jim Benning, you simply can't justify it.

 

[LEAFANFORLIFE23]

Pretty sure dubas was losing for a few months too

He was