Jake Allen

[BrokenFace]

If you look at the goals scored against the Blues this year, a lot of them would go in no matter who was between the pipes. Allen isn't a dependable NHL starter, but the scape goating is ridiculous.

If Allen lets in a soft goal then fans will excuse the rest of the team not scoring because the soft goal was so disheartening that it affected the offense. Yet if the offense only puts up 10 shots over 2 periods before Allen lets in a softie, no one gives him a break by saying the pathetic offense was so disheartening that the softie is understandable.

The Blues have a good goalie prospect in Husso, but I don't want him anywhere near this team while it's playing like this. I want his first NHL experience to be with an NHL caliber defense.

 

[Tryblot]

Okay, and go back to the game in Chicago when he had 46 saves and earned the team a point. I am hardly a fan of Allen, but the problems are much deeper than him. Right now the team defense is just plain bad.

Even with that 46 save performance he still has a .877 SV% and 3.91 GAA. That's terrible for a starter.

 

[Tryblot]

If you look at the goals scored against the Blues this year, a lot of them would go in no matter who was between the pipes. Allen isn't a dependable NHL starter, but the scape goating is ridiculous.

If Allen lets in a soft goal then fans will excuse the rest of the team not scoring because the soft goal was so disheartening that it affected the offense. Yet if the offense only puts up 10 shots over 2 periods before Allen lets in a softie, no one gives him a break by saying the pathetic offense was so disheartening that the softie is understandable.

The Blues have a good goalie prospect in Husso, but I don't want him anywhere near this team while it's playing like this. I want his first NHL experience to be with an NHL caliber defense.

That just isn't true.

 

[BrokenFace]

at the end of the day, whoever the other goalie is for the blues, the team plays better in front of them, the goalie plays better than allen and the team wins more games

and thats all i need to know

That means the team is a problem too

 

[BrokenFace]

That just isn't true.

4 of the 5 goals in game 1 and 2 of 3 last night weren't on the goalie imo. I know that isn't the whole season, but those are 2 games off the top of my head where Allen was let down by the team in front of him.

People forget that Hutton had terrible numbers for a long stretch last year too. I don't think much of Allen, but the defense in front of him has been just as inconsistent and at times amateurish as he has over the last year. That's why Hutton had terrible numbers for a stretch last year too, because the defense just switches off too much

 

[EurlichBachman]

Even with that 46 save performance he still has a .877 SV% and 3.91 GAA. That's terrible for a starter.

I am not going to say he has been great by any stretch, but he is far from the biggest issue. If the team is playing better he isn't seeing as many high quality shots and therefore his numbers would be better. I wish Allen was the problem right now, but hes not.

 

[MasterDecoy]

All of hf complains when goaltenders are "overpaid". Truth is, you can point at a bunch of very good teams that had their cup hopes sank because of poor goaltending (figure who they are)

As much as we don't want to admit, a solid, reliable goaltender is as rare - if not more - than a 1c and they should be paid, appreciated, and looked up to as they deserve.

Tl;dr: the blues' failure to find a proper #1 goaltender is/has cost them a chance to win the cup. And a few other teams too

 

[Connor McConnor]

After the first 2 games of the year he hasn't been the problem. The team is playing pathetic infront of him. That being said, he shouldnt be getting a raise from 4.5m a year that's for sure. Guy is a fringe starter at best who can get hot. We've seen that his best utilization is with split starts. Maybe they can get Husso some action later in the year.

 

[Evocable Manager]

He's garbage.

But the overlapping issue is the coaching/strategy implementation. We could have Holtby and it wouldn't make much difference with how pathetic the team is playing. Don't even get me started on the preceding issues, because it's one hell of a list.

 

[Ace Card Bedard]

Even with that 46 save performance he still has a .877 SV% and 3.91 GAA. That's terrible for a starter.

Cam Ward has a .879 SV% and 4.06GAA lol

 

[Critical13]

I think we’ve overrated the team in front of him

 

[MtlBoxFan]

Good goalies don't grow on trees. St Louis needs to adapt and play better in front of the goalie they have, who is average. The goals against average does not take into account the quality of the chances being given up.

