Is YouTube Done? (MOD Warning - See post #193)

SecretOilersFan

Registered User
Jul 2, 2015
628
237
Calgary
Youtube continues to enable stars like PewDiePie who went on another racial rant recently :laugh:

Not a fan of his and heard about what he said but while its a dumb thing he did, it was hardly a racial rant. Not a fan of his but the blow up over a nazi joke and this is just stupid. Hollywood and most of the entertainment industry have people that have done much worse things. Pewds said the N word when playing a video game raging and made a harmless nazi joke. The guy isn't a racist and has done a lot of charity work when it comes to donations. May not find him funny but he is doing more to better than world than you or me so thinking that Youtube should cut their most subscribed channel would not be a smart thing to do.
 

HanSolo

DJ Crazy Times
Apr 7, 2008
96,405
30,656
Las Vegas
Insensitive maybe but I'd like to see a single racial rant from him. Not even that I'm a fan but call it what it is.
 

ArGarBarGar

What do we want!? Unfair!
Sep 8, 2008
44,017
11,677
Was not a racial rant, but I find it telling that a guy who has made racially insensitive "jokes" instinctively yelled the N word at someone without thinking.

Guy is at best a manchild who doesn't think about the words he says. At worst he is a closet racist starting to show his true colors one little misstep at a time.
 

Shareefruck

Registered User
Apr 2, 2005
28,875
3,570
Vancouver, BC
Edit: Just mulling over the video.... I think this one's more egregious than the Bill Maher one, personally. I thought the latter was totally harmless, to the extent that I'm not even sure I would hope that he never do it again. I thought the Pewdiepie Nazi thing was just absolutely nothing stupidly blown out of proportion

The way he said it in this one is pretty hard to excuse, IMO. Even if he didn't intend it, he said it in about as bad of a way as you could have. The fact that he said it in such a matter of fact way somehow makes it worse.

On the other hand, I buy that it wasn't intentional or racism-driven based on the way he instinctively reacted to saying it, personally. That natural chuckle at the end was clearly a "that came out wrong" chuckle rather than a "uh-oh they got me" chuckle, and it didn't seem like a fake desperation thing to me.
 
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kingsboy11

Maestro
Dec 14, 2011
11,513
8,023
USA
I don't care for PewDiePie. Hardly ever watched his videos, but I do know how popular he is. I thought his controversy several months ago was blown way out of proportion and didn't think much of it. But with hearing about his recent problems I'm starting think less of him. When you have as big of an audience as he does reaching out to well over 50 million people, you damn well better watch out with what you say.
 

XX

Waiting for Ishbia
Dec 10, 2002
54,886
14,502
PHX
Insensitive maybe but I'd like to see a single racial rant from him. Not even that I'm a fan but call it what it is.

Casual racism is okay, so long as it's not a Michael Richards style rant? What the hell?

This ****stick is going to end the ad revenue party for everybody.

There's no defending this.

Not a fan of his and heard about what he said but while its a dumb thing he did, it was hardly a racial rant. Not a fan of his but the blow up over a nazi joke and this is just stupid. Hollywood and most of the entertainment industry have people that have done much worse things. Pewds said the N word when playing a video game raging and made a harmless nazi joke. The guy isn't a racist and has done a lot of charity work when it comes to donations. May not find him funny but he is doing more to better than world than you or me so thinking that Youtube should cut their most subscribed channel would not be a smart thing to do.

They should delete his channel right now. The adpocalypse has already cut deep and this isn't going to help.
 

ArGarBarGar

What do we want!? Unfair!
Sep 8, 2008
44,017
11,677
PewdiePie is the flagship of the site. The more gaffes he has the less ad revenue the site is going to generate.
 
Sep 19, 2008
372,047
23,922
Casual racism is okay, so long as it's not a Michael Richards style rant? What the hell?

This ****stick is going to end the ad revenue party for everybody.

There's no defending this.



They should delete his channel right now. The adpocalypse has already cut deep and this isn't going to help.

Absolutely agree, there's a convincing argument that because he is the major streamer on Youtube that sponsors pulling out affects all streamers, not just him. It's about him being racist but also his racist remarks (joking or not) seriously put other streamers in peril. Totally selfish actions.
 
