Player Discussion Jake DeBrusk II

Status
Not open for further replies.

Dr Hook

It’s Called Ruins
Sponsor
Mar 9, 2005
14,059
20,791
Tyler, TX
bumping this for you OMINM

Those numbers looks suspiciously like taking his GP and dividing them by goals. I ran them and they are about spot on using hockeydb as a reference. If that is the case, then that tells us nothing because he could get 6 goals in 6 games, then go 12 without scoring(and without doing anything else either) and still have an average of 3 gp per goal which doesn't tell the story.
 

BTO

HFBoards Sponsor
Sponsor
Mar 20, 2019
7,879
9,566
The Big Smoke (unfortunately)
He's fine, for a 3rd line, not a 2nd.
I remember that during DeBusk's first year I was all ready to get #73 McAvoy and #74 DeBrusk jerseys. Thought they'd make a nice pair. Only going to need a #73 now.
 

ON3M4N

Ignores/60 = Elite
Dec 13, 2015
12,966
17,903
Connecticut
No need to get defensive about it. It was an honest question based on how the thread was progressing and things that have been talked about in the past. My apologies if you were not one of those that thought he would get a legit 2nd line contract. As it happens I agree with you- a 2-3 year bridge deal is perfect because in my mind he is not what he could be and has some work to do to establish himself as a top 6 guy. As of now he has shown some of that ability, and his goals, when he scores them are welcome on a team that needs secondary scoring.

As for those that advocate moving on from him, I can see their point too because he is a floater who has played very soft this season and tends not to contribute if he isn't scoring.

But we lack secondary scoring. You want to see something that'll probably make you throw up? Since 2017 here are the Bruins top 10 goal scorers:

Pastrnak - 121
Marchand - 98
Bergeron - 93
DeBrusk - 62
Krejci - 50
Heinen - 34
Krug - 29
Backes - 22
Kurlay - 20
McAvoy - 19

That's just awful lol. Henien, the guy some fans were clamoring to trade is the Bruins 6th best goal scorer over the last 3 years. David Backes who was a cap dump is 8th and our 4th line center is 9th.

Looking at the last 2 years doesnt make it any better, in fact Wagner enters the top 10...so basically 2/3 of our 4th line are top 10 in goals for us over the last 2 years
 

member 96824

Guest
Those numbers looks suspiciously like taking his GP and dividing them by goals. I ran them and they are about spot on using hockeydb as a reference. If that is the case, then that tells us nothing because he could get 6 goals in 6 games, then go 12 without scoring(and without doing anything else either) and still have an average of 3 gp per goal which doesn't tell the story.

If you use that quoted post to go back to the old discussion there's also a couple different breakdowns of how many games were actually between goals and points, plus some comparison to other 20-25 goal scorers.

Outside of one real bad cold streak they actually surprised me too. DeBrusk is actually more consistent than it feels and his stretches are pretty common among anyone in the range he falls in for goal totals.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dr Hook

Dr Hook

It’s Called Ruins
Sponsor
Mar 9, 2005
14,059
20,791
Tyler, TX
If you use that quoted post to go back to the old discussion there's also a couple different breakdowns of how many games were actually between goals and points, plus some comparison to other 20-25 goal scorers.

Outside of one real bad cold streak they actually surprised me too. DeBrusk is actually more consistent than it feels and his stretches are pretty common among anyone in the range he falls in for goal totals.

Nice, I should have just gone back to that old thread and looked for myself. It is surprising because I agree it feels like he is really bad in that area. Because he has been a regular for the past three season, too, it is easy to forget he is just 23 and potentiallyhas development time ahead of him.
 

BBB24

Registered User
Aug 12, 2010
3,843
1,351
Saskatchewan
Honestly I'm not sure how anyone could watch him and NOT come to these conclusions. Debrusk's stick. Where plays go to die. Horrendous match with Krejci, should be playing with Coyle but we don't have enough good players to bump him down the lineup.
People see what they want
 

Mathews28

Registered User
Nov 24, 2008
5,625
3,753
Connecticut
But we lack secondary scoring. You want to see something that'll probably make you throw up? Since 2017 here are the Bruins top 10 goal scorers:

Pastrnak - 121
Marchand - 98
Bergeron - 93
DeBrusk - 62
Krejci - 50
Heinen - 34
Krug - 29
Backes - 22
Kurlay - 20
McAvoy - 19

That's just awful lol. Henien, the guy some fans were clamoring to trade is the Bruins 6th best goal scorer over the last 3 years. David Backes who was a cap dump is 8th and our 4th line center is 9th.

Looking at the last 2 years doesnt make it any better, in fact Wagner enters the top 10...so basically 2/3 of our 4th line are top 10 in goals for us over the last 2 years

Wait. The 3 yr view has 2 dmen and one 4th liner? The top 6 are arguably the 1st two lines (depending on where Heinen happened to be playing game to game season to season). Pretty much what one night expect.

If i have got this right, TB for comparison:

Kuch - 113
Stamkos - 101
Point- 98
Johnson - 64
Killorn - 59
Gourde- 57
Cirelli- 40
Hedman - 40
Palat- 36
Paquette- 20

One D in top 10, balanced with the bulk in the first 2 lines, a 4th liner in there also.

