Value of: Jesse Puljujarvi to the Jets

[north49er]

You’re offering nothing of even middling value, and you know it, and now comes 5 pages of bashing Puljujarvi and half-assed defences of a terrible offer that the Oilers would be out of their minds to accept.

Comrie is a mediocre prospect. Petan is a mediocre prospect. Despite what you’d prefer to believe, Puljujarvi has a lot of value still.

Consider ‘would Colorado take this offer for Jost?’ If the answer is incredulous laughter, reconsider.

Agree but keeping everything relative, Puljujarvi has only mediocre value. The Jackets knew something when they passed on him in the draft.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Agree but keeping everything relative, Puljujarvi has only mediocre value. The Jackets knew something when they passed on him in the draft.

Tyson Jost must only have mediocre value too. Same with Nylander, Brown, and McLeod. Would an offer of Petan and Comrie even get you a courtesy form email reply for any of those guys?

 

[Hunter368]

He is 20 years old.

For Petan’s results at the NHL level, I’d offer a fourth round pick. For Comrie’s I’d shoot you a 7th if we didn’t have a better goalie prospect in the AHL already and another good one coming in Rodrigue.

Only in Jets land is Petan and Comrie anywhere close to Puljujarvi in value. You’re eying up the Ferrari on the lot with a couple scratches and offering a dented toaster oven and a rickety washing machine, straight up.

Oh I get you don’t want to accept the package I wouldn’t expect you would after spending a very high draft pick on him.....you’re now locked in long term praying he develops into a nhl player. But no one outside Edmonton cares what what his draft position was....based on his pedestrian results in the AHL and nhl he is value isn’t huge anymore. Hopefully you guys get some value from him, don’t like to see any Canadian team fail. Love to see him down in the AHL and given more time to develop in a league he has a chance to do well in.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Oh I get you don’t want to accept the package I wouldn’t expect you would after spending a very high draft pick on him.....you’re now locked in long term praying he develops into a nhl player. But no one outside Edmonton cares what what his draft position was....based on his pedestrian results in the AHL and nhl he is value isn’t huge anymore. Hopefully you guys get some value from him, don’t like to see any Canadian team fail. Love to see him down in the AHL and given more time to develop in a league he has a chance to do well in.

So what you’re saying is Currie and Starret for Roslovic is a perfectly reasonable offer given his pedestrian results in the NHL so far and being a full draft class older than Puljujarvi?

Man, if you guys think Puljujarvi is a bust at 20 I’d sure hate to see what you guys think of a 21 year old with a paltry two assists in 12 games. No one cares he was once a first round pick, that kind of point pace can’t be acceptable.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

I am all for buying low but he's worth more than that.

 

[LTIR]

Agree but keeping everything relative, Puljujarvi has only mediocre value. The Jackets knew something when they passed on him in the draft.

They knew that Dubois is a big C who scored 40+goals and 99 pts in his draft year?
I wonder why TML passed on Laine.. they must have known something too.
Pulju may bust but we still have good 2 yrs to get there.

 

[LTIR]

I am all for buying low but he's worth more than that.

You are not doing it right... You gotta go with the pack and keep bashing the kid.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

You are not doing it right... You gotta go with the pack and keep bashing the kid.

For sure. The move now is to lower the offer even more. Dennis Everberg straight up for Puljujarvi. Whatever a Nelson Nogier is for Evan Bouchard - Bouchard’s 19 and isn’t a top pairing defenceman yet? BUST! Peter Stoykewych (there’s no way some bored stats guy didn’t just invent him for the hell of it, that’s Taro Tsjumoto 2.0) for McDavid 1 for 1. Push the insulting lowball offers to the limit.

 

[GoJetsGo55]

You are not doing it right... You gotta go with the pack and keep bashing the kid.

Lets just say that bashing an under-performing Fin hits a little too close to home

 

[Flyerfan52]

If they can't find room for Vesalainen how could they find room for Puljujarvi?

Good question.

Although Pulujarvi obviously has talent as we saw when he represented Finland internationally & his stats playing in Finland reinforced he hasn't been able to translate that to North American ice playing in Edmonton's system in the 2+ years since his draft. The fact he's been a healthy scratch in favor of young players drafted later seems to show he's lost that high pick sparkle Oilers brass seems to love. I believe the talent is still there & can be unlocked by a different, more patient team if he's traded sooner rather than later. Another year & his value drops while now teams still look @ what made him a high pick thinking they can salvage him.
There is a difference between salvaging a young career & a reclaimation project but he seems to be straddling that fine line already so rhis year could be crucial. As of now the return should still be fairly high but the fact he's already on the last year of his ELC works against that value in the future as he'll be just another prospect shuffling between the NHL & AHL.
I agree with greasysnapper that if traded it's most likely a team in the east. But even there the teams with upcoming high draft picks are usually big on their own kids so it'd likely be a contender (or former contender) offering a latish 1st & an older but still usable player as they try to backfill the cabinet to replace all the 1st round picks they don't have as they traded those picks away for help in the now as they made their best runs to go deep. Washington or Pittsburgh could fit that category while the Rangers with their fire sale would probably go with a vet & a 2nd or 3rd rounder.

