Player Discussion Jake Virtanen, Pt. XXI

[stampedingviking]

I think Virtanen is getting overrated,

Before people reply and say no he isn't. Remember what is the meaning of the word overrated.

Think you meant to type underrated there.

 

[WTG]

By the general fanbase or the very small sample on here?

Small sample size.
Most people do not watch the draft and just hear about the prospect they drafted and get excited. Then when the team is good they'll get excited and go on fan boards like Reddit/HF/CDC and get called a "bandwagon fan" and then leave.

 

[Vancouver_2010]

By the general fanbase or the very small sample on here?

general fanbase, regardless being a canucks fan or not.

 

[Zippgunn]

Yes, and it affirms how bad he is

He's driven the Kings straight into the basement...

 

[ddawg1950]

I think Virtanen is getting overrated,

Before people reply and say no he isn't. Remember what is the meaning of the word overrated.

I forget. What does it mean again?

 

[Vancouver_2010]

It’s more about people have recognized the young man’s growth over the last two seasons noticeably, and have started to embrace him as the player he is, rather than the one they expected with such a high pick. V has also done very well to win people over lately, I like how he isn’t afraid to get his nose dirty but is a lot smarter about it now than before. Getting into the faces of the other teams quality players, getting their defence off their game by hitting them hard and clean in the corners!
I don’t see V as the type of fan favourite you seem to deem the term, I see him more in the likes of a Burrows where people love him despite production, and production is more gravy on top of what he does.

I would understand this mentality if Virtanen was drafted in the second round or lower. Remember we are terrible for the whole year to get a player like him.

Imagine the Oilers being in the basement in 2009, and picked freaking yukapov. Now you get my opinion about virtVirt

 

[PetterssonSimp]

I would understand this mentality if Virtanen was drafted in the second round or lower. Remember we are terrible for the whole year to get a player like him.

Imagine the Oilers being in the basement in 2009, and picked freaking yukapov. Now you get my opinion about virtVirt

I get it, I have grown into lesser expectations for this kid. When he was drafted I was hoping for a kid who could probably score 30 goals as a power forward.
A few years in I’ve realized he’s not a power forward in any real sense. He’s like a bigger harder hitting Jannik Hansen, which is ok for me now. Raffi Torres (Edmonton draft pick) was chosen 6th overall as well. Never really carved out that power forward role, but found a role to play on a majority of teams, two went to the SCF game 7 and a WCF Game 7 all with different teams. He’s grown quite a bit, is a new era player as much as anyone else on the team, and has built at least a better hockey sense along with his game.
At this point with the tempered expectations building a 15/15 30 points annually with a couple 20/15 or even 25/15 type years I’d be quite fine with calling him a successful home grown talent. Did he ever live up to those 44 goals in his senior WHL year? Probably not but carving a useful Hansen/Torres like role on a team could see him part of some decent playoff series

 

[DonnyNucker]

I would understand this mentality if Virtanen was drafted in the second round or lower. Remember we are terrible for the whole year to get a player like him.

Imagine the Oilers being in the basement in 2009, and picked freaking yukapov. Now you get my opinion about virtVirt

So you can’t like Virtanen because he was picked too high? That’s strange dude. He is a fun player to watch. Fans enjoy watching fun players regardless of whether or not he was selected to soon. Really that simple

 

[bandwagonesque]

I would understand this mentality if Virtanen was drafted in the second round or lower. Remember we are terrible for the whole year to get a player like him.

Imagine the Oilers being in the basement in 2009, and picked freaking yukapov. Now you get my opinion about virtVirt

Virtanen was drafted 6th and appears to be developing into a top-6 winger, Yakupov was drafted 1st and isn't good enough for the NHL. So no -- I don't think that comparison helps many people get your opinion about Virtanen, except insofar as it prepares them for it to be nonsensical.

 

[PuckMunchkin]

Think you meant to type underrated there.

Ofcourse he didnt.

 

[Catamarca Livin]

I would understand this mentality if Virtanen was drafted in the second round or lower. Remember we are terrible for the whole year to get a player like him.

Imagine the Oilers being in the basement in 2009, and picked freaking yukapov. Now you get my opinion about virtVirt

We were not terrible on purpose. John T. happened and wrecked a year. Would be nice to have a better player though if he keeps improving he will be a very good fit on our team. Right now he is a bargain at 1.25 million a year.

 

[Vancouver_2010]

Virtanen was drafted 6th and appears to be developing into a top-6 winger, Yakupov was drafted 1st and isn't good enough for the NHL. So no -- I don't think that comparison helps many people get your opinion about Virtanen, except insofar as it prepares them for it to be nonsensical.

We don't know about that just yet, I would like to see him play well for a season first. There are simply too many players entering a hot streak and then disappear completely.

 

[thekernel]

I get it, I have grown into lesser expectations for this kid. When he was drafted I was hoping for a kid who could probably score 30 goals as a power forward.
A few years in I’ve realized he’s not a power forward in any real sense. He’s like a bigger harder hitting Jannik Hansen, which is ok for me now. Raffi Torres (Edmonton draft pick) was chosen 6th overall as well. Never really carved out that power forward role, but found a role to play on a majority of teams, two went to the SCF game 7 and a WCF Game 7 all with different teams. He’s grown quite a bit, is a new era player as much as anyone else on the team, and has built at least a better hockey sense along with his game.
At this point with the tempered expectations building a 15/15 30 points annually with a couple 20/15 or even 25/15 type years I’d be quite fine with calling him a successful home grown talent. Did he ever live up to those 44 goals in his senior WHL year? Probably not but carving a useful Hansen/Torres like role on a team could see him part of some decent playoff series

I like that Torres comparison, subtracting the crazy, of course.