 

[BrokenFace]

All of hf complains when goaltenders are "overpaid". Truth is, you can point at a bunch of very good teams that had their cup hopes sank because of poor goaltending (figure who they are)

As much as we don't want to admit, a solid, reliable goaltender is as rare - if not more - than a 1c and they should be paid, appreciated, and looked up to as they deserve.

Tl;dr: the blues' failure to find a proper #1 goaltender is/has cost them a chance to win the cup. And a few other teams too

I cannot think of a playoff series the Blues lost in which the goalie play was a bigger issue than the offense drying up

 

[Tryblot]

I cannot think of a playoff series the Blues lost in which the goalie play was a bigger issue than the offense drying up

Do you understand what the term 'timely saves' means? And how that can alter the course of a game dramatically with momentum swings? If not, I suggest you look at games 5 and 6 in the 2015 series with the Wild.

 

[Dr Pepper]

Do you understand what the term 'timely saves' means? And how that can alter the course of a game dramatically with momentum swings? If not, I suggest you look at games 5 and 6 in the 2015 series with the Wild.

This is exactly why Kari Lehtonen is still looking for work.

Or happily retired, but either way, out of the NHL.

He had so many late-game collapses over the years, very un-clutch between the pipes for Dallas. Wasn't surprised when they opted to land Bishop to replace him.

 

[Note Worthy]

Allen is not the problem right now but he is a problem.

 

[SC2GM]

The guy flat out doesn't make saves. He's been in the league for 6 years, and you can count his impressive/wow moments with two instances: 1) Save against the Flames years ago. 2) 1 playoff series, years ago. I haven't seen a goalie that inspires less confidence in my life. I have also never seen a player with a worse attitude. If anyone is blackmailing anyone, it's this guy.

To put into perspective just how "undominate" this guy is... spanning this season and the last, Allen has started 61 games and has only recorded 1 shutout, total. We give up fewer than 30 shots per game, every season. He's basically achieved "manikin status." Put a manakin in there, instead, and it's going to save about as many shots and have a higher chance of shutting out a team. It's so sad to even have to talk about Allen. It's like talking about the towel boy in a conversation about the "top centers in the league." How does this guy come up? With all of the money Allen is stealing, don't be surprised if paranoia gets to him and he just goes on the run from the cops...

 

[ChuckLefley]

other than last night, he has been. same with last season.

if hutton starts 5 more games last year, we make the playoffs no problem

Hutton was on a downhill slide, if he had started five more games it would have done nothing.

 

[Canada Drai]

Not sure why people have faith in Canadian goaltenders. Most young Canadian "tendies" are sieves.

It's a crisis.

 

[BrokenFace]

Do you understand what the term 'timely saves' means? And how that can alter the course of a game dramatically with momentum swings? If not, I suggest you look at games 5 and 6 in the 2015 series with the Wild.

Untimely goals still only count as 1, same as any other goal, and are not an excuse for an offense to run out of ideas and effort. Every Stanley cup finalist had to overcome bad goals. The Caps just won a cup without Holtby starting at the start of the playoffs. The Blackhawks and Penguins have made deep runs despite bad series from good starters multiple times.

It's a 2 way street. If you blame the goalie for giving up untimely goals, then you have to blame the skaters in front of him when they consistently fail to score timely goals themselves. The Blues have rarely had a playoff series in which the offense was good enough to lift an underperforming starter, but we see that teams who make deep playoff runs routinely have to step up when their goalie faulters. I'm fine with moving on from Allen, but I'm still criticizing the offense because even elite goalies need more support than what the Blues offense delivers in the playoffs. That's been a problem for longer than Allen has been in the NHL

 

[Tryblot]

Untimely goals still only count as 1, same as any other goal, and are not an excuse for an offense to run out of ideas and effort. Every Stanley cup finalist had to overcome bad goals. The Caps just won a cup without Holtby starting at the start of the playoffs. The Blackhawks and Penguins have made deep runs despite bad series from good starters multiple times.