Sep 19, 2008
372,047
23,922
Also to address the question in the original post I don't think Youtube faces a "death" if they cut ad revenue to PewDiePie. People are still going to go to watch mindless crap, i.e. me going there to laugh at First Take and other such stuff.

The video game streaming industry though? On Youtube? That might face a death. But all those guys will just go somewhere else. PewdiePie is a big name. If youtube limits his ad revenue and he can't make as much he'll probably go somewhere else, like Twitch, or make his own streaming network and find people who support him, give him money (he's basically an "idol" to so many anyway), etc.

This topic has come up time and time again with creators and copyrights and ads and Youtube always finds a way to survive.
 

HanSolo

DJ Crazy Times
Apr 7, 2008
96,405
30,656
Las Vegas
Casual racism is okay, so long as it's not a Michael Richards style rant? What the hell?

This ****stick is going to end the ad revenue party for everybody.

There's no defending this.



They should delete his channel right now. The adpocalypse has already cut deep and this isn't going to help.

Point to me where I said saying the n word or any form of racism is acceptable. I'll wait. I'm just saying there's a difference between casually saying something clearly not okay and going on a racial tirade like Kramer. They're both clearly wrong but which action showed more malice and venomous speech? I'm all for holding people accountable for their actions but I'm not for overstating a wrong someone has committed in the name of making sure people find the offender despicable. G F O P is right to be upset with Pewdiepie. But this isn't the first time he has accused him of going on racial "rants." Paying someone to say something racist for cheap laughs isn't the same thing as standing on a soapbox with white supremacy groups. But if you accuse a guy of constantly going on racial "rants" that's the impression a casual observer comes to.

It's a mis-characterization. If someone stuck up a 7-11 you wouldn't also charge him for arson unless he actually set the 7-11 on fire in the commission of his crime.

I'm not defending Pewdiepie. It's a stupid thing to say and a word he shouldn't be using. But by the same token it's not like he used his platform to actively promote anti-black rhetoric or hate speech. He let a racial slur slip possibly exposing that he may just be racist but he didn't engage in active and intentional racism.
 
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Sep 19, 2008
372,047
23,922
Point to me where I said saying the n word or any form of racism is acceptable. I'll wait. I'm just saying there's a difference between casually saying something clearly not okay and going on a racial tirade like Kramer. They're both clearly wrong but which action showed more malice and venomous speech? I'm all for holding people accountable for their actions but I'm not for overstating a wrong someone has committed in the name of making sure people find the offender despicable. G F O P is right to be upset with Pewdiepie. But this isn't the first time he has accused him of going on racial "rants." Paying someone to say something racist for cheap laughs isn't the same thing as standing on a soapbox with white supremacy groups. But if you accuse a guy of constantly going on racial "rants" that's the impression a casual observer comes to.

It's a mis-characterization. If someone stuck up a 7-11 you wouldn't also charge him for arson unless he actually set the 7-11 on fire in the commission of his crime.

I'm not defending Pewdiepie. It's a stupid thing to say and a word he shouldn't be using. But by the same token it's not like he used his platform to actively promote anti-black rhetoric or hate speech. He let a racial slur slip possibly exposing that he may just be racist but he didn't engage in active and intentional racism.

It wasn't a rant but you KNOW he has a long history of doing **** like this and the last time he pulled this stunt he cost a lot of people ad revenue. If companies continue to threaten ad revenue because of PewDiePie's actions, and he doesn't care, that makes him a selfish ass. Like it or not, his actions will affect the entire Youtube streaming community as a whole, due to his significant stature. And that is where I agree with XX. That's why the community is telling him to knock it off. Because their dollars and their potential monetary lives are at stake.
 

Shareefruck

Registered User
Apr 2, 2005
28,875
3,570
Vancouver, BC
If you don't like what he says, don't watch his content. Simple as that.
People always say this and I've always found it stupid. Yes, if you don't like something, you can choose not to watch it. But that says nothing about why you necessarily shouldn't watch it, or shouldn't criticize it, or shouldn't have an opinion on the content. Unless the complaint is "Why do I have to be forced to watch this crap?" (which it never is), it's a meaningless statement in response to what's being said.
 

