Salary Cap: Jets 2019: roster and cap situation

lifelonghockeyfan

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I think folks are really confused about teams in "cap hell".
Teams have bad cap issues if they players being paid too much. Or they have long term salary retention of traded players. Or having buy out money on the books because they made bad signings.

If a team has trouble signing players because they have too many good players.....that his hardly cap hell. The team will just have to trade a player or two, and if they are good players you'll going to close to 100% value for that player.

If a team can't sign their own upcoming UFAs, so what, that's the nature of free agency, players have a choice of 31 teams. The best scenario is a team has had the good service of an upcoming (and expensive UFA) is that can let that player "walk" because they have a good ELC or cheaper RFA replacement.
 

HannuJ

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I would rather not bridge Morrissey. It is an option though.

Bridging or not bridging a young player is not entirely at the team's choice. If the offer is not high enough his agent may prefer to see him bridged also.
and that's what i understood was the stradegy. bridge to save $$ now, cash out later.
 

surixon

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and that's what i understood was the stradegy. bridge to save $$ now, cash out later.

The issue as I see it is that it isn't that crucial to save now at the expense of paying later. It is still favorable to pay now on young talent with the expectation of saving later (When we are in cap hell). The Jets are ok next season so one year of Morrissey's bridge is effectively not needed or wasted. You are really only getting one year of value on his bridge which imo makes it not optimal. If you get him long term now while his counting numbers are lower then what I expect they will be over the next two seasons you potentially get a Scheifele caliber steal on the backend. That is worth more both long and short term.
 

Adam da bomb

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The issue as I see it is that it isn't that crucial to save now at the expense of paying later. It is still favorable to pay now on young talent with the expectation of saving later (When we are in cap hell). The Jets are ok next season so one year of Morrissey's bridge is effectively not needed or wasted. You are really only getting one year of value on his bridge which imo makes it not optimal. If you get him long term now while his counting numbers are lower then what I expect they will be over the next two seasons you potentially get a Scheifele caliber steal on the backend. That is worth more both long and short term.
I agree with you, but, we are starting to drift away from talking about K-Ves. The only player that K-Ves could replace that would make a difference financially is Perrault. There isn't big savings, replacing, Copp, Tanev, Armia. So it maybe a non-issue as people on here don't think Perrault is replaceable.
 

surixon

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I agree with you, but, we are starting to drift away from talking about K-Ves. The only player that K-Ves could replace that would make a difference financially is Perrault. There isn't big savings, replacing, Copp, Tanev, Armia. So it maybe a non-issue as people on here don't think Perrault is replaceable.

He most certainly will replace Perrault at some point. I think he and the team are better served with him playing a year on the Moose with say 2p.games worth of call ups (Perrault can't stay healthy) then him having a full time role next season.
 
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HannuJ

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He most certainly will replace Perrault at some point. I think he and the team are better served with him playing a year on the Moose with say 2p.games worth of call ups (Perrault can't stay healthy) then him having a full time role next season.
and if you're talking about replacing Perreault, I'd think the succession would be:
Petan replaces Perreault in 2018-19
Vesalainen replaces/upgrades Petan midway 2018-19 or in 19-20
 
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Mortimer Snerd

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I doubt K Ves makes the Jets next year, so looking to him for cap relief is doubtful.

Agree. But the suggestion was made and we went OT in discussing it.

Even the next year, when he more likely does make the NHL it is only cap relief if we can point to a specific, more expensive player he replaces. If he just bumps a low cost contract from the bottom there is no cap relief.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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Nope, but, I'd like there to be at least the possibility of a long term deal within our budget. If K-Ves can walk right into the NHL it gives the Jets that option.

Not really, or at least not necessarily. We have discussed moving MP for cap relief. We have possible LW replacements already. So Vesa can be allowed to develop in the AHL at his own pace.

We either keep MP or we move him with no reference to Vesalainen. The following year he can try to unseat whichever player replaced MP.

