Is this the worst era of all time for the Canucks?

Is this the worst era of all time for the Canucks?

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  • No (post what you think is worse)


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MS

1%er
Mar 18, 2002
53,367
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Vancouver, BC
By a mile.

The worst points of the Keenan era might have been worse than this but that while period from the Messier signing to the Burke hiring lasted less than 2 years.

Even the dark period of the 1980s was really only 3 years from 1984-87.

This is on year 6 and counting.
 

y2kcanucks

Le Sex God
Aug 3, 2006
71,229
10,319
Surrey, BC
Yes, and it's not even close. This is the most hopeless I've ever felt as a Canucks fan due to the incompetence at the top of the organization. Stupidity seems to be acceptable. Fans who don't understand how the draft works praise a guy who drafted good players at the top of the draft because they don't understand that this should be the expectation, and not something special or something to be celebrated. Those same fans also don't understand the difference between a rebuild and a bad team. This has led to minimal pushback in the fan base over how the team has done things.

The Canucks organization is rotting from the inside out. At this point it's going to have to get so much uglier before it gets better. By that, I mean missing the playoffs the next two years, winning the draft lottery in 2021 with Tampa having our pick, and Pettersson holding out/signing elsewhere.
 

Pastor Of Muppetz

Registered User
Oct 1, 2017
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Based on what?....results from a team that has bottomed out (after spending a long run going from the WCE era, straight into the Sedin era)..Eventually,you have to start from almost scratch again....If your expectations were a playoff team, and a revamped young core after 2-3 years.. thats just not realistic.

There's been several dark era's in this team where the buildings been half empty over 50 years...and I'm sure that over the next 50 years there will be more up and down cycles.
 

y2kcanucks

Le Sex God
Aug 3, 2006
71,229
10,319
Surrey, BC
Based on what?....results from a team that has bottomed out (after spending a long run going from the WCE era, straight into the Sedin era)..Eventually,you have to start from almost scratch again....If your expectations were a playoff team, and a revamped young core after 2-3 years.. thats just not realistic.

There's been several dark era's in this team where the buildings been half empty over 50 years...and I'm sure that over the next 50 years there will be more up and down cycles.

The GM tried pushing for the playoffs every year.

While we all agree that this team needed to rebuild, that's not what the GM did. The GM pushed for the playoffs every year, and the team bottomed out because of his incompetence. He brought in a ton of bad players. Guys he thought were good players, but because he's such a bad judge of talent the team crumbled. This is a GM who is headed into his 6th season, while missing the playoffs 4 years in a row (tied for the longest playoff drought in team history). The list of GM's who have missed 4 playoffs in a row while retaining their jobs is extremely limited, and that list is a who's who of incompetence. 5 years in a row is even smaller.

Our expectations were never that this would be a playoff team after 2-3 years. Our expectations were to have a GM do a proper rebuild. It was Benning's expectations that we would make the playoffs every year. So in a way, you're saying the expectations our GM had weren't realistic, yet you still somehow think he's the right man for the job. That's a very strange take.
 

Frankie Blueberries

Allergic to draft picks
Jan 27, 2016
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Based on what?....results from a team that has bottomed out (after spending a long run going from the WCE era, straight into the Sedin era)..Eventually,you have to start from almost scratch again....If your expectations were a playoff team, and a revamped young core after 2-3 years.. thats just not realistic.

There's been several dark era's in this team where the buildings been half empty over 50 years...and I'm sure that over the next 50 years there will be more up and down cycles.

I'm sorry but this thread isn't about coming up with excuses. If you disagree with the premise, provide specific examples on how there are worse eras in the past and your reasons for why they are worse. Otherwise please do not post, I don't want to go off topic on your ramblings about why Benning is never at fault.
 
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Pastor Of Muppetz

Registered User
Oct 1, 2017
26,010
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I'm sorry but this thread isn't about coming up with excuses. If you disagree with the premise, provide specific examples on how there are worse eras in the past and your reasons for why they are worse. Otherwise please do not post, I don't want to go off topic on your ramblings about why Benning is never at fault.
I did ..the team bottomed out after a good run in the 2000's..thats not an excuse..thats reality..

