Line Combos: Is there enough room for Ras, Zadina etc to make team?

[Frk It]

He can play in the AHL, yesssss.

That’s great!

 

[StargateSG1]

Yes it is. The NHL just made their ruling.

Oh, cool, thanks

 

[TheMule93]

f*** u Halifax! He's ours now

 

[The Zetterberg Era]

**** u Halifax! He's ours now

Tough blow for them. They host the Memorial Cup next year which is good for McIsaac at least. We still have a Wings player there after all. Hopefully they can find a solution to no Zadina. However, he is done with major junior with this news.

I am happy it allows us the options we need in my opinion to give him the best possible development this year. If he makes the team out of camp, that would be great. If not I think we still see him though, likely after the WJCs or at the trade deadline.

 

[Shaman464]

At this point, I think the opening night lineup(barring injury) will be along the lines of:

AA/Larkin/Mantha
Zetts/Nielsen/ Nyquist
Bert/Helm/Vanek
Abby/Glen/Frk
(Wit)

DDK/Green
Daley/Ericsson
Kronwall/Jensen
(Wit)

Howard
Bernier

AA shouldn't be anywhere near the top line. It will be basically an automatic powerplay for the other team's top line 90% of the time.

 

[Invictus12]

AA shouldn't be anywhere near the top line. It will be basically an automatic powerplay for the other team's top line 90% of the time.

Yep! Nor does it make sense to have Z playing with other matured players when we have youngsters on the lineup.

 

[Frk It]

When Nyquist gets traded at the TDL, that will open up a top 6 RW spot for Zadina.
May even see another “2 kids and an old goat line” with Rasmussen and Zadina playing on Z’s wing this year.

Starting the year in GR and playing in another WJC would be good for Zadina’s development. If he makes the team, great.. if not that is a good option too.

Happy he is turning pro, personally didn’t think another year of Juniors was what he needed.

 

[Ezekial]

Oh happy day!!!!

So glad he's ahl eligible, more likely that he starts down there, but it's the perfect situation for his development. If he can't cut it to make the roster the ahl is the best place for him.

 

[Shaman464]

Oh happy day!!!!

So glad he's ahl eligible, more likely that he starts down there, but it's the perfect situation for his development. If he can't cut it to make the roster the ahl is the best place for him.

The problem is that he may be (and in my mind likely will be) better than a vet, and should easily make the roster but because he's AHL eligible will still be sent down.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

The problem is that he may be (and in my mind likely will be) better than a vet, and should easily make the roster but because he's AHL eligible will still be sent down.

He needs to be better than and push out a top 6 guy who isn't a center.

If he's a better player than LGD or Nielsen? Doesn't matter. He's not a C.
If he's better than Frk or Helm or whoever else plays bottom 6... do you actually want the best sniper we've had... probably since Shanahan... to be playing 8-10 minutes a night? If Zadina makes the roster I want it to be like Larkin making the roster several years ago. First line duties. Tons of IT. Anything else, and you're wasting a year off his ELC for no reason.

 

[Frk It]

The problem is that he may be (and in my mind likely will be) better than a vet, and should easily make the roster but because he's AHL eligible will still be sent down.

I can give you a list of highly drafted wingers who didn’t immediately start in the NHL are elite players if that helps.

Was Forsberg better than Joel Ward in 2013? Probably. Was Pastrnak better than Carl Soderberg in 2014? Yeah, maybe.

He’s 18 years old. As long as he’s on the team by the end of the year it’s all good.

 

[Shaman464]

He needs to be better than and push out a top 6 guy who isn't a center.

If he's a better player than LGD or Nielsen? Doesn't matter. He's not a C.
If he's better than Frk or Helm or whoever else plays bottom 6... do you actually want the best sniper we've had... probably since Shanahan... to be playing 8-10 minutes a night? If Zadina makes the roster I want it to be like Larkin making the roster several years ago. First line duties. Tons of IT. Anything else, and you're wasting a year off his ELC for no reason.