I think there's a possibility Benning recognized the potential for something unique with Jake and opted for that instead of the better offensive talents. Home grown, can throw big hits, skate like the wind, but has a scoring touch too. Indeed, he's been quite the unique case. I think back to how emotional he was in that final Sedin game...young age aside, he was just as much a fan of those guys as we all were. I can't help but wonder if that game was a catalyst for him, for him to experience just how loud Rogers Arena can be when there's something to cheer for. These speculations sound a little fantastical but I think there's at least some truth to them.

 

[PetterssonSimp]

I like that Torres comparison, subtracting the crazy, of course.

I think there's a possibility Benning recognized the potential for something unique with Jake and opted for that instead of the better offensive talents. Home grown, can throw big hits, skate like the wind, but has a scoring touch too. Indeed, he's been quite the unique case. I think back to how emotional he was in that final Sedin game...young age aside, he was just as much a fan of those guys as we all were. I can't help but wonder if that game was a catalyst for him, for him to experience just how loud Rogers Arena can be when there's something to cheer for. These speculations sound a little fantastical but I think there's at least some truth to them.

The whole weight of the Franchise on his shoulders coming out of junior as well as being from the area that added pressure to succeed can be overwhelming.
Imho he’s building himself a nice role and is slowing adding here and there. He’s more aware with and without the puck now, he can create both on the rush and in the cycle now! He’s also not shy about getting his nose dirty in the scrums and corners.
It’s not about pairing him with the right centreman to compliment his game both ways right. I thought a quality puck retriever like V has become would be great with Petey. A sort of Burrows role to the Sedins, at least when Goldy was the guy on Petey’s wing. Now that Boeser is there, I actually wanna see more of Horvat and V working together, two bull’s on skates who just bring a constant threat of being outworked/out skated.

 

[Zarpan]

We don't know about that just yet, I would like to see him play well for a season first. There are simply too many players entering a hot streak and then disappear completely.

I think it is fair to want a longer track record of production before declaring him a top-6 winger.

I think he's getting there though. A 20 goal, 15 assist season would be pretty reasonable for a 2nd line winger.

 

[WestCoast CyberG]

I would understand this mentality if Virtanen was drafted in the second round or lower. Remember we are terrible for the whole year to get a player like him

Really wish the Virtanen critics would drop the drafting position to critique him, his drafting has zero to do with the type of player he is developing into.

Does he need to show a longer body of work and some consistency? Absolutely.

That doesn’t make him overrated, it shows what he is trending towards if he keeps it up. Pretty simple.

This team has lacked depth for many years....here we have a winger that can play up and down the lineup and we dissect him because he was drafted instead of Nylander.

Another piece of his game that gets little mention is the defensive zone breakouts...he flat out embarrassed Larson with a takeaway last night and looked damn determined doing it.

 

[Pip]

Well I mean you can be a good player and still be overrated. The most common thing I’ve seen on here and from talking to people/listening to the radio is that there seems to be an assumption that Virtanen will raise his game in the playoffs implying that he’s more valuable than his regular season numbers/play suggest. I just don’t see how that’s rooted in anything but hope, yet it’s passed off as fact by many. That’s why I think he’s getting overrated.

 

[WestCoast CyberG]

there seems to be an assumption that Virtanen will raise his game in the playoffs implying that he’s more valuable than his regular season numbers/play suggest

Virtanen is overrated because of an assumption about his possible playoff value?

2 years ago he was a bust and now that he is scoring and showing signs of being a decent player he is overrated. Go figure.

 

[Cupless44]

Virtanen is overrated because of an assumption about his possible playoff value?

2 years ago he was a bust and now that he is scoring and showing signs of being a decent player he is overrated. Go figure.

Well said.

We have posters here that have been trashing Virtanen and talking about the 2014 draft for 4 1/2 years. Now that he is progressing and playing pretty solid hockey these posters have shifted the goal posts.

Now his goals are "ugly goals" or he is now "over rated".

 

[PuckMunchkin]

Well said.

We have posters here that have been trashing Virtanen and talking about the 2014 draft for 4 1/2 years. Now that he is progressing and playing pretty solid hockey these posters have shifted the goal posts.

Now his goals are "ugly goals" or he is now "over rated".

That is not the case.

 

[DL44]

That is not the case.

he forgot to mention the early season empty net points critique..

 

[PuckMunchkin]

he forgot to mention the early season empty net points critique..

Justa a tool for you guys to use when trying to project players.

 

[CherryToke]

Virtanen haters make no f***ing sense. Even if he's not scoring, he's still very useful in a checking role. Focus your hate on the real problems with this team...

 

[bandwagonesque]

That is not the case.

I've seen it happen frequently.

 

[WestCoast CyberG]

Virtanen haters make no ****ing sense. Even if he's not scoring, he's still very useful in a checking role. Focus your hate on the real problems with this team...

My thoughts as well we have a terrible D maybe start there. The idea that JV is overrated is just ridiculous, if he somehow managed to score 20 or 25 in his rookie season and regressed there would maybe be an argument.

To your point - most of his progress has been away from the puck which makes it harder to track unless you are actually watching him. His defensive zone awareness is much better (EP effect?) and is battling in all three zones. Passing has improved too he is starting to see the ice better and use players around him more. Green had him out manning the point when Oilers were pushing late last game and JV was quite effective applying pressure on the boards and getting the puck out of the D-zone.