Not that different in terms of balance, but Bruins drop Off more precipitously after the first 5.

Better depth for TB, getting more out of their 2nd and 3rd liners.
 

TD Charlie

Registered User
Sep 10, 2007
36,266
16,113
He seems like a great candidate to be traded

and then torch the Bruins for 3 points a game in a third line checking role, every freaking time he plays Boston
 
  • Like
Reactions: BrainOfJ

Aussie Bruin

Registered User
Sponsor
Aug 3, 2019
9,738
21,460
Victoria, Aus
I'm okay with the team moving on from him, honestly. He just isn't any kind of answer for a second line. If they decide to keep him, it should be for 3rd line money and a 3rd line role and work on getting legit second liner (and hopeful not a legit panty :laugh:) to play in his spot.

Yep, as a 3rd line sniper who'll give you 25 goals a year he'd be completely fine. His scoring ability is 2nd-line worthy, but it's inconsistent and he just doesn't offer enough of anything else to make him a legit top-6 forward when his finish goes missing. But as long as they don't overpay him he can fill a useful middle 6 role on this team.

The problem with that assessment is that DeBrusk is a first rounder, and the B's highest forward pick in the last decade. So for him to wind up as a long-term 3rd liner who can play on the 2nd largely only because better talent isn't available is a massive, costly fail. If the Bruins were to look to cut their losses, deal him and look elsewhere for a legit top 6 winger I'd be very open to it.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Dr Hook

Absurdity

light switch connoisseur
Jul 6, 2012
10,609
6,545
I think we can all agree that DeBrusk only moves for an upgrade in the top 6.

I just don't think DeBrusk - Krejci works. Both have been productive, but little of it has to do with their play 5 on 5. I don't know if the stats back it up, but I feel like any production from these two 5 on 5 has more to do with their individual efforts, not as a line. Maybe if they had a competent linemate they would look different as a unit, but may times they are one and done in the offensive zone. There's no offensive pressure.

For the next game, I would like to see DeBrusk with Coyle. Long-term, I don't know. If they work, great, if not it also depends if the Bruins plan on keeping Krejci longer than 1 more season.
 

Aussie Bruin

Registered User
Sponsor
Aug 3, 2019
9,738
21,460
Victoria, Aus
Bruins fans...Boston gives up on ypung talent too soon look at (Smith, Wheeler, Seguin, Vatrano....)

Also Bruins fans....willing to trade a 23yr old goal scorer for having a down year where he was 33rd among LW's in goals and 47th in points.

It's not just about stats or pure ability, either current or prospective. He could have been 30th in points rather than 47th and I'd still say much the same thing - the biggest issue for me with DeBrusk is what goes on between his ears. IMO, his care factor and willingness to put in the really hard yards seem limited, his hockey IQ is only slightly above average, his willingness to put his body on the line, really battle for pucks and play a solid defense game are also limited, and he's not a guy to inspire his teammates or really want to be the one who takes initiative and leads the way. He's a bit of a coaster, and he's not someone I'd want to go to war with.

If he can improve his care factor and add some of Bergeron's constant desire to improve all aspects of his game, a dash of Coyle's strength, grit and smarts with the puck, and a dose of Marchand's more vocal leadership and wish to be the guy who goes out and makes things happens for his team and rattles the opposition, then perhaps he can yet turn into a legit, well-round top 6 forward. Otherwise I fear he's going to just end up as a fairly skilled, middle 6 JAG.
 

ON3M4N

Ignores/60 = Elite
Dec 13, 2015
12,966
17,903
Connecticut
It's not just about stats or pure ability, either current or prospective. He could have been 30th in points rather than 47th and I'd still say much the same thing - the biggest issue for me with DeBrusk is what goes on between his ears. IMO, his care factor and willingness to put in the really hard yards seem limited, his hockey IQ is only slightly above average, his willingness to put his body on the line, really battle for pucks and play a solid defense game are also limited, and he's not a guy to inspire his teammates or really want to be the one who takes initiative and leads the way. He's a bit of a coaster, and he's not someone I'd want to go to war with.

If he can improve his care factor and add some of Bergeron's constant desire to improve all aspects of his game, a dash of Coyle's strength, grit and smarts with the puck, and a dose of Marchand's more vocal leadership and wish to be the guy who goes out and makes things happens for his team and rattles the opposition, then perhaps he can yet turn into a legit, well-round top 6 forward. Otherwise I fear he's going to just end up as a fairly skilled, middle 6 JAG.

