Jayson Megna Re-Assigned to Wilkes-Barre/Scranton

[Shady Machine]

There was one shift where we had possession of the puck and he sort of...skated side by side with the guy who had the puck up the boards. He looked like he had absolutely no clue where he was supposed to be and sort of just skated a big circle around the offensive zone, half of that circle skating eight inches away from our puck carrier. That's the most blatant example of a lacking hockey sense, but I dunno if it's so much "no hockey sense" as it is "random colossal brain fart."

I'll have to take your word for it because I don't recall that. And 8 inches? I'd say you exaggerated a bit there.

 

[IcedCapp]

I'll have to take your word for it because I don't recall that. And 8 inches? I'd say you exaggerated a bit there.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

The likes of Cleary and Miller are comparable with Glass/Adams at this point, and they're keeping Nyquist - not a Megna calibre prospect, but a Bennett calibre prospect - completely out of the NHL.

So no, I won't be accepting any arguments to Babcock's authority when it comes to youth being served.

Thing is, Nyquist is in the AHL only because of the fact he didn't need waivers after training camp, and all of their other other forwards did...including Tomas Tatar. LAST year, injuries hit Detroit hard and Nyquist ended up playing a regular third line role with Joakim Andersson and Damien Brunner. None of the three had much NHL experience, if at all, yet Babcock played them as a unit fairly regularly. That line was sorta similar to Tampa's current third line of Palat-Johnson-Panik, who all played together in the AHL.

Babcock isn't keeping Nyquist in the AHL...Nyquist's contract, and to some extent Ken Holland, is. But look at Detroit, waiving and sending down Tootoo. Waiving Eaves. They healthy scratched Daniel Cleary the other day. Last season, their younger defensemen regularly played instead of Kyle Quincey and Carlo Colaiacovo, who were both healthy scratched a LOT. When have we done ANYTHING like that, under Bylsma???

Does Mike Babcock prefer veterans to rookies? Of course he does. But in Detroit, it's the GM who is a veterans hoarder, not the coach. AND, the coach certainly holds all of his players accountable, not just those who come in and out from the AHL.

For me, there's a HUGE difference between Babcock and Bylsma on this issue alone.

 

[Shady Machine]

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Thing is, Nyquist is in the AHL only because of the fact he didn't need waivers after training camp, and all of their other other forwards did...including Tomas Tatar. LAST year, injuries hit Detroit hard and Nyquist ended up playing a regular third line role with Joakim Andersson and Damien Brunner. None of the three had much NHL experience, if at all, yet Babcock played them as a unit fairly regularly. That line was sorta similar to Tampa's current third line of Palat-Johnson-Panik, who all played together in the AHL.

Babcock isn't keeping Nyquist in the AHL...Nyquist's contract, and to some extent Ken Holland, is. But look at Detroit, waiving and sending down Tootoo. Waiving Eaves. They healthy scratched Daniel Cleary the other day. Last season, their younger defensemen regularly played instead of Kyle Quincey and Carlo Colaiacovo, who were both healthy scratched a LOT. When have we done ANYTHING like that, under Bylsma???

Does Mike Babcock prefer veterans to rookies? Of course he does. But in Detroit, it's the GM who is a veterans hoarder, not the coach. AND, the coach certainly holds all of his players accountable, not just those who come in and out from the AHL.

For me, there's a HUGE difference between Babcock and Bylsma on this issue alone.

Jags, all of this is white noise. The fact is that Nyquist is by all accounts a Bennett-calibre prospect who has a much better track record, and more talent, than Megna, and he's being pushed out of the line-up by Adams and Glass-calibre vets.

If Babcock truly wanted to play the best 12 players, he'd have waived Cleary or Miller and brought up Nyquist. He hasn't. That's a more egregious "vet-over-youth" move than anything DB has done.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Jags, all of this is white noise. The fact is that Nyquist is by all accounts a Bennett-calibre prospect who has a much better track record, and more talent, than Megna, and he's being pushed out of the line-up by Adams and Glass-calibre vets.

If Babcock truly wanted to play the best 12 players, he'd have waived Cleary or Miller and brought up Nyquist. He hasn't. That's a more egregious "vet-over-youth" move than anything DB has done.

You seem to think Mike Babcock is the General Manager of the Detroit Red Wings, or something.

 

[UnrealMachine]

Jags, all of this is white noise. The fact is that Nyquist is by all accounts a Bennett-calibre prospect who has a much better track record, and more talent, than Megna, and he's being pushed out of the line-up by Adams and Glass-calibre vets.

If Babcock truly wanted to play the best 12 players, he'd have waived Cleary or Miller and brought up Nyquist. He hasn't. That's a more egregious "vet-over-youth" move than anything DB has done.

Dan Cleary has literally 3-4 times the goal-scoring rate and 2-3 times the point-scoring rate over his career than Adams & Glass on a per game basis. You really think those players are comparable? The rest of your post is fine, but not unlike prospects, there are also various degrees of vets. Extremely various in this case.