In 2014..we had one player in the prospect pool, and a declining,old, stale core..thats reality...

They made the playoffs in 2015,..and are turning the team around (replacing the old core with a very promising young core) after 'only' four years..thats reality.
 

Frankie Blueberries

Allergic to draft picks
Jan 27, 2016
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I did ..the team bottomed out after a good run in the 2000's..thats not an excuse..thats reality..

In 2014..we had one player in the prospect pool, and a declining,old, stale core..thats reality...

They made the playoffs in 2015,..and are turning the team around (replacing the old core with a very promising young core) after 'only' four years..thats reality.

Provide an example of an era that is worse than the current one.
This thread isn't for justifying a terrible GM. I know it's difficult for you to diverge from your normal narrative, but the topic is pretty clear and you're trying to derail it with your usual nonsense. I still don't know what era you are saying is worse.
 

timw33

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In 2014..we had one player in the prospect pool, and a declining,old, stale core..thats reality...

How many teams in a down cycle trade for win-now pieces in Sbisa/Bonino?
How many teams in a down cycle trade for Brandon Sutter with the express reasoning that he'd help them win in the playoffs?
How many teams in a down cycle sign FAs like Loui Eriksson?
How many teams in a down cycle trade essentially 24th, 33rd, and 74th for Erik Gudbranson (again, with reasoning that we need a big tough dman for the playoffs)?
How many teams in a down cycle have a pick deficit?
How many teams in a down cycle (that get out of the down cycle quickly) botch 2 top 6 picks?

Yes, we were in an inevitable down cycle and needed to overhaul the team—no one is in disagreement with this point. However, the execution of a vision (a vision I might add that was never clear) is what we have issues with and why we think this is one of the worst eras in team history.

All we had to do was hold the course, trade assets for pure futures packages/young prospects, sign bargain FAs on short term deals (and deal them at the deadline for even more picks), have a pick surplus for a few drafts and we'd be in a far stronger position to not just be a playoff team, but a team that might have a foundation that can challenge for a championship (Harman Dayal recently showed the work on this in a recent Athletic article).
 
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Pastor Of Muppetz

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Oct 1, 2017
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1984-85Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe802546900590.369284401145111147LaForge, Neale1985-86Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe8023441300590.369282333181310446Tom WattLost in round 1
1986-87Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe802943800660.413282314191710406Tom WattOut of Playoffs
1987-88Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe802546900590.369272320219611002Bob McCammonOut of Playoffs
1988-89Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe803339800740.463251253156913772Bob McCammonLost in round 1
1989-90Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe8025411400640.400245306164415417Bob McCammonOut of Playoffs
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
This was the worst era (pre Pat Quinn)...Made the worst trade of all time (Cam Neely)..not to mention its 1st round picks Vaive,Derlago had all been traded for vets a few years earlier...Team used to get beaten like a drum by the Alberta teams on a consistent basis....Building was more than half empty...Nobody cared...Completely irrelevant in the market at that time...They could have relocated the team, and nobody would have batted an eyelid.

The last 4 years have not been even close to that.
 
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Pastor Of Muppetz

Registered User
Oct 1, 2017
26,010
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How many teams in a down cycle trade for win-now pieces in Sbisa/Bonino?
How many teams in a down cycle trade for Brandon Sutter with the express reasoning that he'd help them win in the playoffs?
How many teams in a down cycle sign FAs like Loui Eriksson?
How many teams in a down cycle trade essentially 24th, 33rd, and 74th for Erik Gudbranson (again, with reasoning that we need a big tough dman for the playoffs)?
How many teams in a down cycle have a pick deficit?
How many teams in a down cycle (that get out of the down cycle quickly) botch 2 top 6 picks?


Yes, we were in an inevitable down cycle and needed to overhaul the team—no one is in disagreement with this point. However, the execution of a vision (a vision I might add that was never clear) is what we have issues with and why we think this is one of the worst eras in team history.

