Is Shea Weber a Hall of Famer?

Luck 6

\\_______
Oct 17, 2008
10,190
1,783
Vancouver
Considering he's never even won a Norris, I think there's at least a debate to be had.

It's extremely difficult to win a Norris, and Weber probably could've won a couple and nobody would've questioned it, but the fact is he hasn't. I think he's a HoFer, but we're not talking about Lidstrom here.

I didn’t even realize he never won a Norris. I’m shocked, he’s been a stud defenseman for so long and has generally always been considered one of the top defenders for so many years. It kind of reminds me on how Luongo never won a Vezna.

Anyways, this ones a good debate. If you judge the hall of fame on hardware, he really shouldn’t be in consideration. But I think it should be more than that, he’s definitely get my vote.
 

Sanchise90

Registered User
Sep 6, 2019
307
243
Third all time in wins.

Fleury’s been to more Finals and won more rounds since he left the Penguins than Sid and Geno.

that’s a Hall of fame career. And it’s not remotely over.

The Hall is also ridiculous about what goalies get in, but even by their absurd standards, Fleury is in.

Wins are a team accomplishment. Fleury's been fortunate that for most of his career, he happened to be on a team with two Top 100 players of all-time.

Fleury doesn't have the individual accolades relative to his Hall of Fame peers. Compare his individual accolades to the goalies that have been recently enshrined:

Martin Brodeur: 4 Vezinas, 4 additional top 3 finishes, 4 additional top 5 finishes, 3 years Hart Finalist, 3 1st teams, 4 2nd teams

Rogie Vachon: 1 Vezina, 2 years Hart Finalist, 2 2nd teams

Dominik Hasek: Too many accolades to list

Ed Belfour: 2 Vezinas, 2 additional top 3 finishes, 3 additional top 5 finishes, 2 1st Team, 1 2nd Team

The bar to get in as a goalie is extremely hard. Barrasso and CuJo aren't in, but even they have more individual accolades than Fleury. Just being on winning teams shouldn't be enough to get in. I mean if that's the case, we might as well just throw Brent Seabrook in the HOF since its just wins that matter right?...
 
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Weztex

Registered User
Feb 6, 2006
3,108
3,690
I dug up the Norris votes for every seasons since 1999-00 and gave each player an annual ''ballot score'' based on the percentage of ballots they appeared on.

For example in 2020, 170 PHWA members voted for the Norris. Roman Josi appeared on all 170 ballots so he gets a score of 100. Jaccob Slavin appeared on 82 so it gives him a score of 48,5. If you add up the last 20 seasons, the top-25 looks like this.

Ballot score - 1999-00/2019-20
* denotes players who also received votes prior to the 1999-00 season
Bolded denotes Norris winners during that time frame

RankBallot scorePlayer
11031,4Nicklas Lidstrom*
2698,3Zdeno Chara
3454,6Shea Weber
4449,1Drew Doughty
5405,7Erik Karlsson
6395,4Duncan Keith
7392,1Victor Hedman
8378,4Chris Pronger*
9339,3Sergei Gonchar*
10307,3Rob Blake*
11301,8Scott Niedermayer*
12288,7Brent Burns
13275,5Kris Letang
14264,9P.K. Subban
15249,6Alex Pietrangelo
16242,0John Carlson
17239,6Ryan Suter
18227,1Roman Josi
19217,9Mike Green
20157,3Mark Giordano
21143,6Sergei Zubov*
22139,7Al MacInnis*
23139,1Dion Phaneuf
24138,2Dan Boyle
25124,4Chris Chelios*
[TBODY] [/TBODY]
 
Last edited:

Voight

#winning
Feb 8, 2012
40,374
16,649
Mulberry Street
Wins are a team accomplishment. Fleury's been fortunate that for most of his career, he happened to be on a team with two Top 100 players of all-time.

Fleury doesn't have the individual accolades relative to his Hall of Fame peers. Compare his individual accolades to the goalies that have been recently enshrined:

Martin Brodeur: 4 Vezinas, 4 additional top 3 finishes, 4 additional top 5 finishes, 3 years Hart Finalist, 3 1st teams, 4 2nd teams

Rogie Vachon: 1 Vezina, 2 years Hart Finalist, 2 2nd teams

Dominik Hasek: Too many accolades to list

Ed Belfour: 2 Vezinas, 2 additional top 3 finishes, 3 additional top 5 finishes, 2 1st Team, 1 2nd Team

The bar to get in as a goalie is extremely hard. Barrasso and CuJo aren't in, but even they have more individual accolades than Fleury. Just being on winning teams shouldn't be enough to get in. I mean if that's the case, we might as well just throw Brent Seabrook in the HOF since its just wins that matter right?...

I'd add it took Vachon 30 years to get inducted. So I dont understand why people think MAF will be in first ballot, let alone anytime soon after he retires.
 

um

Registered User
Sep 4, 2008
15,698
5,293
toronto
I'd add it took Vachon 30 years to get inducted. So I dont understand why people think MAF will be in first ballot, let alone anytime soon after he retires.

MAF does the Fame part of the HOF very well.

Everybody knows and likes MAF. He's getting in pretty quickly I'd bet.
 

Voight

#winning
Feb 8, 2012
40,374
16,649
Mulberry Street
MAF does the Fame part of the HOF very well.

Everybody knows and likes MAF. He's getting in pretty quickly I'd bet.

Meh, hes only famous because of Vegas. I.e. 20 years from now hell be remembered for being Vegas first "major player" i.e. one a lot of fans knew about. Not because he was a great goalie or did anything spectacular.

IMO the "fame" part is more about being famous for accomplishing things rather than just being known.
 

um

Registered User
Sep 4, 2008
15,698
5,293
toronto
Meh, hes only famous because of Vegas. I.e. 20 years from now hell be remembered for being Vegas first "major player" i.e. one a lot of fans knew about. Not because he was a great goalie or did anything spectacular.

IMO the "fame" part is more about being famous for accomplishing things rather than just being known.
There’s been lots of not great but famous players with team accomplishments inducted into the Hall. Just last year it was Kevin Lowe
 

Voight

#winning
Feb 8, 2012
40,374
16,649
Mulberry Street
There’s been lots of not great but famous players with team accomplishments inducted into the Hall. Just last year it was Kevin Lowe

That doesn't mean we should continue the trend.

Anyhow, the standard for goalies is a lot higher than any other position.
 

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