XX

Waiting for Ishbia
Dec 10, 2002
54,886
14,502
PHX
Paying someone to say something racist for cheap laughs isn't the same thing as standing on a soapbox with white supremacy groups. But if you accuse a guy of constantly going on racial "rants" that's the impression a casual observer comes to.

They're cut from the same cloth and perpetuate the same cycle. "Why won't someone think of the poor racists?" is a pretty interesting angle to take but I'm not sure why you are really bothering, unless you yourself want to be able to indulge in casual racism free of consequence.

I'm not defending Pewdiepie. It's a stupid thing to say and a word he shouldn't be using. But by the same token it's not like he used his platform to actively promote anti-black rhetoric or hate speech. He let a racial slur slip possibly exposing that he may just be racist but he didn't engage in active and intentional racism.

Yo, what the ****? Dropping casual racism like he did is absolutely promoting anti-black rhetoric and hate speech. He absolutely used it in a pejorative, spiteful way. Just because a guy isn't out burning crosses doesn't mean he's not a major problem.

If you don't like what he says, don't watch his content. Simple as that.

His reach is vast and the **** he says impacts the kids that are watching him. It's not that simple. "Don't watch it if you don't like it" is a mindless deflection and a really poor one at that. You can't have 57 million subscribers and pretend like you're not a public figure. That's not how it works. Pretending like racism and sexism don't exist unless you subscribe to the channel is basically telling people to mind their own business and not be uppity. This garbage also has no place in the business world and advertisers don't want to be associated with it, which is why Disney terminated his contract. If nothing else, money talks. This can't and won't go on forever.
 

HanSolo

DJ Crazy Times
Apr 7, 2008
96,405
30,656
Las Vegas
It wasn't a rant but you KNOW he has a long history of doing **** like this and the last time he pulled this stunt he cost a lot of people ad revenue. If companies continue to threaten ad revenue because of PewDiePie's actions, and he doesn't care, that makes him a selfish ass. Like it or not, his actions will affect the entire Youtube streaming community as a whole, due to his significant stature. And that is where I agree with XX. That's why the community is telling him to knock it off. Because their dollars and their potential monetary lives are at stake.

I'm not disagreeing with you man, but not that many people follow the youtube community carefully. When you mischaracterize someone by saying they are a purveyor of "racist rants" it's a far cry from being insensitive. There's a difference between manslaughter and murder for a reason. To have murder you need intent and malice aforethought. To be a purveyor of hate speech and racist rants is to have the intent and carry out on that intent to use hateful language to harm other races. No question the big kid on YouTube is being racially insensitive these days. But there's a distinct difference between characterizing someone was racially insensitive and intentionally and racially incendiary.

Yes what he's doing is a bad look for his platform and it harms the community and he should absolutely be behaving himself even if he is indeed racist. But it's a slippery slope from the proper characterization of saying he's racially insensitive and accusing things that he's not doing so that the casual observer may be misled that the top channel on YouTube is a white supremacy outlet. He's an idiot making bad jokes and not watching his mouth. There's a difference.
 

Hammettf2b

oldmanyellsatcloud.jpg
Jul 9, 2012
22,489
4,610
So California
People always say this and I've always found it stupid. Yes, if you don't like something, you can choose not to watch it. But that says nothing about why you necessarily shouldn't watch it, or shouldn't criticize it, or shouldn't have an opinion on the content. Unless the complaint is "Why do I have to be forced to watch this crap?" (which it never is), it's a meaningless statement in response to what's being said.

Who are you to tell someone that his content should or shouldn't be watched?
 

HanSolo

DJ Crazy Times
Apr 7, 2008
96,405
30,656
Las Vegas
Yo, what the ****? Dropping casual racism like he did is absolutely promoting anti-black rhetoric and hate speech. He absolutely used it in a pejorative, spiteful way. Just because a guy isn't out burning crosses doesn't mean he's not a major problem.