 

[mpp9]

The likes of Cleary and Miller are comparable with Glass/Adams at this point, and they're keeping Nyquist - not a Megna calibre prospect, but a Bennett calibre prospect - completely out of the NHL.

So no, I won't be accepting any arguments to Babcock's authority when it comes to youth being served.

As Jiggy said, Chicago is a much better franchise to model ourselves after. I've always rolled my eyes whenever the organization mentions the Wings and how they do things. They're old and past their time as contenders.

All Im saying is D'Agostini has done dick to earn a spot. Megna provided a spark. This team could use that. And if Cleary can still stand on his skates in front of the net, he'd be an upgrade in terms of what this team is lacking.

You wanted Cleary signed just a few months ago.

 

[Kobita]

I'll have to take your word for it because I don't recall that. And 8 inches? I'd say you exaggerated a bit there.

Slightly hyperbolic but he really wasn't that far away, definitely too close for any meaningful pass to be sent his way or for more than one defender to need to cover him and the puck carrier. I don't really have a video of it or anything but it was in the second CBJ game.

 

[MtlPenFan]

Chicago is absolutely the right team to model ourselves after, not the Wings. I love me Babcock, but he loves his vets as much as the next guy, and the tiny youth movement last year started when A)It started to look like they weren't going to make the playoffs and B) They had a few injuries to key players.

I love what Chicago did. Handzus was kinda their Guerin last playoffs, played really well and helped them win a Cup. This year though, and I saw quite a few of their games at the start of the year, the guy was awful, and couldn't keep up with Hossa and Sharp.

So what did they do? The scratched him then moved him to the 4th line. Now they have Pirri playing 2nd line center and oh look, 4 goals 4 assists.

As I said last night, I'm starting to dislike this team, and may catch myself quietly rooting for the Predators tonight to get the ball rolling in creating some changes.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

You seem to think Mike Babcock is the General Manager of the Detroit Red Wings, or something.

Holland doesn't choose who makes or doesn't make the team, Jags.

Dan Cleary has literally 3-4 times the goal-scoring rate and 2-3 times the point-scoring rate over his career than Adams & Glass on a per game basis. You really think those players are comparable? The rest of your post is fine, but not unlike prospects, there are also various degrees of vets. Extremely various in this case.

Since when does career PPG factor into this? If it does, the same should apply to D'Agostini.

In terms of effectiveness right now - which is all anyone here wants to focus on - Cleary is no better than Adams/Glass. Further, Drew Miller still falls into that category.

As Jiggy said, Chicago is a much better franchise to model ourselves after. I've always rolled my eyes whenever the organization mentions the Wings and how they do things. They're old and past their time as contenders.

All Im saying is D'Agostini has done dick to earn a spot. Megna provided a spark. This team could use that. And if Cleary can still stand on his skates in front of the net, he'd be an upgrade in terms of what this team is lacking.

You wanted Cleary signed just a few months ago.

I wanted Megna to stay up too. I just won't let anybody use Babcock as some paragon of youth being served, because it's not true.

And yep, I looked at Cleary as an option. In hindsight, that would've been a mistake.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Chicago is absolutely the right team to model ourselves after, not the Wings. I love me Babcock, but he loves his vets as much as the next guy, and the tiny youth movement last year started when A)It started to look like they weren't going to make the playoffs and B) They had a few injuries to key players.

I love what Chicago did. Handzus was kinda their Guerin last playoffs, played really well and helped them win a Cup. This year though, and I saw quite a few of their games at the start of the year, the guy was awful, and couldn't keep up with Hossa and Sharp.

So what did they do? The scratched him then moved him to the 4th line. Now they have Pirri playing 2nd line center and oh look, 4 goals 4 assists.

As I said last night, I'm starting to dislike this team, and may catch myself quietly rooting for the Predators tonight to get the ball rolling in creating some changes.

Chicago does a better job of implementing youth than most teams, but Pirri also apprenticed in the AHL longer and better than any of our prospects, and on a team that hasn't been deep at center.

Megna played 0 AHL games before this year. Pirri played 212.

 

[Jag68Sid87]

Holland doesn't choose who makes or doesn't make the team, Jags.

You don't think GM's have a say in who makes or doesn't make a hockey team out of camp, seriously? ESPECIALLY when dealing with one-way contracts vs. two-way contracts, waiver-eligible vs. non-waiver-eligible, etc. etc.

This isn't football. The GM has more power than a coach.

Chicago does a better job of implementing youth than most teams, but Pirri also apprenticed in the AHL longer and better than any of our prospects, and on a team that hasn't been deep at center.

Megna played 0 AHL games before this year. Pirri played 212.

How many AHL games did Brandon Saad get before they implemented him into their top nine?

 

[IcedCapp]

Wait, I thought players earned time through playing well. Now RRP is saying that players have to play a certain number of games in the AHL first?

Wheel.
Of.
Excusessssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss.