The real cap crunch comes the year after next. I would rather not rush KV for the sake of getting a little wiggle room next year.
 

Mortimer Snerd

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and that's what i understood was the stradegy. bridge to save $$ now, cash out later.

It has been discussed. I don't think it was ever accepted as the consensus solution.

We have 2 players who are potential bridge candidates to try to delay the cap crunch, Morrissey and Connor. One this year and the other next year. I think most here would prefer to lock up both of them. Reality may force Chevy to bridge either or both.

If Jomo gets a 2 year bridge deal it would expire the same time as Kulikov's contract. If Connor gets a 2 year bridge deal it would expire at the same time as Buff's contract. That timing could go a long way toward solving the problem and keeping this group together.

Of course we are still left with the problem of replacing the players whose contracts expire but that is another story.
 
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oldunclehue

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It has been discussed. I don't think it was ever accepted as the consensus solution.

We have 2 players who are potential bridge candidates to try to delay the cap crunch, Morrissey and Connor. One this year and the other next year. I think most here would prefer to lock up both of them. Reality may force Chevy to bridge either or both.

If Jomo gets a 2 year bridge deal it would expire the same time as Kulikov's contract. If Connor gets a 2 year bridge deal it would expire at the same time as Buff's contract. That timing could go a long way toward solving the problem and keeping this group together.

Of course we are still left with the problem of replacing the players whose contracts expire but that is another story.

I think our window to win is now and in the next two years. Re-evaluate the expiring contracts then. Buff may be a pay cut by then, Kulikov who knows.

The young core (sheif, ehlers, Laine, Connor, morrissey) need to stay. I’m not opposed to sign/trade deal with Trouba, Enstrom likely gone, give Helle a good contract and trade Hutch! Mason contract off the books in 2020 too!

We will be fine! Especially if the players want success, the older guys will want to play for a contender and have families they don’t want to uproot. Hopefully they take a bit of a cut as they age!
 

Mortimer Snerd

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I think our window to win is now and in the next two years. Re-evaluate the expiring contracts then. Buff may be a pay cut by then, Kulikov who knows.

The young core (sheif, ehlers, Laine, Connor, morrissey) need to stay. I’m not opposed to sign/trade deal with Trouba, Enstrom likely gone, give Helle a good contract and trade Hutch! Mason contract off the books in 2020 too!

We will be fine! Especially if the players want success, the older guys will want to play for a contender and have families they don’t want to uproot. Hopefully they take a bit of a cut as they age!

A window has opened. I think the goal should be to keep it open as long as possible.

We can't trade Hutch. His contract is expiring. OK, technically we could trade his rights but they are worthless.

We may need to lose 1 of our good young players. Not only for cap management but also for roster management. That is a big maybe though. But if Trouba doesn't want to be here, trading him could solve some problems. Obviously it would also create some problems but the right return could work out well ..... maybe .... possibly.
 

surixon

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I think our window to win is now and in the next two years. Re-evaluate the expiring contracts then. Buff may be a pay cut by then, Kulikov who knows.

The young core (sheif, ehlers, Laine, Connor, morrissey) need to stay. I’m not opposed to sign/trade deal with Trouba, Enstrom likely gone, give Helle a good contract and trade Hutch! Mason contract off the books in 2020 too!

We will be fine! Especially if the players want success, the older guys will want to play for a contender and have families they don’t want to uproot. Hopefully they take a bit of a cut as they age!

The window with our young core should be open for the next 5 to 7 years if managed correctly. I don't think its prudent to go all in to win it all over the next two seasons.
 
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For next year, assume Stastny is not resigned.

Connor/Scheifele/Wheels - $12.8 mill
Ehlers/Little/Laine - $12.2 mill
Perreault/Roslovic/Armia - $7 mill
Copp/Lowry/Tanev - $5 mill
PB#1, PB#2 - $1.5 mill

Or about $38.5 mill for forwards.