All we had to do was hold the course, trade assets for pure futures packages/young prospects, sign bargain FAs on short term deals (and deal them at the deadline for even more picks), have a pick surplus for a few drafts and we'd be in a far stronger position to not just be a playoff team, but a team that might have a foundation that can challenge for a championship (Harman Dayal recently showed the work on this in a recent Athletic article).

Yes..we know..the 'retool on the fly' while trying to fortify the Sedins didnt work..Are you going to bring up Linden Vey next?

all these moves were on the first two years of Bennings tenure...
 
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Cupless44

Registered User
Jun 25, 2014
7,154
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The OP must be young.

Some of us were here for 70s and 80s

However, the lack of a real plan, lack of vision, lack of creativity to deal with salary cap(which is problem that will get only worse), pro scouting, is as bad as I have seen it from a management group.
 

Frankie Blueberries

Allergic to draft picks
Jan 27, 2016
9,099
10,546
1984-85Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe802546900590.369284401145111147LaForge, Neale1985-86Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe8023441300590.369282333181310446Tom WattLost in round 1
1986-87Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe802943800660.413282314191710406Tom WattOut of Playoffs
1987-88Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe802546900590.369272320219611002Bob McCammonOut of Playoffs
1988-89Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe803339800740.463251253156913772Bob McCammonLost in round 1
1989-90Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe8025411400640.400245306164415417Bob McCammonOut of Playoffs
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
This was the worst era (pre Pat Quinn)...Made the worst trade of all time (Cam Neely)..not to mention its 1st round picks Vaive,Derlago had all been traded for vets a few years earlier...Team used to get beaten like a drum by the Alberta teams on a consistent basis....Building was more than half empty...Nobody cared...Completely irrelevant in the market at that time...They could have relocated the team, and nobody would have batted an eyelid.

The last 4 years have not been even close to that.


You're quoting a period of time where we made the playoffs twice (1986 and 1989), that is more success than the last 5 years.

Picking Juolevi over Tkachuk is just as bad as the Neely trade IMO.
 

krutovsdonut

eeyore
Sep 25, 2016
16,772
9,427
[MOD]

it's not even remotely close to the worst. the entirety of the first 20 years was far worse. to take a snapshot: after we traded neely in 1985, for all of 1986 and 1987 we were a sub 60 point team with no prospects. not a single ray of hope. everybody busted or was ruined. not to mention we had to watch neely take off elsewhere (after watching vaive do the same). the big jim sandlak era was as if our best prospect for three years was virtanen but he couldn't skate and had no hands.

or how about the fact that prior to bure we had in over 20 years never had a 50 goal scorer or a 100 point player when the league was full of them. we literally never had a true star player. we had only one season over .500 before the 1990s. a whopping 86 points was what we managed the one year we did that and then the habs toyed with us in the playoffs.

for 20 years we were also routinely annihilated by our division rivals and marquee teams. there were teams from the east we had not beaten in years. we did have the one redeeming moment of the 1983 cup run, but recall the reality check in the final.
 
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Frankie Blueberries

Allergic to draft picks
Jan 27, 2016
9,099
10,546
The OP must be young.

Some of us were here for 70s and 80s

However, the lack of a real plan, lack of vision, lack of creativity to deal with salary cap(which is problem that will get only worse), pro scouting, is as bad as I have seen it from a management group.

Can you list a specific era that is worse?
 

VanJack

Registered User
Jul 11, 2014
21,049
14,079
I know things look bleak now, but this is far from the worst era of the Canucks imo.

For that, you'd have to go back to the mid to late 80's. Terrible team; attendance at the old Pacific Coliseum regularly broke 8,000; and they couldn't give tickets away, even with your weekly grocery order. The arrival of Pat Quinn, Linden and eventually Bure was all that saved them.

