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Is the FHL back to 5 teams?

lennysundahl

Registered User
Dec 21, 2006
88
5
Huntington, WV
It's a couple guys in different time zones, so that helps. But yeah they've just been on it lately. Hit or miss on their geographical accuracy sometimes (still can't get over "Louisville has never had hockey") but they're relative kids and they're getting some good info. Yesterday they ran a thing--with jersey mockups--telling how the FHL was angling for Birmingham before the SPHL ended up bringing the Bulls back (over the "BullZ" :skeptic:)
 
CrazyEddie20

CrazyEddie20

Hey RuZZia - Cut Your Losses and Go Home.
Jun 26, 2007
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It's a blog. They likely make no money and definitely have no editors.

When you're looking for journalism, remember: You get what you pay for.
 
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lennysundahl

Registered User
Dec 21, 2006
88
5
Huntington, WV
Not necessarily. Let's put them next to neighboring Flint, who have shared leagues with Port Huron off and on over the years (and is a city with notable issues, as I'm sure you're all aware). The Generals and IceHawks spent the second IHL together:

2007-08: Flint 2217, Port Huron 1344
2008-09: Flint 1613, Port Huron 1457
2009-10: Flint 1868, Port Huron 1627

Left out in the cold when the IHL was absorbed into the CHL, both cities wound up in low juniors, in the NAHL--the Michigan Warriors and Port Huron Fighting Falcons:

2010-11: Flint 919, Port Huron 682
2011-12: Port Huron 716, Flint 669
2012-13: Flint 1014, Port Huron 620
2013-14: Flint 936, Port Huron 577

Not exactly attendance to set the world on fire. The Falcons folded, replaced by the current Prowlers in 2015, and the fans have taken to the FHL much more than they did to the junior game:

2015-16: 1045
2016-17: 1047
2017-18: 1206

Flint, however, after another season in the NAHL (921/game in 2014-15), managed to secure an OHL team when Peter Karmanos put the Plymouth Whalers up for sale, and the Firebirds' crowds, while not amazing by OHL standards (never higher than 16th of 20 in attendance), haven't been this strong since the Generals' UHL days:

2015-16: 2984
2016-17: 2951
2017-18: 2866

And remember, this is in Flint, which is as much a hell on earth as it's ever been in the last 30 years. It's a simple matter of quality, IMO (ownership notwithstanding, lol).
 
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Barclay Donaldson

Barclay Donaldson

Registered User
Feb 4, 2018
2,542
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Tatooine
I also saw that article on Arena Digest. I've heard the NAHL has kicked the tires in the Southern Tier as well to relocate one of their attendance-poor East Division teams. Not completely familiar with the situation, but it would appear that there's an issue with the rink or the lease or something infrastructural that is a repelling some teams.

Having played Elmira College's D3 team this past season, their home rink (which by itself is a great barn, even though it looks like a golf ball sunk into the ground from outside) is probably 30 minutes north of the college into the wilderness even though they have this arena down the street. If the college isn't even playing games at the arena, there has to be something going on.
 

CHRDANHUTCH

Registered User
Mar 4, 2002
35,545
4,317
Auburn, Maine
Outback Steakhouse said:
I also saw that article on Arena Digest. I've heard the NAHL has kicked the tires in the Southern Tier as well to relocate one of their attendance-poor East Division teams. Not completely familiar with the situation, but it would appear that there's an issue with the rink or the lease or something infrastructural that is a repelling some teams.

Having played Elmira College's D3 team this past season, their home rink (which by itself is a great barn, even though it looks like a golf ball sunk into the ground from outside) is probably 30 minutes north of the college into the wilderness even though they have this arena down the street. If the college isn't even playing games at the arena, there has to be something going on.
Click to expand...
the arena itself needs structural upgrades, from what I'VE BEEN reading although Robbie Nichols has a standing offer to get a team there if that is done.... nothing I'VE read STATES the NAHL has any interest in Elmira knowing the history of how the Jackals ended or were portayed the last 5 or 6 years before their demise in 2017
 
royals119

royals119

Registered User
Jun 12, 2006
1,457
1,139
West Lawn, PA
Outback Steakhouse said:
I also saw that article on Arena Digest. I've heard the NAHL has kicked the tires in the Southern Tier as well to relocate one of their attendance-poor East Division teams. Not completely familiar with the situation, but it would appear that there's an issue with the rink or the lease or something infrastructural that is a repelling some teams.

Having played Elmira College's D3 team this past season, their home rink (which by itself is a great barn, even though it looks like a golf ball sunk into the ground from outside) is probably 30 minutes north of the college into the wilderness even though they have this arena down the street. If the college isn't even playing games at the arena, there has to be something going on.
Click to expand...
What I was told by the locals when I used to go up for Royals games is that Elmira College originally had a deal in place to play at First Arena, but then backed out. I don't think they ever played games there on a regular basis, so the fact that they aren't there now isn't due to the current state of the arena necessarily.

I believe the biggest issue with the building is replacing the ice making equipment. There were problems with the ice during the last season of the Jackals. There are other smaller issues too, but fixing or replacing the ice making equipment would probably be enough to get a team in the building.
 

CHRDANHUTCH

Registered User
Mar 4, 2002
35,545
4,317
Auburn, Maine
royals119 said:
What I was told by the locals when I used to go up for Royals games is that Elmira College originally had a deal in place to play at First Arena, but then backed out. I don't think they ever played games there on a regular basis, so the fact that they aren't there now isn't due to the current state of the arena necessarily.