Right now hes likely better than Helm, Frk, AA, Abedelkader, Witowoski, and probably Vanek.

As for the ELC slide, I think if he plays in the AHL that counts as a year off his ELC as its a North American professional league.

And significantly, players who do not play at a North American professional level can have their contracts “slide” (often referred to as “entry-level slide”). Basically, the contract shifts forward one year such that the first year of the contract just shifts to the next year. This occurs if a player does not play at least 10 games at the NHL or professional level.

 

[Lil Sebastian Cossa]

Right now hes likely better than Helm, Frk, AA, Abedelkader, Witowoski, and probably Vanek.

As for the ELC slide, I think if he plays in the AHL that counts as a year off his ELC as its a North American professional league.

Entry-Level Slide Candidates - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Unless they changed this from 2016, they don't.

And also, Zadina being a better hockey player in the NHL than all of those guys is

1) debatable, as we haven't seen how he'll skate against grown men over a long season. He's got more talent than most of them surely.
2) irrelevant in the case of Helm, AA, Abdelkader, and Witkowski. Zadina will NEVER play the same type of game they play.
3) Largely irrelevnt in the case of Frk because Frk's going to be playing 10 minutes a night at the peak if he's not in upstairs in the press box. That's a waste of a guy like Zadina's cheap ELC years.

 

[Unfriendly Ghost]

But the team hasn’t completely ruled out Henrik Zetterberg’s back issues causing an early retirement, and the idea of trading away a winger for help on defense is being explored. It’s crowded now, but a lot can change between now and the start of the season.

Details on Filip Zadina’s contract and why Red Wings...

 

[njx9]

Bert has been progressing every year , his hockey iq off the charts always in the right spot . I think he will continue to improve

Maybe. I just don't buy that he's really more than a bottom 6 guy. Nothing wrong with that, at all.

21-man roster?

So they'll definitely have to do something to be able to ice a roster. They'll have to finagle something, something that will have to involve kids on the roster in the end.

Just to clarify, he was saying none of Ras, Zadina, Hronek, or Cholowski will get time to start the season without injury. It's basically impossible with our roster. Maybe not impossible (Hicketts, Sulak could make it and render my point invalid), but certainly not feasible.

I think you bring up Hicketts or Sulak because who cares if they spend time in the press box, where that would be extremely detrimental to Hronek or Cholo (for instance). And I don't buy, short of injury, that the team would actually let anyone beat out, say, Kronwall for an every day spot.

So yes, the team will have to use someone from GR to fill in press box spots. No, I don't think it will be any of the rookies anyone's actually excited to watch.

If the Wings did what so many seem to want and leave 5 spots open for kids... when any of them get hurt? It’s Libor and Sadowy time!

Honestly? Who cares. I know the easy, but kind of BS answer is that the organization cares, but as we're a bunch of fans debating fan things, I'm going to tune in to watch Sadowy play just as much as I'm going to tune in to watch Vanek. Neither is the answer, neither will be here when it matters, and neither is particularly exciting to watch. So, I get your point, but I'm not fussed whether the team is playing the current collection of mediocrity, or some other collection of mediocrity, and I might even prefer the latter if it means the fun players who do actually have an NHL future are getting max play time.

It's frankly the same reason I couldn't care less if Coreau was going to play every game this year, and why I think Bernier was a stupid (though entirely inconsequential) signing. If we're not playing the future, and we're not building toward the future, I'll watch a few games for the sweater and because I care about the team in the abstract, but I'm not going to tune in to watch basically anyone on the current NHL roster.

 

[Bench]

Great news Zadina can play in the AHL. That takes some of the sting out of the roster jam for sure. He'll be a stones throw away for call-ups and still get to play in a higher league.

 

[Pavels Dog]

I think you bring up Hicketts or Sulak because who cares if they spend time in the press box, where that would be extremely detrimental to Hronek or Cholo (for instance). And I don't buy, short of injury, that the team would actually let anyone beat out, say, Kronwall for an every day spot.