A couple of years ago the Jets would have likely jumped @ the chance to trade for a player with that high pedigree (see Marko Dano) but with the pipeline full of their own picks they've brought along in their own system they don't need to spend assets to do so anymore.

Sorry about the long post but I hate seeing a waste of a player when it doesn't appear to be on him. I've never seen anything about him having a Ho-Sang type attitude so see it as a case of his team letting him down like they did so many dating back to Sam Gagner, Andrew Cogliano & Robert Nilsson back in the days of Young Guns 1.0.

 

[Johnny HFBOARDS]

Lowry would be the ask.

If Pulju is a bust then Petan 'busted' 3 yrs ago.

Sooo... He's almost EDM ripe then?

 

[CupofOil]

I'd start with Petan and Comrie.

Why would the Oilers even bother wasting their time with this?
They might as well see his development through rather than give him away for borderline NHLers. It makes no sense to give him away just a little more than 2 years into his career.

As you saw firsthand against the Jets, he has the capability to be an impact player. It's just going to take time and patience to get it out of him.

 

[Hunter368]

You are not doing it right... You gotta go with the pack and keep bashing the kid.

No one is bashing him in this thread though.....people just offering value based on his actual accomplishments to-date after 100 games in the NHL while at the same time saying we fully understand why the Oilers wouldn’t do it. Stating facts isn’t bashing.....it’s just being factual. Repeatedly stated he likely needs to develop more in the AHL and gain confidence down there. Again......not bashing him in the least. But also not giving up major assets to get him considering his performance. Keep in mind I didn’t create this thread.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

*we’re not bashing him!*

Offering a package like Petan and Comrie IS bashing Puljujarvi.

The offer is frankly insulting, so you might as well be - and you don’t appear to like when similar logic is applied to your own prospect that’s struggling to produce.

 

[LTIR]

No one is bashing him in this thread though.....people just offering value based on his actual accomplishments to-date after 100 games in the NHL while at the same time saying we fully understand why the Oilers wouldn’t do it. Stating facts isn’t bashing.....it’s just being factual. Repeatedly stated he likely needs to develop more in the AHL and gain confidence down there. Again......not bashing him in the least.

Talking about accomplishments for a 20yo. I guess I would offer you a 5th for Sami Niku.
That's just silliness.
Puljujarvi still holds a lot of value and will continue to do so for another year or 2. If Oilers trade him they would be looking for a return like Drouin trade.

 

[Hunter368]

*we’re not bashing him!*

No, but your offer is frankly insulting, so you might as well be.

Keep in mind I didn’t make this thread.....don’t blame me for the OP. But you need to look at it a bit more subjectively.....you wouldn’t offer major assets for a struggling prospect and you certainly wouldn’t care about his draft position. You would likely offer what he’s worth based on his results to-date plus a bit for potential and say I understand why you wouldn’t do it.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Keep in mind I didn’t make this thread.....don’t blame me for the OP. But you need to look at it a bit more subjectively.....you wouldn’t offer major assets for a struggling prospect and you certainly wouldn’t care about his draft position. You would likely offer what he’s worth based on his results to-date plus a bit for potential and say I understand why you wouldn’t do it.

You did defend it, though, and I certainly wouldn’t do Avs fans the disservice of offering whatever spare parts we could dig out of Bakersfield for Jost or to Jersey for McLeod.

Prospect value simply doesn’t immediately depreciate the way you seem to think it does. I’m not saying he still holds 4th overall value, but every team in the league would easily beat OP’s offer, including the actual Jets.

Even the hambrained fans of other teams are offering young middle six wingers like Hudon and Baertschi and multiple second round picks, or first round picks +.

Subjectively, OP’s offer stinks, it’s predatory, it’s insulting, and as a mod you should be embarrassed you backed up a pretty obvious troll offer.

 

[Hunter368]

Talking about accomplishments for a 20yo. I guess I would offer you a 5th for Sami Niku.
That's just silliness.
Puljujarvi still holds a lot of value and will continue to do so for another year or 2. If Oilers trade him they would be looking for a return like Drouin trade.

How do you compare a two prospects, one who has struggled in both the AHL & NHL to one who has dominated in the AHL?

Drouin had produced much more then Pool Party has.....when he was traded and during the A.

Again not trying to put him down but totally don’t get how you compare him to either Niku or Drouin.

 

[CupofOil]

Keep in mind I didn’t make this thread.....don’t blame me for the OP. But you need to look at it a bit more subjectively.....you wouldn’t offer major assets for a struggling prospect and you certainly wouldn’t care about his draft position. You would likely offer what he’s worth based on his results to-date plus a bit for potential and say I understand why you wouldn’t do it.

