Player Discussion Jay Beagle

[Hit the post]

Agreed. 3M for Beagle is too much for a 4th line center. Especially at his age. He's one of the reasons why we'll likely lose Markstrom, Motte and possibly Tanev in the offseason.

Viewed in isolation - it's not THAT bad a contract (granted it ain't good). But the Eriksson deal left Benning really no margin for error in subsequent contracts. He's lucky the Pens GM was under the influence of something when he acquired a WORSE player in Guds *AND* gave us a servicable player in return.

 

[Cupless44]

Viewed in isolation - it's not THAT bad a contract (granted it ain't good). But the Eriksson deal left Benning really no margin for error in subsequent contracts. He's lucky the Pens GM was under the influence of something when he acquired a WORSE player in Guds *AND* gave us a servicable player in return.

No excuse for the Beagle deal. Well run organizations simply dont lock up a 33 -37 year old plug to 4 years at 3 million. He scores 3 goals a year, gets hammered defensively, cannot keep up to the pace. Ok so he can win a few face offs.

You can do better with a young player at the league minimum on the 4th line.

 

[F A N]

Agreed. 3M for Beagle is too much for a 4th line center. Especially at his age. He's one of the reasons why we'll likely lose Markstrom, Motte and possibly Tanev in the offseason.

Worrying about losing Motte is a bit ridiculous. I like Motte, but he is what others like to call a replacement level player. He's basically Leipic's replacement on this team.

 

[geebaan]

Worrying about losing Motte is a bit ridiculous. I like Motte, but he is what others like to call a replacement level player. He's basically Leipic's replacement on this team.

yea Tanev and Markstrom are one thing, but Motte is dime a dozen

 

[CanuckleBerry]

Beagle was signed for the stellar performance he ground out in Washington's Cup run. The idea was probably that the Canucks were buying a playoff performer, and Benning and Co were confident in the team's ability to make the playoffs in the immediate future. Perhaps it's the right sign and right deal for a franchise firmly established as a contender, but on this basis it's a very questionable move for the bubble Canucks. Will we even get a chance to see Beagle in the role where he is supposed to excel?

 

[F A N]

To me it's clear that the Beagle signing was heavily influenced by Travis Green. We've seen what Green likes to do when Beagle is in the lineup and out even when Sutter is in the lineup. With a healthy lineup, Green doesn't use Horvat as a matchup C. He prefers to have Sutter and Beagle do it. When either Sutter or Beagle is out, he has Horvat handle the duties instead of Sutter's or Beagle's replacement in the lineup.

 

[Diversification]

Beagle was signed for the stellar performance he ground out in Washington's Cup run. The idea was probably that the Canucks were buying a playoff performer, and Benning and Co were confident in the team's ability to make the playoffs in the immediate future. Perhaps it's the right sign and right deal for a franchise firmly established as a contender, but on this basis it's a very questionable move for the bubble Canucks. Will we even get a chance to see Beagle in the role where he is supposed to excel?

Here's the thing. Given his contract, you would expect that Beagle could assume the workload of a 3rd line defensive center in Sutter's absence without a huge drop off, at least for a decent stretch of games. That hasn't been the case.

 

[VanJack]

Here's the thing. Given his contract, you would expect that Beagle could assume the workload of a 3rd line defensive center in Sutter's absence without a huge drop off, at least for a decent stretch of games. That hasn't been the case.

Exactly. A guy earning $3m a season HAS to be able to move up the lineup in the event of an injury. But there Beagle sits, basically stapled to the fourth line and not even on pace to match the three goals he got last season.

But like Willie before him, Green just gets fixated on certain guys. How else do you explain the presence of both Beagle and Shaller on the same line that gets its lunch handed to it night after night?

The thing that baffles you is that both Benning and Green have preached the virtues of having four lines that can contribute offense. But they have at least one line that isn't capable of generating anything.

 

[Peter10]

To me it's clear that the Beagle signing was heavily influenced by Travis Green. We've seen what Green likes to do when Beagle is in the lineup and out even when Sutter is in the lineup. With a healthy lineup, Green doesn't use Horvat as a matchup C. He prefers to have Sutter and Beagle do it. When either Sutter or Beagle is out, he has Horvat handle the duties instead of Sutter's or Beagle's replacement in the lineup.

I could be wrong but wasnt there even a lot of talk that Green played a big role in identifying Beagle (and Roussel or Schaller) as potential targets that he would love to have on the team? I remember some criticism going around at the time that the coach should focus on coaching and the GM on GMing.

 

[Hit the post]

I could be wrong but wasnt there even a lot of talk that Green played a big role in identifying Beagle (and Roussel or Schaller) as potential targets that he would love to have on the team? I remember some criticism going around at the time that the coach should focus on coaching and the GM on GMing.

I'd actually rather have Benning just stick to amateur drafting and hire somebody to handle all the other duties of a GM.

 

[F A N]

I could be wrong but wasnt there even a lot of talk that Green played a big role in identifying Beagle (and Roussel or Schaller) as potential targets that he would love to have on the team? I remember some criticism going around at the time that the coach should focus on coaching and the GM on GMing.

Ya I can believe that. I'm kind of half and half on this issue. I think a coach should focus on coaching and the GM on GMing but in practical terms, a GM is unlikely to hire a coach who has the exact vision as the GM 100% of the time even when the vision changes or changes are made to adapt. I think a lot of people watched the Moneyball movie and expect the coach to simply follow his GM's instructions. In reality, you're unlikely to have success if your coach wants to play a certain way and you keep acquiring players that don't fit into what your coach wants to do. At the same time, coaches tend to be short-sighted and don't care about the future of the team so you don't want your head coach making most of the hockey operations decisions.