Kronner sucks. He might get some rope just because of who he is, but it’s realistic that he could be our 8th or 9th best D this upcoming season.
If that happens the coaching staff won’t have much choice.

 

[Shaman464]

Kronner sucks. He might get some rope just because of who he is, but it’s realistic that he could be our 8th or 9th best D this upcoming season.
If that happens the coaching staff won’t have much choice.

He would the 8th or 9th on any other team, but on the Red Wings he's still #4 or 5.

 

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

I can live with Zadina in Grand Rapids. Would be interested in seeing him with Svechnikov.

 

[Oddbob]

Kronner sucks. He might get some rope just because of who he is, but it’s realistic that he could be our 8th or 9th best D this upcoming season.
If that happens the coaching staff won’t have much choice.

This I don't agree with. If this were true, than back when we had Smith and Kindl switching back and forth out of the press box and Ericsson was having a tough patch, yet he never sat out a game, not once. If Kronwall is on the roster, healthy enough to play, the current coach will play him, whether we like it or not. I personally was hoping he would retire after this past season, both because he no longer is impactful out there in any meaningful way because of his injuries and it brings down how we remember him, because right now he is playing past his ability.

 

[Pavels Dog]

This I don't agree with. If this were true, than back when we had Smith and Kindl switching back and forth out of the press box and Ericsson was having a tough patch, yet he never sat out a game, not once. If Kronwall is on the roster, healthy enough to play, the current coach will play him, whether we like it or not. I personally was hoping he would retire after this past season, both because he no longer is impactful out there in any meaningful way because of his injuries and it brings down how we remember him, because right now he is playing past his ability.

Ericsson at his worst was always a better player than Smith and Kindl. Looking a little rough on a top pairing is different than Kronner currently being a huge liability even on a 3rd pairing and barely able to handle anything but PP minutes.

It’s one thing if the kids ever so slightly outplay Kronner for a #5-6 job then you could argue ”tie goes to veteran”. But if they are playing like top 4D on our team Blash is forced to make hard decisions.

 

[Oddbob]

Ericsson at his worst was always a better player than Smith and Kindl. Looking a little rough on a top pairing is different than Kronner currently being a huge liability even on a 3rd pairing and barely able to handle anything but PP minutes.

It’s one thing if the kids ever so slightly outplay Kronner for a #5-6 job then you could argue ”tie goes to veteran”. But if they are playing like top 4D on our team Blash is forced to make hard decisions.

There was a stretch there, where Ericsson wasn't playing better than either of them. He is now decently reliable even if in a higher role than he should be, but for awhile that was not the case.

 

[Pavels Dog]

There was a stretch there, where Ericsson wasn't playing better than either of them. He is now decently reliable even if in a higher role than he should be, but for awhile that was not the case.

Well there's a difference between a situation where 3 guys kinda suck with 1 having a track record of being solid and the other two having track records of always sucking.
I do get the concerns and I don't rule out a Tatar situation for Cholo/Hronek, where they spend the first 5-10 games mostly as #7D until they get a real opportunity. But if they get into the lineup and play like they should be there, someone's gotta sit and Kronner should realistically be the guy (unless another veteran completely falls of the cliff as well).

 

[newfy]

no there isnt but theyll make room, especially if they each have a good camp. ppl need to chill a bit, if Zadina is ready Frk will be waived. or someone will get traded

 

[njx9]

Kronner sucks. He might get some rope just because of who he is, but it’s realistic that he could be our 8th or 9th best D this upcoming season.
If that happens the coaching staff won’t have much choice.

It seems really silly to pretend that this team has any intention of favoring a kid over a vet, regardless of ability, when there's literally only one example of it over the last nearly 10 years of declining play. But if you want to pretend like it's something that happens regularly, you do you. I'm sure the team will put ~$4.75m AAV in the press box on a regular basis any day now.