Is the Carter Hart hype premature?

[Riddum]

Philly is not a good hockey team. The fact that he's able to carry such a terrible team makes the hype warranted

 

[BrindamoursNose]

Philly is not a good hockey team. The fact that he's able to carry such a terrible team makes the hype warranted

Real quick... What is the metric that makes the Flyers "not a good hockey team"?

Last season, the Flyers were:

6th in points
8th in Goals For
8th in Goals Against
9th in ES goals per game

They weren't good in the playoffs, but getting back to this thread...Carter Hart wasn't the issue.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Philly is not a good hockey team. The fact that he's able to carry such a terrible team makes the hype warranted

Lol he’s carrying nobody . They are a good solid team all around

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I do think his numbers so far don't line up with some of the hype he has gotten, but I think it's more "premature" than "overrated". He's a very good young goalie with enormous upside.

I feel like he had this insane variance in his stats home vs. away. For some reason NHL commentators pretend like his away stats don't exist.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

I'll never understand why no one wants to give credit for how someone plays outside of the NHL. Shestyorkin has been widely hailed as one of if not the best goalie outside the league and has had crazy success anywhere he's played. You can judge goalies on their talent just like elite prospects, not just their numbers in the NHL. It was very clear based on his game and his numbers outside the NHL that Hammond was a flash in the pan and he wouldn't sustain his success. Everything points to Shestyorkin likely continuing to perform at a high level.

I'd be less confident if the Rangers didn't have the best goaltending coach in the NHL. They're a goalie factory and other than Lundqvist he's EASILY the most talented goalie Allaire would have worked with. His success in other pro leagues and the NHL plus having a goalie coach that at makes all of his goalies better than they are and I have 0 problems projecting barring injury.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

Because unlike pre-1990, the best players are in the NHL. I have no problem with Shesterkin and Rangers fans being excited for him, but he is overhyped. I view him like I did Lalime when he broke in (or Hammond as earlier stated). There’s not enough body of work at the NHL level. He’s still a prospect at this point (whereas I view Hart like a modern day Jim Carey [enough of a body of work to deserve the hype but not enough to feel comfortable to say it’s deserved]).

Does this not work for his non-NHL defenseman also?

 

[hmc1987]

how so? He's performed much better than Hart on a way worse team.

Is this a joke?

You can draw a conclusion and make career projections about Shesterkin after 12 games ??

Mods can we remove this?

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

Is this a joke?

You can draw a conclusion and make career projections about Shesterkin after 12 games ??

Mods can we remove this?

lol crying to the mods. Is that a joke?

 

[nhlfan9191]

He had a .936 SV% and 1.94 GAA with 2 shutouts in the Habs series. The Flyers won a 6 game series scoring just 11 total goals and somehow Hart was poor in the series?

A much better Habs team in 2017 made an aging Lundqvist look like a god in the playoffs before he was brought down to earth by the Senators. Don’t let the stats confuse you. We’ve been shoveling as much **** at the net hoping for a different result for a long time in Montreal.

 

[DropTheGloves]

Is Hart rated higher than top 10 for goalies? Who are the better goalies, that some might (mistakenly) believe Hart is better than, when he’s actually not? Price? Markstrom? Helly? Tuuka? Vasilevski? Bob? Freddy? Others? I’d say Hart is right around that 10 mark or so. Is having him in that range overrating him?

I'd personally rate him above Andersen, but that might be putting the Hart before the Norse.

 

[John Eichel da GOAT]

Yes/No. It reminds me a lot of Quinn Hughes. Van hasn't had a decent dman in literally forever and now that they have a decent one, he gets propped up higher than he may deserve. Not much different in Philly with Hart compared to Parent or Hextall.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Hart gets such a cushy reputation. Even the thread title was changed to get rid of the word overrated.

He’s overrated. He’s had more than enough time to prove he’s elite, if he was. Maybe he will be eventually. I think he will be, but the guy is around a .915 goalie right now. If you think that’s elite, you are overrating him. And considering nearly everyone claims he’s top 10, clearly overrated.

 

[mja]

Hart gets such a cushy reputation. Even the thread title was changed to get rid of the word overrated.

He’s overrated. He’s had more than enough time to prove he’s elite, if he was.

Not getting into the rest of the thread, but this is silly. At Hart's age, most goalies are still developing in lower leagues. He's the youngest goalie in the league (outside of a handful of guys who have played a game or two). Not youngest starter, youngest goalie period. You have to go back to the 2014 draft with Saros to find the next youngest goalie who's played more games than Hart, and Saros is more than 3 years older.

 

[surixon]

Hart at his age being a slightly above league average starter based on save percentage at his age is pretty darn impressive. Based on his early results and pre NHL pedigree he is well on his way to becoming an elite goalie in this league.

 

[JT Kreider]

Hart gets such a cushy reputation. Even the thread title was changed to get rid of the word overrated.

He’s overrated. He’s had more than enough time to prove he’s elite, if he was. Maybe he will be eventually. I think he will be, but the guy is around a .915 goalie right now. If you think that’s elite, you are overrating him. And considering nearly everyone claims he’s top 10, clearly overrated.

What?!?!?! He does not even have 100 starts to his name

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

Not getting into the rest of the thread, but this is silly. At Hart's age, most goalies are still developing in lower leagues. He's the youngest goalie in the league (outside of a handful of guys who have played a game or two). Not youngest starter, youngest goalie period. You have to go back to the 2014 draft with Saros to find the next youngest goalie who's played more games than Hart, and Saros is more than 3 years older.