 

[MrBurghundy]

Um... Megna did play AHL games before this year. 56 to be exact.

Unless you mean NHL games?

 

[Shady Machine]

Um... Megna did play AHL games before this year. 56 to be exact.

Unless you mean NHL games?

Yeah I was really confused by that post.

 

[MrBurghundy]

Yeah I was really confused by that post.

Not that 56 is a lot, but still...

 

[Honour Over Glory]

Great, so now we get to see D'Agostini suck, regularly.

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

You don't think GM's have a say in who makes or doesn't make a hockey team out of camp, seriously? ESPECIALLY when dealing with one-way contracts vs. two-way contracts, waiver-eligible vs. non-waiver-eligible, etc. etc.

This isn't football. The GM has more power than a coach.

No, I don't. If you're going to play "absolve the coach by blaming the GM" for line-up decisions on another team, you have to apply it across the board.

Nyquist, better by a mile than any forward prospect we currently have outside the NHL, is in the minors because of veterans no better than our whipping boys. Babcock himself said that he ices the 12 forwards who best help the team.

How many AHL games did Brandon Saad get before they implemented him into their top nine?

Megna is no Saad. Megna's not even a Pirri.

We have our own Saad comparable, and he's already playing in the top 9.

Wait, I thought players earned time through playing well. Now RRP is saying that players have to play a certain number of games in the AHL first?

Wheel.
Of.
Excusessssssssssssssssssssssssssssssss.

Young players get looks, and then sometimes get sent down despite looking solid in limited action. This is not exclusive to our team. It is, in fact, what happens on virtually every team.

Um... Megna did play AHL games before this year. 56 to be exact.

Unless you mean NHL games?

That was me derpin. My mistake.

The point still stands that the Blackhawks - a team this board is holding up as the ideal in terms of giving young players their due - kept a better prospect with better pedigree and better production than Megna in the minors for years. And in a position of need to boot.

You'll hear the same complaints from Bruins fans against Julien for keeping Spooner in the minors.

People need to visit other boards from time to time.

 

[MrBurghundy]

Just because your best friend jumps off a bridge, does that mean you should too?

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

Just because your best friend jumps off a bridge, does that mean you should too?

We aren't talking about one team here. We're talking about every other team in the league.

Giving a roster spot to an inexperienced young forward who came in and looked solid for a couple games while filling in for injuries would be the exception, not the rule. The criticisms people are leveling here apply to all coaches, so hoping things would change if someone other than DB were at the helm isn't realistic.

Hitchcock and Trotz and Babcock and Quenneville have done and would do the same.

 

[IcedCapp]

Just because your best friend jumps off a bridge, does that mean you should too?

were we friends with benefits?

 

[Shady Machine]

We aren't talking about one team here. We're talking about every other team in the league.

Giving a roster spot to an inexperienced young forward who came in and looked solid for a couple games while filling in for injuries would be the exception, not the rule. The criticisms people are leveling here apply to all coaches, so hoping things would change if someone other than DB were at the helm isn't realistic.

Hitchcock and Trotz and Babcock and Quenneville have done and would do the same.

I agree with you that it's the norm. My problem though is that in this situation it isn't young unproven guy vs proven vet grinder man, it's young unproven guy vs also kind of young guy with one good season 3 years ago and had to sign for league minimum to get a one way contract.

Megna was playing well and has done far more with his ice time than D'Ags has. Yet D'Ags somehow gets the benefit of the doubt while Megna gets demoted for the hell of it. That said, the Cap could have played a role in this but I think there are better ways to achieve that savings (trade Jeffrey already please).

 

[Ragamuffin Gunner]

So las week it was "DB is playing Meg in the top 6! That's proof he's changed!"

And now it's "other coaches play vets too!"

 

[Dipsy Doodle]

So las week it was "DB is playing Meg in the top 6! That's proof he's changed!"

And now it's "other coaches play vets too!"

I don't recall ever basing anything definitive on Megna solidifying a roster spot. I do remember saying that Megna getting a shot while Bennett and Maatta have solidified roster spots showed that the stereotypes people had about DB were wrong.

But Rags, you seem to have a curious habit of remembering things one way, and then never acknowledging prods to post support, haha.

I agree with you that it's the norm. My problem though is that in this situation it isn't young unproven guy vs proven vet grinder man, it's young unproven guy vs also kind of young guy with one good season 3 years ago and had to sign for league minimum to get a one way contract.

Megna was playing well and has done far more with his ice time than D'Ags has. Yet D'Ags somehow gets the benefit of the doubt while Megna gets demoted for the hell of it. That said, the Cap could have played a role in this but I think there are better ways to achieve that savings (trade Jeffrey already please).

We signed D'Agostini in the hopes that he would fill TK's niche for a fraction of the price. I guess DB wants to give him ample opportunity to do that so we know what we have, while giving limited looks to other WBS guys who've earned a shot. Sill's recall would seem to support that.