I believe the biggest issue with the building is replacing the ice making equipment. There were problems with the ice during the last season of the Jackals. There are other smaller issues too, but fixing or replacing the ice making equipment would probably be enough to get a team in the building.
Click to expand...

correct, that's why there's a deadline set by Wednesday, from what I've been reading, Robbie has a standing offer to get a team back in Elmira, provided the arena is up to code from the group that bought First Arena separately and allowed the Jackals to cease ops when they did....

on a related note, it seems Richmond is ready to return with a newer or updated version of the Coliseum aka "The Freezer", BUT THAT has been blocked by the Times Dispatch policy of subscriber only.....
 

Drake88

Registered User
Aug 17, 2011
76
10
Ideally I would love to see Single A hockey at 16 teams max, in only one league. Play would be almost all within your division with the conference winners facing off in the finals and having one league creates a uniform salary cap and set of rules for Single A hockey. No more expanding to community rinks (FHL) and you can look to build off the improvements in play the SPHL has seen in recent years. There is definitely a niche market for this style of hockey in smaller towns and if the league is tight knit geographically it would have a chance.

North: Elmira, Peoria, Bloomington, Quad City, Richmond, Roanoke, Port Huron, Evansville
South: Macon, Mississippi, Pensacola, Birmingham, Carolina, Fayetteville, Knoxville, Huntsville

North Backup Markets: Dayton, Chicago, Danbury, St. Charles, Jamestown, Johnstown, Lewiston
South Backup Markets: Columbia, Louisiana, Augusta, Columbus, Laredo, RGV
 

CHRDANHUTCH

Registered User
Mar 4, 2002
35,545
4,317
Auburn, Maine
Drake88 said:
Ideally I would love to see Single A hockey at 16 teams max, in only one league. Play would be almost all within your division with the conference winners facing off in the finals and having one league creates a uniform salary cap and set of rules for Single A hockey. No more expanding to community rinks (FHL) and you can look to build off the improvements in play the SPHL has seen in recent years. There is definitely a niche market for this style of hockey in smaller towns and if the league is tight knit geographically it would have a chance.

North: Elmira, Peoria, Bloomington, Quad City, Richmond, Roanoke, Port Huron, Evansville
South: Macon, Mississippi, Pensacola, Birmingham, Carolina, Fayetteville, Knoxville, Huntsville

North Backup Markets: Dayton, Chicago, Danbury, St. Charles, Jamestown, Johnstown, Lewiston
South Backup Markets: Columbia, Louisiana, Augusta, Columbus, Laredo, RGV
Click to expand...

Lewiston has 2 junior franchises, now Drake..... one is aligned with the NA3HL (NAHL) and is called the Nordiques now in its 2nd season and owned by the operators of the Colisee.... the other is the Twin City Thunder, that starts this fall

LA NORDIQUES: Home

Twin City Thunder: Home
 
royals119

royals119

Registered User
Jun 12, 2006
1,457
1,139
West Lawn, PA
Drake88 said:
Ideally I would love to see Single A hockey at 16 teams max, in only one league. Play would be almost all within your division with the conference winners facing off in the finals and having one league creates a uniform salary cap and set of rules for Single A hockey. No more expanding to community rinks (FHL) and you can look to build off the improvements in play the SPHL has seen in recent years. There is definitely a niche market for this style of hockey in smaller towns and if the league is tight knit geographically it would have a chance.

North: Elmira, Peoria, Bloomington, Quad City, Richmond, Roanoke, Port Huron, Evansville
South: Macon, Mississippi, Pensacola, Birmingham, Carolina, Fayetteville, Knoxville, Huntsville

North Backup Markets: Dayton, Chicago, Danbury, St. Charles, Jamestown, Johnstown, Lewiston
South Backup Markets: Columbia, Louisiana, Augusta, Columbus, Laredo, RGV
Click to expand...
Your ideal plan makes a lot of sense, but when it comes to the real world leagues have to make compromises, just as you did with your north division. You say you want a tight geographic footprint, but you have Elmira with five Midwest teams and two southern teams. There isn't another team within a ten hour drive of Elmira and Richmond/Roanoke to those Midwest teams is probably a two day drive. They are both closer to all the South division teams than they are to the north teams.

If there are enough cities that want hockey that don't fit in the SPHL footprint or don't have the finances to work in that model, why not let them have a semi-pro league like the FHL, where all games are on weekends, costs are super low by playing in rec-rinks, players have other jobs to supplement their income, and they travel in cars or vans instead of busses. They probably won't have sponsors anyway, so keep the front office staff to a couple of part timers.
 
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JMCx4

JMCx4

Censorship is the Sincerest Form of Flattery
Sep 3, 2017
13,667
8,474
St. Louis, MO
CHRDANHUTCH said:
... on a related note, it seems Richmond is ready to return with a newer or updated version of the Coliseum aka "The Freezer", BUT THAT has been blocked by the Times Dispatch policy of subscriber only.....
Click to expand...
That redevelopment plan has been bouncing around Richmond for many years. It's still a long skate from RFP to replacement.
 
CrazyEddie20

CrazyEddie20

Hey RuZZia - Cut Your Losses and Go Home.
Jun 26, 2007
1,891
1,202
Back of a cop car
CHRDANHUTCH said:
correct, that's why there's a deadline set by Wednesday, from what I've been reading, Robbie has a standing offer to get a team back in Elmira, provided the arena is up to code from the group that bought First Arena separately and allowed the Jackals to cease ops when they did....

on a related note, it seems Richmond is ready to return with a newer or updated version of the Coliseum aka "The Freezer", BUT THAT has been blocked by the Times Dispatch policy of subscriber only.....
Click to expand...

Yeah, you know, it's really terrible that companies have the audacity to charge for their product.
 
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