What’s your complaint? You pick out part of my post before I added a caveat. Yes, most goalies his age aren’t NHL starters. He’ll probably be elite eventually. Right now, he’s not. If you rank him as elite right now, you are overrating him.

 

[mja]

What’s your complaint? You pick out part of my post before I added a caveat. Yes, most goalies his age aren’t NHL starters. He’ll probably be elite eventually. Right now, he’s not. If you rank him as elite right now, you are overrating him.

I directly quoted you, lol. You literally said he’s had more than enough time to prove he was elite. The hedging you did afterwards just makes the entire post completely nonsensical.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

I directly quoted you, lol. You literally said he’s had more than enough time to prove he was elite. The hedging you did afterwards just makes the entire post completely nonsensical.

Now you're just being dishonest. You quoted part of what I said. You left out the part where I explained the point very clearly about how he's currently viewed and I said a lot of the same things you said about how he projects in the future.

 

[mja]

Now you're just being dishonest. You quoted part of what I said. You left out the part where I explained the point very clearly about how he's currently viewed and I said a lot of the same things you said about how he projects in the future.

The part I left out contradicted the part I quoted. It wasn't a caveat, it just doesn't make any sense. Either "he's had more than enough time to prove he's elite, if he was" or he still may yet be elite, but it can't be both. Read back what you wrote. It's completely nonsensical.

 

[Mobiandi]

I thought he was overrated going into the playoffs but he did well. I think he deserves his praise but I also wonder how much room he has left to grow. The era of goalies with insane longetivity seems to be coming to an end so I think if Philly gets more than 5 years of good goaltending from him, it's a win

 

[BackToTheBrierePatch]

Player A: 70gp .916% 2.72GAA 5 S/O
Player B: 74gp .915% 2.59GAA 1S/O

Umm yeah, Hart is overrated. Blackwood also plays for what many would consider a worst team.

P.S Hart gets a lot of bonus points for his age.

overrated gets thrown around so much on this board. Hart is a really good young goaltender. He had his ups and downs this past season like any young goaltender.
He is a 21 year old kid. He likely has been under the most scrutiny and pressure than any young goalie since Price. Considering everything he has been very good.

 

[BritainStix]

The part I left out contradicted the part I quoted. It wasn't a caveat, it just doesn't make any sense. Either "he's had more than enough time to prove he's elite, if he was" or he still may yet be elite, but it can't be both. Read back what you wrote. It's completely nonsensical.

You are wasting your time. Pavel is a veteran on these boards at throwing out baseless, unfounded remarks and defending his comments beyond the point of defense.

Just look up his post history.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

The part I left out contradicted the part I quoted. It wasn't a caveat, it just doesn't make any sense. Either "he's had more than enough time to prove he's elite, if he was" or he still may yet be elite, but it can't be both. Read back what you wrote. It's completely nonsensical.

No, it doesn't work that way. The guy has been in the NHL for two seasons now. We hear from many that you can't be elite until you have enough time in the league. Hart has been in the league for a few seasons now, and we know he's not yet elite. If he was elite, his numbers would prove it. He wouldn't have had a .914 last season.

That doesn't mean he won't be elite eventually, but if he was elite already, he'd be producing like an elite goalie. We wouldn't get any of these excuses about why he doesn't produce as an elite goalie. There's this blurring of the lines between potential and current ability we see a lot with Hart. His current ability is clearly overrated.

 

[Pavel Buchnevich]

You are wasting your time. Pavel is a veteran on these boards at throwing out baseless, unfounded remarks and defending his comments beyond the point of defense.

Just look up his post history.

You got me there. I might as well go cry in a corner because you insulted me.

Why don't you contribute to the thread positively instead of insulting me and defend what Hart has done to be considered an elite goalie already?

 

[Tripod]

Who are all these people saying he is elite like PB is claiming?

Hart has the ABILITY to be elite as he has shown in his younger years and given the fact that is already an NHL starter with good numbers while others at the same age are not even in the NHL.

This isn't complicated.

Last 2 years he has a .915 SV%....that's 15th in the league for goalies playing at least 40 games. But it's the same as Markstrom...and better than Freddy Andersen, Price, Gibson, Varlamov, Fleury, Rinne, Bobrovsky, etc...

Having a 20 then 21 year old goalie be top 15 in the league is rare. It doesn't mean he will be the best goalie in the league. It just means that what he has done is something that few ever do and given his PROVEN track record at other levels, it's progress towards becoming a top goalie.

Junior Career:
WHL Career: .927 SV% 2.01 GAA
WHL Playoffs Career: .921 SV% 2.38 GAA
CHL All Star Game: .938 SV% 1.93 GAA
WHL VS Russ Series: .937 SV% 1.61 GAA
WJC Career .920 SV% 2.04 GAA

Prof Career:
AHL Career: .902 SV% 3.05 GAA-only "stat" where his stats don't look good: it was 18 games on a bad team
NHL Career: .915 SV% 2.59 GAA
NHL Playoff Career: .926 SV% 2.23 GAA
WC Career: .964 SV% 0.70 GAA

TRACK RECORD OF BEING ELITE....still not NHL elite...but TRACKING in that direction.