Then there was the Keenan era. If Burkie is to be believed, the Canucks weren't too far away from following the NBA Grizzlies completely out of town. One pay phone call from Cable Guy John McCaw would have done the deed. Of course the NHL would still have had to approve any move, but it is conceivable the Canucks could have gone the same route as the old Winnipeg Jets.

So no, as the bumbling on player personnel continues unabated in 2019, the Canucks are still drawing well and the owners aren't going anywhere. It's just like slow death by a thousand paper cuts.
 

Frankie Blueberries

Allergic to draft picks
Jan 27, 2016
9,099
10,546
[MOD]

it's not even remotely close to the worst. the entirety of the first 20 years was far worse. to take a snapshot: after we traded neely in 1985, for all of 1986 and 1987 we were a sub 60 point team with no prospects. not a single ray of hope. everybody busted or was ruined. not to mention we had to watch neely take off elsewhere (after watching vaive do the same). the big jim sandlak era was as if our best prospect for three years was virtanen but he couldn't skate and had no hands.

or how about the fact that prior to bure we had in over 20 years never had a 50 goal scorer or a 100 point player when the league was full of them. we literally never had a true star player. we had only one season over .500 before the 1990s. a whopping 86 points was what we managed the one year we did that and then the habs toyed with us in the playoffs.

for 20 years we were also routinely annihilated by our division rivals and marquee teams. there were teams from the east we had not beaten in years. we did have the one redeeming moment of the 1983 cup run, but recall the reality check in the final.

[MOD]

I already addressed this era in my post above; we made the playoffs twice in that period of time, which is more than Benning can say.
 
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timw33

HFBoards Sponsor
Sponsor
Nov 18, 2007
25,709
19,426
Victoria
1984-85Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe802546900590.369284401145111147LaForge, Neale1985-86Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe8023441300590.369282333181310446Tom WattLost in round 1
1986-87Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe802943800660.413282314191710406Tom WattOut of Playoffs
1987-88Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe802546900590.369272320219611002Bob McCammonOut of Playoffs
1988-89Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe803339800740.463251253156913772Bob McCammonLost in round 1
1989-90Vancouver CanucksNHLSmythe8025411400640.400245306164415417Bob McCammonOut of Playoffs
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
This was the worst era (pre Pat Quinn)...Made the worst trade of all time (Cam Neely)..not to mention its 1st round picks Vaive,Derlago had all been traded for vets a few years earlier...Team used to get beaten like a drum by the Alberta teams on a consistent basis....Building was more than half empty...Nobody cared...Completely irrelevant in the market at that time...They could have relocated the team, and nobody would have batted an eyelid.

The last 4 years have not been even close to that.

You need to remember that 3-on-3 OTs, Shootouts, and a point for a loss in OT didn't exist back then.

If we look at it terms of ROWs (to eliminate the shootout effect), and without even factoring the massive difference of 3-on-3 OTs we get the following:

80's Era: 137 ROW in 400GP = 0.342 ROW%
Modern Era: 112 ROW in 328GP = 0.341 ROW%
 

82Ninety42011

Registered User
Jul 2, 2011
7,527
5,456
Abbotsford BC
I find it hilarious that everyone voting 'No' won't provide any examples of a worse era or reasoning for their vote. It's a silent acquiescence in taking an indefensible position.
I've been a fan since 81 and the sheer incompetence has been mind blowing many times. However at least now we have a bunch of kids that show true star level possibility. Before Pat Quinn came this was a joke of a franchise known more for the ugly V sweaters then anything else. Sure we had one run in 82 but got annihilated in final. Our best player or team hero was Stan Smyl yes a Canucks icon but really he wasn't a star. I've seen some dark days for sure. Now we have a meddling owner and a GM who shouldn't really have been hired in first place. As we all saw after he is out of his depth. However we have a a solid core emerging and a lot of dead weight falling off in 2-3 years if we can get through these next 2 years I see a bright future. Now let me add I'm not a Benning fan but were far from the darkest days I've seen before. Maybe just maybe ownership sees the light and Benning is let go next season and we get someone credible and go on to be a contender once again.
 
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