Player Discussion Jake Virtanen, Pt. XXII: 'Tis no man — 'tis a relentless redemption machine

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VancouverJagger

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I strenuously disagree; he got 4 ES points while getting less icetime than anybody on the team (other than Juolevi and Ferland) outscoring both Virts and Gaudette combined (who were put in far more favorable positions to score). He doubled the next in line in PIM (largely due to TWO 10 minute misconducts he got in consecutive games; wonder what he said?), played at 110% all the time even when the rest of the team was doing nothing and took on all comers despite the fact that he's nowhere near their weight class. I think he's worth every penny. He can play on my team anytime...
Yeah he got less ice time for a reason. I mean I like the guy and he brought energy etc but I hardly think he was effective or did much He gives the perception of looking like he’s doing a lot but IMO that’s false. We would hardly miss him and he could be easily replaced.
 

mriswith

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Oct 12, 2011
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In a playoff series a player's contract can not be a "liability"; only his play can be one. Some people, always with the contracts...
Wat

It's the same liability in the playoffs as out of the playoffs.

It prevents us from having better players on the team.

Loui's 6M warming the bench prevented us from having brought in a different 6M player to play instead of him. Just because cap hit doesn't' count in playoffs doesn't mean you can fill wasted cap with better players for the playoff run, their wasted cap still leaves holes on the roster.
 

Bankerguy

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I'd prefer Domi over Tofu. He's only 25.
I think he'd sign for 3.8-4 4 ish
Tofu will be targeting 5+

Trade JV for Domi and find a way to dump Sutter then resign Tanev.

Resign Marky for 6M if thats enough and trade Demko + beagle/baer for a 1st if possible. If Marky wants 6+ or a term greater than 5 years let him walk and run with Demko

That would be my plan.
 

Zippgunn

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Yeah he got less ice time for a reason. I mean I like the guy and he brought energy etc but I hardly think he was effective or did much He gives the perception of looking like he’s doing a lot but IMO that’s false. We would hardly miss him and he could be easily replaced.

Sure, we could lose Virts and Gaudette as well and we'd never knew they were gone either. Hell, half the team falls into that category...
 

Canucks1096

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I'd prefer Domi over Tofu. He's only 25.
I think he'd sign for 3.8-4 4 ish
Tofu will be targeting 5+

Trade JV for Domi and find a way to dump Sutter then resign Tanev.

Resign Marky for 6M if thats enough and trade Demko + beagle/baer for a 1st if possible. If Marky wants 6+ or a term greater than 5 years let him walk and run with Demko

That would be my plan.

Domi had low value a few years ago when he was with Ari, not anymore. His value is a lot higher than Virtanen.

Demko might not get a 1st alone. Definitely won't be able to add a salary dump.
 
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VancouverJagger

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I'd prefer Domi over Tofu. He's only 25.
I think he'd sign for 3.8-4 4 ish
Tofu will be targeting 5+

Trade JV for Domi and find a way to dump Sutter then resign Tanev.

Resign Marky for 6M if thats enough and trade Demko + beagle/baer for a 1st if possible. If Marky wants 6+ or a term greater than 5 years let him walk and run with Demko

That would be my plan.

We aren't trading Jake for Domi straight up.........def. an add in there - maybe a Rafferty/Lind +/or draft pick. Also doubt he signs for under 4.5.

Yeah Sutter is the guy I would love for them to get rid of - I'm hoping there is some clueless GM who still gives credence to the name "Sutter" who might take him with little retained or going back in exchange (still doubtful IMO).

Also I am not signing Markstrom and trading Demko if I am the GM - that's an easy way to save $$ right there. Let Markstrom walk and sign Khudobin to 2 years and save 2-3 mill ish that we can use towards other guys. I would probably try to keep Marky without a NMC if he's willing to sign for 5.5 and 4 or less. If not thanks and good bye.
 

Canucks1096

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We aren't trading Jake for Domi straight up.........def. an add in there - maybe a Rafferty/Lind +/or draft pick. Also doubt he signs for under 4.5.

Yeah Sutter is the guy I would love for them to get rid of - I'm hoping there is some clueless GM who still gives credence to the name "Sutter" who might take him with little retained or going back in exchange (still doubtful IMO).

Also I am not signing Markstrom and trading Demko if I am the GM - that's an easy way to save $$ right there. Let Markstrom walk and sign Khudobin to 2 years and save 2-3 mill ish that we can use towards other guys. I would probably try to keep Marky without a NMC if he's willing to sign for 5.5 and 4 or less. If not thanks and good bye.

Rafferty and Lind have very little value. Every nhl teams have those players that are in the system. When Domi was getting single digit goals in Ari. That might of been enough with Virtanen. Not no more
 
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CS95

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Yeah we'd need to add a sweetener to get rid of one of those puppies.

Personally, with a flat cap, I cant see any team taking on Myers contract unless the sweetener is over the top. Something like Podkolzin or Hoglanderand a 2nd
 

F A N

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Personally, with a flat cap, I cant see any team taking on Myers contract unless the sweetener is over the top. Something like Podkolzin or Hoglanderand a 2nd

That's just ridiculous. There's no need for that. The team could easily just retain say $800k-$1M if they are looking to get rid of Myers. Myers is overpaid but not undesirable.
 

CS95

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That's just ridiculous. There's no need for that. The team could easily just retain say $800k-$1M if they are looking to get rid of Myers. Myers is overpaid but not undesirable.