Morrissey/Trouba - $11.0 mill
Morrow/Buff - $8.5 mill
Kulikov/Myers - $9.8 mill
Chiarot/Poolman - $2.3 mill

Or about $31.6 mill for defensemen.

Hellebuyck- $5.5 mill
Mason - $4.1 mill

Or about $9.6 mill for goalies.

That totals $79.7 million.

With performance bonuses for Laine, Connor, and maybe Roslovic there needs to be a some movement this summer. Myers? Mason? Perreault?

Vesalainen might be the best replacement option for Perreault, from a role and salary perspective.

Small issues with a lot of what's posted here & every little bit helps if the goal is to test to see if the space exists to keep the roster intact & sign Stastny. I've already said I believe there is.

Right off the bat the math is bad. You're off $150,000 on the combined salaries of 81-55-26.

No problem actually as you short yourself on 27-25-29 by $250,000. That's $100,000 & the furthest ahead you'll be as this goes on.

85-52-40. Armia's most comparable is Lowry at $1.15 million AAV. The sum of 85+52 leaves a difference of $2 million in salary. Chevy has set a standard of signing the foot soldiers to bridge deals. I expect Armia to get 2 years a $1.4 million per season. $600,000 saved.

9-17-13. Copp is already under contract for $1 million. If I'm overly generous Tanev gets the same. That puts Lowry at $3 million AAV. Over the coarse of his next contract, that may be his max year & his lowest $1.75. An AAV on a 4 year deal could be in the neighbourhood of $2.25 million. That's another $750,000 in savings. I agree Lowry will get a good contract, but it'll be arranged to keep the AAV low.

You've got a 24 man roster listed. Let's go with a 23 man roster of 2 defencemen & 1 forward. Let's also assume either one of Dano, Petan. The maximum on either would be $900,000. That's another $600,000.

We've barely begun & that's $1.85 million in total, before getting to the real discussion.

I'd suggest the teams long term success hinges on 2 successful signings, Trouba & Morrissey. There's no more dilly dallying with the Trouba contract. He needs to be locked up. Sign him to a comparable contact, get him on 6 years and be done with it. Hampus Lindholm's $5.2 million is relevant. Jets get Trouba in his prime and Jacob gets to hit free agency at 30. Win win. Morrissey signs a bridge & we shave another off $3.5 million off your quote.

Then there's Connor Hellebuyck. He seems like the real deal, but $5.5AAV? If that contract is designed to fluctuate that's a hell of an average number. I'd suggest totally unrealistic. There isn't a goalie in the league under 28 that makes more than $4.5 million. Bucky currently looking to be the best in his age class. Gibson($2.3), Mrazek ($4.0), Murray ($3.75), & Vasilevskiy ($3.5) are his comparables. Promote him to the head of his class at $4.25 million & we're still saving in the neighbourhood of $1.25 million.

I have no issues with the rest of the salaries listed for defensive pairings. You're original post is not far off from my own reasonings, but the point here has been very small changes when signing the 9 RFA's who played significant roles this season (& a 10th counting Petan) amount to a tidy sum of cap space. With all this happening at once, Chevy certainly has a plan in place.

Anyways a total in the realm of $6.6 million was shaved off, certainly enough to sign Stastny. Will all this come to fruition? Perhaps not, but...

With 10 RFA's to sign, all of which will be waiver eligible, and an existing roster of 14 players already under contract, there's at least one deal occurring this summer. If Roslovic is making this team that displaces another player.

That's two deals with who knows what else in the mix. Two RFA's off a Stanley Cup winner & half of Mason's contract in return for picks this year? Who knows? The point is it's possible even more cap space can be created. Chevy has the chips to make this happen.

What I do know is we are the furthest thing from "cap hell" at some have said. We are not even in "cap trouble." Chevy has this entire process well thought out.

Looking forward to further playoff success & confident in strong seasons for years to come!
 