That's a very liberal use of the term "promoting". Enabling is more accurate. I see it more as not conforming to changing social standards. Which isn't okay but promoting? The act of promoting something...anything is an intentional act that requires effort. The guy raged while playing a shooter and dropped a racial slur and even tried to cover his own ass. The act of promoting anything isn't a passive act. Negligence does not equal promotion. Pewdiepie didn't end his stream by addressing the fact that he said the n-word by actively disparaging black people. Now he could enable racists by hearing him say that word and think "oh Pewdiepie says it, it must be okay" but that's not the same thing as promotion.

Past that, I'm not even gonna gratify your accusation that I'm in favor of the use of casual racism and that I'm pro racists with any response beyond the fact that I already said what he did was wrong. Nice try though.
 

Shareefruck

Registered User
Apr 2, 2005
28,875
3,570
Vancouver, BC
Who are you to tell someone that his content should or shouldn't be watched?
Reading comprehension, man. That's exactly what I'm saying to you.

I'm specifically saying that your argument does not give a reason for why anyone should or shouldn't watch it (in your case, you're implying if they don't like it, then they shouldn't watch it or complain about it). I myself am not saying that you should or shouldn't watch it or comment on it. I'm saying both are fair game and that "if you don't like it don't watch it" gives no reason to lean on one side any more than the other.
 

Hammettf2b

oldmanyellsatcloud.jpg
Jul 9, 2012
22,489
4,610
So California
They're cut from the same cloth and perpetuate the same cycle. "Why won't someone think of the poor racists?" is a pretty interesting angle to take but I'm not sure why you are really bothering, unless you yourself want to be able to indulge in casual racism free of consequence.



Yo, what the ****? Dropping casual racism like he did is absolutely promoting anti-black rhetoric and hate speech. He absolutely used it in a pejorative, spiteful way. Just because a guy isn't out burning crosses doesn't mean he's not a major problem.



His reach is vast and the **** he says impacts the kids that are watching him. It's not that simple. "Don't watch it if you don't like it" is a mindless deflection and a really poor one at that. You can't have 57 million subscribers and pretend like you're not a public figure. That's not how it works. Pretending like racism and sexism don't exist unless you subscribe to the channel is basically telling people to mind their own business and not be uppity. This garbage also has no place in the business world and advertisers don't want to be associated with it, which is why Disney terminated his contract. If nothing else, money talks. This can't and won't go on forever.

If parents are so worried what is being said to their children on the internet then maybe they should do something about it. I don't like the word as much as the next person. You know what I do? I don't associate with ppl that use it as a hateful meaning. I can't expect everyone to live by my set of standards. If I don't like something, I do something about it.
 
Sep 19, 2008
372,047
23,922
I'm not disagreeing with you man, but not that many people follow the youtube community carefully. When you mischaracterize someone by saying they are a purveyor of "racist rants" it's a far cry from being insensitive. There's a difference between manslaughter and murder for a reason. To have murder you need intent and malice aforethought. To be a purveyor of hate speech and racist rants is to have the intent and carry out on that intent to use hateful language to harm other races. No question the big kid on YouTube is being racially insensitive these days. But there's a distinct difference between characterizing someone was racially insensitive and intentionally and racially incendiary.

Yes what he's doing is a bad look for his platform and it harms the community and he should absolutely be behaving himself even if he is indeed racist. But it's a slippery slope from the proper characterization of saying he's racially insensitive and accusing things that he's not doing so that the casual observer may be misled that the top channel on YouTube is a white supremacy outlet. He's an idiot making bad jokes and not watching his mouth. There's a difference.

I openly admit to mischaracterizing his comment as a "racial rant", but I have done significant reading and research since, and I remain convinced that he doesn't necessarily advocate for racial organizations. I mean, most of the gaming community is wont to throw around terms and insults which are very inappropriate and it doesn't make them an ardent practicer of any type of hate organization.