It's a 2 way street. If you blame the goalie for giving up untimely goals, then you have to blame the skaters in front of him when they consistently fail to score timely goals themselves. The Blues have rarely had a playoff series in which the offense was good enough to lift an underperforming starter, but we see that teams who make deep playoff runs routinely have to step up when their goalie faulters. I'm fine with moving on from Allen, but I'm still criticizing the offense because even elite goalies need more support than what the Blues offense delivers in the playoffs. That's been a problem for longer than Allen has been in the NHL

Untimely goals still count as one but they are completely different than any other goal. Let's look at game 5 in 2015. In game 4, the Blues just smoked the Wild 6-1 and Hitch in the press conference after the game said they had figured the Wild out. The game started and the Blues had outshot the Wild something like 8-0 to start the game. The Blues had a 1-0 lead and were completely dominating the game. The Wild defense takes a slapshot entering the zone while most of his team is changing and it somehow goes in. That goal completely changed the momentum in the game. It gave the Wild bench a bunch of momentum, it gave Dubnyk momentum and it took a lot away from the Blues skaters. On the score sheet it's one goal, but you can't look at the game on a scoresheet and understand the dynamics of a particular game. That goal changed the series because had it not gone in, I believe the Blues would have won that series.

I don't get where you're coming from when you say the Blues don't score timely goals. When they beat the Hawks in 2016 they scored timely goals, when they beat the Stars that same year they did as well. The difference in these series is that they didn't have Allen letting in back breaking goals because Elliott was in the net.

 

[BrokenFace]

Untimely goals still count as one but they are completely different than any other goal. Let's look at game 5 in 2015. In game 4, the Blues just smoked the Wild 6-1 and Hitch in the press conference after the game said they had figured the Wild out. The game started and the Blues had outshot the Wild something like 8-0 to start the game. The Blues had a 1-0 lead and were completely dominating the game. The Wild defense takes a slapshot entering the zone while most of his team is changing and it somehow goes in. That goal completely changed the momentum in the game. It gave the Wild bench a bunch of momentum, it gave Dubnyk momentum and it took a lot away from the Blues skaters. On the score sheet it's one goal, but you can't look at the game on a scoresheet and understand the dynamics of a particular game. That goal changed the series because had it not gone in, I believe the Blues would have won that series.

I don't get where you're coming from when you say the Blues don't score timely goals. When they beat the Hawks in 2016 they scored timely goals, when they beat the Stars that same year they did as well. The difference in these series is that they didn't have Allen letting in back breaking goals because Elliott was in the net.

Even in game 5 though, the Blues only scored 1 goal total. Allen was poor, but so was the offense. If the team really had "figured the wild out", they would have scored more. If you can't handle and respond to "momentum change" as a player, you don't deserve to make a deep playoff run.

And of course the Blues have scored timely goals in the playoffs before, but it's not nearly enough. Just like Allen has made many timely saves (the 2017 series with the Wild alone had plenty), yet he didn't show up consistently enough. To be clear I think you're right about Allen, I just don't like people forgetting about the more constant problems with the offense to blame the relatively new problem that is Allen

 

[HighNote]

Allen has been pretty decent this year so far. It's the team defense I'm worried about. Just about every defenseman that has started a game this year has made at least 1 huge mistake that has led to an easy goal. Pietrangelo has made several mistakes leading to probably 2-3 goals, Parayko screwed up big time in the last 10 seconds of last night's game, Bouwmeester has probably been our worst defenseman so far, Dunn has made 2 big turnovers which both led to goals (one led to an OT goal). Edmundson and Schmaltz have been the bright spots on the back end, and they've both missed 2 games. Those mistakes are on those players, but you also have to look to coaching. The defensive scheme being employed by our coaches just hasn't worked. I'm surprised Allen has done as well as he has to be honest, and I'm one of the first to say he's not the guy for STL.

 

[airbus220]

Allen is not the problem right now but he is a problem.

I would trade for Allen, but Blues should admit that his contract is bad and they have to keep 50% of his salary for their signing mistake based on expectations.
I should get an additional pick because goalies are easy to get and Allen is signed till summer 2021. If Blues don't want I would sign Lehtonen atm.

I guess Blues would keep Allen.

 

[Got One Cup]

I doesn’t matter who we have in net right now. Our team defense and systems are a joke. The only reliable defensemen is Eddy, the rest have lost their minds. If things don’t start changing soon Yeo will be the 1st coach fired this year.