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KingBogo

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Small issues with a lot of what's posted here & every little bit helps if the goal is to test to see if the space exists to keep the roster intact & sign Stastny. I've already said I believe there is.

Right off the bat the math is bad. You're off $150,000 on the combined salaries of 81-55-26.

No problem actually as you short yourself on 27-25-29 by $250,000. That's $100,000 & the furthest ahead you'll be as this goes on.

85-52-40. Armia's most comparable is Lowry at $1.15 million AAV. The sum of 85+52 leaves a difference of $2 million in salary. Chevy has set a standard of signing the foot soldiers to bridge deals. I expect Armia to get 2 years a $1.4 million per season. $600,000 saved.

9-17-13. Copp is already under contract for $1 million. If I'm overly generous Tanev gets the same. That puts Lowry at $3 million AAV. Over the coarse of his next contract, that may be his max year & his lowest $1.75. An AAV on a 4 year deal could be in the neighbourhood of $2.25 million. That's another $750,000 in savings. I agree Lowry will get a good contract, but it'll be arranged to keep the AAV low.

You've got a 24 man roster listed. Let's go with a 23 man roster of 2 defencemen & 1 forward. Let's also assume either one of Dano, Petan. The maximum on either would be $900,000. That's another $600,000.

We've barely begun & that's $1.85 million in total, before getting to the real discussion.

I'd suggest the teams long term success hinges on 2 successful signings, Trouba & Morrissey. There's no more dilly dallying with the Trouba contract. He needs to be locked up. Sign him to a comparable contact, get him on 6 years and be done with it. Hampus Lindholm's $5.2 million is relevant. Jets get Trouba in his prime and Jacob gets to hit free agency at 30. Win win. Morrissey signs a bridge & we shave another off $3.5 million off your quote.

Then there's Connor Hellebuyck. He seems like the real deal, but $5.5AAV? If that contract is designed to fluctuate that's a hell of an average number. I'd suggest totally unrealistic. There isn't a goalie in the league under 28 that makes more than $4.5 million. Bucky currently looking to be the best in his age class. Gibson($2.3), Mrazek ($4.0), Murray ($3.75), & Vasilevskiy ($3.5) are his comparables. Promote him to the head of his class at $4.25 million & we're still saving in the neighbourhood of $1.25 million.

I have no issues with the rest of the salaries listed for defensive pairings. You're original post is not far off from my own reasonings, but the point here has been very small changes when signing the 9 RFA's who played significant roles this season (& a 10th counting Petan) amount to a tidy sum of cap space. With all this happening at once, Chevy certainly has a plan in place.

Anyways a total in the realm of $6.6 million was shaved off, certainly enough to sign Stastny. Will all this come to fruition? Perhaps not, but...

With 10 RFA's to sign, all of which will be waiver eligible, and an existing roster of 14 players already under contract, there's at least one deal occurring this summer. If Roslovic is making this team that displaces another player.

That's two deals with who knows what else in the mix. Two RFA's off a Stanley Cup winner & half of Mason's contract in return for picks this year? Who knows? The point is it's possible even more cap space can be created. Chevy has the chips to make this happen.

What I do know is we are the furthest thing from "cap hell" at some have said. We are not even in "cap trouble." Chevy has this entire process well thought out.

Looking forward to further playoff success & confident in strong seasons for years to come!
Not a bad effort, though a table with actual numbers including performance bonuses and UFA #'s would be helpful. The one place you are off IMO is seeing Lindholm as a comparable for Trouba. Lindholm signed his deal coming off his ELC with 4 RFA years and no arbitration rights and even at that it was a bargain for the Ducks. Trouba has now gone the bridge route with only 2 RFA years left and with arbitration rights. No way he takes a low ball team friendly deal. He likely gets more than that on a 1 year arbitration ruling setting himself to be in the drivers seat going into his UFA year. I'm hopeful Trouba is willing to sign a mid range 5 year deal in the $6 - 6.5 M range.