What I've realized is that his racial commentary, light spirited or not, is hurting other people. If you're doing something offensive and other people start getting affected, that's when you as a man need to take responsibility for your actions and tone it down. I'm well versed in the gaming community and I've seen so many people just drop racial slurs like it was nothing just to "sound cool". No one is saying that his channel is a white supremacy outlet. They're saying that advertisers don't necessarily like to be associated with any type of controversy. PewDiePie is affecting Youtube streamers. I personally admit to not liking him and I tolerate him by "ignoring" him (as Hammet said), however when his actions affect other streamers that's when I have to draw a line and tell him to watch himself. His actions are insensitive, but what's more important is that his insensitivity and frank, colorful dialogue are affecting ad revenue, which is a major cog in the online streaming community.
 

XX

Waiting for Ishbia
Dec 10, 2002
54,886
14,502
PHX
I'm not even gonna gratify your accusation that I'm in favor of the use of casual racism with any response beyond the fact that I already said what he did was wrong.

If you know it's wrong then why are you going to such great lengths for this garbage? Why the desperation to label it diet racism? This casual racism that people slip in and out of is actually more dangerous than overt racism because these sorts of people approve your loans, look at your resume, and police your streets. This sort of nonsense chips away at society, especially when it comes from a guy who has a massive audience of kids. It perpetuates the cycle and you know it. He wanted a hateful word to call another person and that's the word he went for. There's no middle ground here or honest mistake. This isn't his first slip up either. He is a racist person.

Take a gander at twitter or YT comments to see how many people - many of them teenagers - are lining up to defend PDP and tell me he doesn't promote certain viewpoints. If nothing of consequence happens to him you think nobody is going to notice? Where do you think systemic racism gestates?

If parents are so worried what is being said to their children on the internet then maybe they should do something about it. I don't like the word as much as the next person. You know what I do? I don't associate with ppl that use it as a hateful meaning. I can't expect everyone to live by my set of standards. If I don't like something, I do something about it.

Talking about it - in this case criticizing YT for their inaction and allowing this on their platform - is doing something about it. You just want people to be quiet and go away. Stop talking about the racist!
 

Hammettf2b

oldmanyellsatcloud.jpg
Jul 9, 2012
22,489
4,610
So California
Reading comprehension, man. That's exactly what I'm saying to you.

I'm specifically saying that your argument does not give a reason for why anyone should or shouldn't watch it (in your case, you're implying if they don't like it, then they shouldn't watch it or complain about it). I myself am not saying that you should or shouldn't watch it or comment on it. I'm saying both are fair game.

Both are fair game is correct, so the ppl will decide if he stays relevant or not. No need to get up in arms about it. (not saying you did, just in general) I get that there is a discussion about it and what not, but I don't see why some are so upset about it.
 

HanSolo

DJ Crazy Times
Apr 7, 2008
96,405
30,656
Las Vegas
I openly admit to mischaracterizing his comment as a "racial rant", but I have done significant reading and research since, and I remain convinced that he doesn't necessarily advocate for racial organizations. I mean, most of the gaming community is wont to throw around terms and insults which are very inappropriate and it doesn't make them an ardent practicer of any type of hate organization.

What I've realized is that his racial commentary, light spirited or not, is hurting other people. If you're doing something offensive and other people start getting affected, that's when you as a man need to take responsibility for your actions and tone it down. I'm well versed in the gaming community and I've seen so many people just drop racial slurs like it was nothing just to "sound cool". No one is saying that his channel is a white supremacy outlet. They're saying that advertisers don't necessarily like to be associated with any type of controversy. PewDiePie is affecting Youtube streamers. I personally admit to not liking him and I tolerate him by "ignoring" him (as Hammet said), however when his actions affect other streamers that's when I have to draw a line and tell him to watch himself. His actions are insensitive, but what's more important is that his insensitivity and frank, colorful dialogue are affecting ad revenue, which is a major cog in the online streaming community.


I agree. It's a bad look. And yes, gaming trash talk in general is even more cancerous than this. But when you have streamers who are the most popular purveyors of competitive gaming getting into this kind of speech it does hurt the community at large. I don't disagree there. What Pewdiepie did was wrong and unfortunate to his community and he should be held responsible. But the situation shouldn't be overstated and that's the only reason I cut against you. He and any other big streamers need to be accountable for their actions and not harm the community. In traditional media you could just fire a news anchor and the platform would carry on. Youtube and Twitch are more fragile so I agree for sure.
 

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