 

[Melvin]

I'd actually rather have Benning just stick to amateur drafting and hire somebody to handle all the other duties of a GM.

So would he

 

[Diamonddog01]

Washington just re-signed Backstrom at a reasonable amount, they now have 10M in space next season with Gudas being the big re-signing (assuming they walk from Hotlby). It's time for Beagle to return to Washington where he was beloved by both fans and teammates alike. We gotta get this trade to go down this offseason.

 

[tyhee]

Beagle was signed for the stellar performance he ground out in Washington's Cup run. The idea was probably that the Canucks were buying a playoff performer, and Benning and Co were confident in the team's ability to make the playoffs in the immediate future. Perhaps it's the right sign and right deal for a franchise firmly established as a contender, but on this basis it's a very questionable move for the bubble Canucks. Will we even get a chance to see Beagle in the role where he is supposed to excel?

Beagle's role was to be a defensive 4th line center. It's the role he fulfilled in Washington and it is the role he has now in Vancouver.

His last two years in Washington, including the season the Caps won the Cup, he averaged 13:38 and then 12:27 time on ice per game. This season he's averaging 12:38. In his last two seasons in Washington is OZ start percentages were, respectively, 31.1% and 25.2%. This season it is 32.5%.

His useage this season is what it was in Washington. He's playing essentially the same role. He's not doing it as well, but then a player performing worse at the age of 34 than he did at the ages of 31 and 32 isn't exactly surprising.

Paying him for four seasons in his mid-thirties at $3 million per didn't make sense for the Captitals, so they didn't do it. It made even less sense for Vancouver, which signed him anyway. His linemates likely aren't as good now as the 4th line of the Caps was, he's older than he was and probably worse for it, but he's filling the role he was intended to fill, pretty much the same role as he played with the Caps and despite the thinking of the Canucks' management group, he'll never be worth $3 million per season to do it.

 

[RandV]

I could be wrong but wasnt there even a lot of talk that Green played a big role in identifying Beagle (and Roussel or Schaller) as potential targets that he would love to have on the team? I remember some criticism going around at the time that the coach should focus on coaching and the GM on GMing.

The coach can identify the players he wants but it's up to the GM to know where to draw the line on signing a UFA contract.

 

[ddawg1950]

I would have thought he'd be better in his own zone...given how much time he spends in there.

 

[F A N]

Beagle's role was to be a defensive 4th line center. It's the role he fulfilled in Washington and it is the role he has now in Vancouver.

His last two years in Washington, including the season the Caps won the Cup, he averaged 13:38 and then 12:27 time on ice per game. This season he's averaging 12:38. In his last two seasons in Washington is OZ start percentages were, respectively, 31.1% and 25.2%. This season it is 32.5%.

His useage this season is what it was in Washington. He's playing essentially the same role. He's not doing it as well, but then a player performing worse at the age of 34 than he did at the ages of 31 and 32 isn't exactly surprising.

Paying him for four seasons in his mid-thirties at $3 million per didn't make sense for the Captitals, so they didn't do it. It made even less sense for Vancouver, which signed him anyway. His linemates likely aren't as good now as the 4th line of the Caps was, he's older than he was and probably worse for it, but he's filling the role he was intended to fill, pretty much the same role as he played with the Caps and despite the thinking of the Canucks' management group, he'll never be worth $3 million per season to do it.

Jay Beagle is a winner. His teams have only missed the playoffs twice in his pro career. He is also a master of old tech.

 

[Bojack Horvatman]

Jay Beagle is a winner. His teams have only missed the playoffs twice in his pro career. He is also a master of old tech.

Washington could of signed a towel rack as 4th line center and they would of made the playoffs those years.

 

[4Twenty]

I would have thought he'd be better in his own zone...given how much time he spends in there.

That’s part of the problem. The usage. If he wasn’t buried like he is it would be slightly better. The problem is you don’t want to waste offensive opportunities on his line either.

 

[Peen]

There’s some suggestion that Beagle’s injury may have him out until next year.

Really have to wonder if he will be LTIR’d for his last season which would be a huge help for us.

Dhaliwal and Janda suggesting he will be out until next YEAR.

 

[Fatass]

There’s some suggestion that Beagle’s injury may have him out until next year.

Really have to wonder if he will be LTIR’d for his last season which would be a huge help for us.

Dhaliwal and Janda suggesting he will be out until next YEAR.

Beagle would be on LTIR all next season too? So in other words he has a career ending injury? What happened to him?

 

[M2Beezy]

Beagle would be on LTIR all next season too? So in other words he has a career ending injury? What happened to him?

Apparently the ankle hairs under his socks got stiff and itchy

 

[Fatass]

Apparently the ankle hairs under his socks got stiff and itchy

Again, you get me

 

[Peen]

Beagle would be on LTIR all next season too? So in other words he has a career ending injury? What happened to him?

It hasn’t been reported what the injury is but the implication is he’s 100% going to be on LTIR to start the season and there’s a chance it could last a significant duration that he may just end up being on it for the whole season - but drance doesn’t think so.

 

[Izzy Goodenough]

Beagle would be on LTIR all next season too? So in other words he has a career ending injury? What happened to him?

"Hossa Disease"

Hossa Disease is highly prevalent in over-paid, underperforming hockey players over the age of 33. It has similar symptoms to Datsyukitis.