You have to see it from an Oilers fan perspective though. Say if Laine struggled in his first 2 seasons and barely into his 3rd season, garbage proposals start popping up from everywhere like vultures circling a wounded animal. You'd be a little annoyed with it after a while as well.
Part of our frustration is at the organization for once again struggling to develop a prospect properly and leading to proposals like this one.

 

[Hockey Stick]

I just remember that draft day when everyone was ripping CBJ for taking Dubios 3rd overall lol

 

[LTIR]

How do you compare a two prospects, one who has struggled in both the AHL & NHL to one who has dominated in the AHL?

Drouin had produced much more then Pool Party has.....when he was traded and during the A.

Again not trying to put him down but totally don’t get how you compare him to either Niku or Drouin.

Struggled in the AHL? He may not have dominated but he did fine in AHL as a 18yo.. better than many other top prospects. If you can agree that both vesalainen and Niku would be considered busts if they are not NHL contributors this time next yr then I will buy your koolaid.

 

[Hunter368]

You did defend it, though, and I certainly wouldn’t do Avs fans the disservice of offering whatever spare parts we could dig out of Bakersfield for Jost or to Jersey for McLeod.

Prospect value simply doesn’t immediately depreciate the way you seem to think it does. I’m not saying he still holds 4th overall value, but every team in the league would easily beat OP’s offer, including the actual Jets.

Even the hambrained fans of other teams are offering young middle six wingers and multiple second round picks, or first round picks +.

Subjectively, OP’s offer stinks, it’s predatory, it’s insulting, and as a mod you should be embarrassed you backed it up.

We agree his value has dropped....significantly from 4th OA. What is his true who knows.....forum fans have no clue either side of this debate. But what his value truely is, is not meaningful bc the Oilers cannot give up on him or sell low on him......their in it for the long haul. My administrative role on the site has nothing to do with my personal opinions....that’s a moot point. I’ve repeatedly stated I understand why the Oilers wouldn’t do it, but also being on the other side of this debate I can understand why others wouldn’t give up the farm for him. No one here is truely expecting him to be traded, I wouldn’t expect you to agree with any other teams fans on his value.

Let me ask you a question, you acknowledged yourself he’s not worth his draft position of 4th OA at this point. Average draft year.......what do you feel his draft value is using a draft pick?

 

[Hunter368]

You have to see it from an Oilers fan perspective though. Say if Laine struggled in his first 2 seasons and barely into his 3rd season, garbage proposals start popping up from everywhere like vultures circling a wounded animal. You'd be a little annoyed with it after a while as well.
Part of our frustration is at the organization for once again struggling to develop a prospect properly and leading to proposals like this one.

Oh I totally understand your POV and that’s why I haven’t responded negatively to any post......I’m totally empathetic with the Oilers position with their management and Pool Party results. Not a single post of mine could be called trolling. But at the same time I would expect Oiler fans to say yeh we get he hasn’t performed well but we can’t afford to give up him yet and understand why other fans wouldn’t offer up the kitchen sink for him. Understand what I’m saying?

 

[knifer]

Big , fast , skilled playmaker taking some time to adjust. Ever heard of a guy named Wheeler.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

We agree his value has dropped....significantly from 4th OA. What is his true who knows.....forum fans have no clue either side of this debate. But what his value truely is, is not meaningful bc the Oilers cannot give up on him or sell low on him......their in it for the long haul. My administrative role on the site has nothing to do with my personal opinions....that’s a moot point. I’ve repeatedly stated I understand why the Oilers wouldn’t do it, but also being on the other side of this debate I can understand why others wouldn’t give up the farm for him. No one here is truely expecting him to be traded, I wouldn’t expect you to agree with any other teams fans on his value.

Let me ask you a question, you acknowledged yourself he’s not worth his draft position of 4th OA at this point. Average draft year.......what do you feel his draft value is using a draft pick?

The farm? No one is asking you to give up the farm here but you’re giving up the compost heap and the pig slops and somehow have the gall to defend it from the Jets POV. That’s indefensible, and a part of the reason this board sees a young player struggling and feels that any old spare junk is a reasonable offer.

Average year? He still goes 15-20 in my opinion.

Would you consider Petan and Comrie fair offers for the likes of Nylander, McLeod, Brown, Kunin, Bellows, Tufte, Jones, Gauthier, Frederic, or Rubstov? They’re all first rounders too that have done jack and squat at the NHL level. How about the Jets own resident poor first round pick, Logan Stanley? Is William Lagesson straight up a fair offer because he’s been every bit as good defensively and much more productive offensively and damn the age difference?

There are levels of nuance you’re either not seeing or not understanding between a ‘Here’s the keys to the farm’ offer and ‘here’s a dead coyote carcass the cows didn’t stomp on too bad’ offer. I’m sure you can suss out which end of the spectrum Oiler fans think this offer falls into.

Yes, his value has dropped. We can all agree on that. No, his value has not dropped THAT much.