He's 23yr old and still developing. He has 4-5 years till he's in his prime. Marchand and Bergeron are elite/franchise players and at 23yr old they weren't as good as they are now. Its sounds like your looking for DeBrusk to be the perfect player, at which case you could do the same for just about everyone on the roster i.e. I wish Coyle could actually finish like Marchand. Sure it looks cool when he has a monster puck possession in the zone, but most times it leads to nothing
 

Aussie Bruin

Registered User
Sponsor
Aug 3, 2019
9,738
21,460
Victoria, Aus
He's 23yr old and still developing. He has 4-5 years till he's in his prime. Marchand and Bergeron are elite/franchise players and at 23yr old they weren't as good as they are now. Its sounds like your looking for DeBrusk to be the perfect player, at which case you could do the same for just about everyone on the roster i.e. I wish Coyle could actually finish like Marchand. Sure it looks cool when he has a monster puck possession in the zone, but most times it leads to nothing

No, you misunderstand me. It's all about attitude, character and work ethic. I don't expect DeBrusk to match Bergy's attention to detail, Coyle's puck possession or Marchy's willingness to take the game on and inspire his teammates. What I do expect is that he will want to improve in all those areas and more besides, and to put in the hard yards in doing so and wanting to emulate the achievements and abilities of his older peers as far as he can. As it stands his game is one or two dimensional and if he wants to be a genuine top 6 forward he needs a more rounded skill set.

Of course he is still young and developing - the problem is when I look at DeBrusk I do not see a guy who has the desire to maximize his potential. That's my impression from what he's done so far and the way he carries himself. I probably critique him more harshly than a guy like Bjork because I believe his ceiling is higher - he's a good player but he could be far more if the will is there. Nothing would please me more than if he proves me wrong in the next 2-3 years. He seems like a really nice kid, it's just the drive I question.
 

ON3M4N

Ignores/60 = Elite
Dec 13, 2015
12,966
17,903
Connecticut
No, you misunderstand me. It's all about attitude, character and work ethic. I don't expect DeBrusk to match Bergy's attention to detail, Coyle's puck possession or Marchy's willingness to take the game on and inspire his teammates. What I do expect is that he will want to improve in all those areas and more besides, and to put in the hard yards in doing so and wanting to emulate the achievements and abilities of his older peers as far as he can. As it stands his game is one or two dimensional and if he wants to be a genuine top 6 forward he needs a more rounded skill set.

Of course he is still young and developing - the problem is when I look at DeBrusk I do not see a guy who has the desire to maximize his potential. That's my impression from what he's done so far and the way he carries himself. I probably critique him more harshly than a guy like Bjork because I believe his ceiling is higher - he's a good player but he could be far more if the will is there. Nothing would please me more than if he proves me wrong in the next 2-3 years. He seems like a really nice kid, it's just the drive I question.

This is what I call the Krejci argument. People hammer Krejci because what they see on TV looks like he doesnt care because he doesnt show emotion. Your impression is based off the 14-16 minutes you see him play in a game. You're not in the locker room, the practices or in any situation where you truly know what's going on with a player and what their personality is like.
 

Aussie Bruin

Registered User
Sponsor
Aug 3, 2019
9,738
21,460
Victoria, Aus
This is what I call the Krejci argument. People hammer Krejci because what they see on TV looks like he doesnt care because he doesnt show emotion. Your impression is based off the 14-16 minutes you see him play in a game. You're not in the locker room, the practices or in any situation where you truly know what's going on with a player and what their personality is like.

Quite right, I'm not in the locker room. Of course it's my subjective assessment based on what I've seen of his performances and demeanor on the ice, in interviews and a little bit on social media, and what I know of his background. Funnily enough I don't view Krejci at all in that way. I think he's one of the hardest working, most professional players on the current roster. A superficial assessment of on-ice emotion tells you extraordinarily little. Look at DeBrusk - few Bruins celebrate a goal or show as much joy at a teammate scoring as he does. Great, he enjoys team success. Tells me precious little about his own work ethic or the way he's seeking to develop his own abilities.

You have to go a little deeper. The obvious thing to look at with Jake is his relationship with his father. Louie was an ok player who forged a decent career out of the skills nature gave him. He wasn't the most talented guy going around so he made up for it by having some real sauce and physicality in his game. He strikes me as a dad who is very proud that his son has followed in his footsteps, and would have encouraged him in doing so, but he also seems like a very reasonable guy who would have pushed his son but not played the role of the obsessed dad who drives his child towards perfection and endless practice.

Jake is a slightly different prospect. He's more naturally talented than his father, so while he may want to emulate his dad in having a respectable NHL career, he doesn't really have to chase his achievements or certain aspects of his style. Once he's made it and is comfortably ensconced in the NHL mix, he's met that base goal that is part of his inheritance. Everyone who makes the NHL has to have worked hard and have a high level of ambition. But because of his natural ability and his parentage, DeBrusk probably hasn't had to exert himself quite as much as many in the rarefied atmosphere of top level pro-sports. Couple all this with what appears to be a fairly calm, relaxed, not overly intellectual personality, and he strikes me as a guy who has just a slight sense of entitlement and contentedness. Not in a narcissistic or arrogant manner, just in a sense that he takes his career slightly for granted and is not burning with ambition to become the absolute greatest player he can possibly be. He's nowhere near lazy or without a desire to be better, but through a combination of his upbringing and personality, I don't think he has the drive to find that extra 5% of ability that only comes with 50% more work that separates good from great.

That's my read on him. I don't claim it to be obviously correct - it may be close to the mark or miles wide. If others see him differently I have no problem with that whatsoever. Only time will tell.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->