Oh I agree its ridiculous to move a high end prospect just to get rid of him, and I wouldnt make that deal myself. But there's no way Myers moves without that. Can you really find a team in the league willing to take on a #4/5 Defenseman for 4 more years of 5-5.2M when almost every team is struggling with a flat cap. Not to mention that multiple teams, including the Canucks, currently aren't sure if they will spend to the cap due to the financial problems caused by the pandemic.

In my mind, its an almost unmovable contract. Many people at the time it was signed thought it was a deal that wouldn't age well, and due to pandemic cause implications, its looking worse and worse.
 

F A N

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Oh I agree its ridiculous to move a high end prospect just to get rid of him, and I wouldnt make that deal myself. But there's no way Myers moves without that. Can you really find a team in the league willing to take on a #4/5 Defenseman for 4 more years of 5-5.2M when almost every team is struggling with a flat cap. Not to mention that multiple teams, including the Canucks, currently aren't sure if they will spend to the cap due to the financial problems caused by the pandemic.

In my mind, its an almost unmovable contract. Many people at the time it was signed thought it was a deal that wouldn't age well, and due to pandemic cause implications, its looking worse and worse.

Detroit? They literally have 3 Dmen signed. Ottawa has Zaitsev. Hainsey is a UFA and likely to retire. Having a flat cap doesn't mean that teams aren't looking for a top 4 right shot RD. Do you think Tanev won't get $5M on the UFA market because it's "flat cap?"
 

CS95

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Detroit? They literally have 3 Dmen signed. Ottawa has Zaitsev. Hainsey is a UFA and likely to retire. Having a flat cap doesn't mean that teams aren't looking for a top 4 right shot RD. Do you think Tanev won't get $5M on the UFA market because it's "flat cap?"

Why would Detroit, in the middle of a rebuild, take on 4 year bloated contract for nothing? Yzerman doesnt strike me as the kind of guy to just do Vancouver a favor. If any GMs watched Myers in the playoffs, in my opinion he didnt leave a good impression.

Teams are always looking for top 4 Dmen, but how many are looking for a 4/5 Dman that is overpaid and signed long term into his 30's?

I could see Tanev getting 5M a year on the open market, but depends on the term. Don't forget that a lot of teams arent going to be going to the cap due to Covid. That could be a huge issue in the Canucks moving out bigger contracts. I also value Tanev much, much higher than Myers.

Ottawa I dont see it. I think Melnyk is too cheap to take on a contract like Myers.

Just all my opinions, I've been wrong before and I'm sure ill be wrong again, but I dont see the Canucks moving Myers without a big add on.
 
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F A N

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Why would Detroit, in the middle of a rebuild, take on 4 year bloated contract for nothing? Yzerman doesnt strike me as the kind of guy to just do Vancouver a favor. If any GMs watched Myers in the playoffs, in my opinion he didnt leave a good impression.

See you see Myers as having negative value. I don't. So why would a team trading for Myers be doing Canucks a favour?

Teams are always looking for top 4 Dmen, but how many are looking for a 4/5 Dman that is overpaid and signed long term into his 30's?

Again. A team trading for Myers would naturally see him as a top 4 Dman. Myers is 30. He is only 34 when he starts his last year of his contract. Since we are talking about Yzerman, he signed a 37 year old Sami Salo to a 2 year contract.

Just all my opinions, I've been wrong before and I'm sure ill be wrong again, but I dont see the Canucks moving Myers without a big add on.

I think you are wrong here.
 

VancouverJagger

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Rafferty and Lind have very little value. Every nhl teams have those players that are in the system. When Domi was getting single digit goals in Ari. That might of been enough with Virtanen. Not no more

I would say Rafferty is a B level prospect who in a trade for Domi would be an add on. Something like JV, Rafferty and a 2nd would posssssssibly work. Lind I tend to agree more with your sentiments and I think Rafferty has more value. Some sort of deal that features JV as a starting point - absolutely. Him and a prospect and a pick - would probably be at least in the realm of getting Montreal to consider that seriously.
 

WetcoastOrca

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Yeah I think it will take a little more than that (a 2nd as well etc.?) but I think if you can package JV and parts for Domi absolutely that's something you have to look at.
That won’t come close to getting Domi imo. His stock may have dropped a bit but he’s still going to cost a lot.
 
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Mr. Canucklehead

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Domi had an off year, but he’s one year removed from nearly a point and game and he’s still a young, dynamic player. He’s going to carry a hefty price tag, IMO.

If we are looking for a young-ish C to try and buy low on, Alex Galchenyuk is going to be a UFA. Had a pretty disappointing season, but there’s talent in there to work with.
 

BenningHurtsMySoul

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Domi had an off year, but he’s one year removed from nearly a point and game and he’s still a young, dynamic player. He’s going to carry a hefty price tag, IMO.

If we are looking for a young-ish C to try and buy low on, Alex Galchenyuk is going to be a UFA. Had a pretty disappointing season, but there’s talent in there to work with.
Isn't he on his fourth team though? These guys are what they are by that point.
 
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VanJack

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When you break down the two teams still alive in the Western Conference, one observation springs to the forefront. These are big, fast teams with a lot of size throughout their lineups.

I wouldn't be convinced that deleting Virtanen and adding Domi would help the Canucks very much in the post-season. In fact Domi wasn't all that great in Arizona, but rejuvenated his career with the Habs who feature a lot of smaller, speedier forwards. But they never made the playoffs when he was in their lineup, and wouldn't have made it this year either if the regular season hadn't been abandoned.

The Canucks have enough speed and skill in the winger pipeline. They need d-men. So if they're going to flip Virtanen or Demko, they need the equivalent value in d-men back.
 
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