I think also you would need to establish how long to you think we could afford Statsney as a UFA. Kicking Morrissey's big deal down the road helps for 2 years but then the hit is bigger and may be huge if his offensive numbers climb. You have only 1 year before Laine's big hit with Wheeler's and Connor's next contracts also coming due. Sure some money comes off the books but not enough to account for all these salaries IMO at least.
 

lifelonghockeyfan

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Regarding Perrault and Mason.
From the Jet's perspective.....maybe Mason can be given away to save 4m in cap space. I feel the same way about Perrault. He has value but at 4.1m he is a tough trade without taking money back return in a trade. If some team would take him....even for free, I think the Jets would be wise. Then use that free money to sign better players than Perrault and Mason.
Perrault to me is a better winger than centre. But the Canadians think he would be helpful at centre...maybe there is a place for him in Montreal. Maybe Mason can help Darling in Carolina..

Isn't it rather optimistic from Jets fans that Trouba is going to sign long term with the Jets? He seems to be made his path to be a UFA in two years. The question should be do the Jets trade him for value or do you ride him for two years to make a your club better for a another two year run at the Cup. If he walks as a UFA in two years, so be it, you hope you have got good use of his services in the time he was a Jet.
 
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DudeWhereIsMakar

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I want Vesalainen on the Jets come 2019-20 because there's a chance we'll be bound for cap problems, so having him come in when his ELC starts means he could get more ice-time in Finland next season and would likely be on the roster because of his cap hit.
 

10Ducky10

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Our 2019-2020 roster with salaries and a 85m salary cap.
Helle 5
Comrie 1
Goalies 6m

Trouba 7
Buff 7.6
Poolman 1
Morrissey 5.4
Kuli 4.4
Niku 1
Morro? 1
D men 27.4m

Wheeler 7
Scheif 6.125
Ehlers 6
Laine 8
Little 5.3
MP 4.125
Connor 4.5
Lowry 3
Armia 1.5
Copp1
Tanev 1
Roslo 1
Dano 1
Petan 1
Forwards 52.175m

Total 85.575m
 

Maukkis

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@Arthur Fonzarelli

Not going to quote your lengthy post due to writing this on my phone, but there are some holes in your logic too.

First off - and this is often forgotten by many - Armia is coming off of his bridge deal just like Lowry is. Armia's comparables include guys like Marcus Foligno, Josh Bailey, Cal Clutterbuck and co., which puts him closer to 2.5-3m range. While we're at it, I feel like you're underselling Lowry, who is better than Armia both offensively and defensively.

Secondly, Lindholm is not relevant at all as a comparison for Trouba's next contract. The dollar amount could be close, though. There were talks about Trouba's next deal in another thread, which had ~6 AAV as a likely number.

Finally, what you said about Hellebuyck... it just isn't right. Those comparables you listed are on short-term deals beginning right after the end of their ELCs. The latter does not apply to Hellebuyck, and unless the Jets opt for a really short deal, neither should the former.

You had some good points, but I feel like you oversimplified a lot of things too.
 

Bigfish

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Oct 12, 2016
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Our 2019-2020 roster with salaries and a 85m salary cap.
Helle 5
Comrie 1
Goalies 6m

Trouba 7
Buff 7.6
Poolman 1
Morrissey 5.4
Kuli 4.4
Niku 1
Morro? 1
D men 27.4m

Wheeler 7
Scheif 6.125
Ehlers 6
Laine 8
Little 5.3
MP 4.125
Connor 4.5
Lowry 3
Armia 1.5
Copp1
Tanev 1
Roslo 1
Dano 1
Petan 1
Forwards 52.175m

Total 85.575m

Is the salary cap expected to increase by $10 million (13%) over the next 2 years?
 

Hunter368

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Love to see some updated cap projections for the team and broken down by players
 

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