Is Sawchuk Losing His Status as the Greatest Goalie Of All Time?

[puckhead103*]

with all this brodeur talk, i believe sawchuk's greatness as the greatest of them all is being diminished.....

i was born in 1971, so i did not see him play, however by reading books on this goalie, i firmly believe he was the greater one.....

but with brodeur destroying the record books in terms of wins and shutouts, now all experts point to him as the greatest goalie....

i wonder how "great" martin brodeur would have been if he played in high scoring 80's where playing defense was afterthought...

any thoughts...

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[Nalyd Psycho]

I'd say it's always been debated. Sawchuk was never clearly better than Plante, or Hall. And forget Brodeur, Roy and Hasek have been challengers for the title for a while now. Brodeur is just starting to get a look at being mentioned in the same breath as the elite 5.

 

[ck26]

Sawchuk wasn't the greatest of all time after Hall and Roy finished.

And Roy won't be after Brodeur finishes.

And guys like Luongo have a long way to go but are at least off on the right foot.

 

[Ogopogo*]

Hall is the greatest goalie of all time.

 

[Weztex]

Throw those 6 in any order and you have an arguable list.

Roy
Sawchuk
Hall
Plante
Hasek
Brodeur

 

[NOTENOUGHJTCGOALS]

Sawchuk wasn't the greatest of all time after Hall and Roy finished.

And Roy won't be after Brodeur finishes.

And guys like Luongo have a long way to go but are at least off on the right foot.

1 playoff appearance in seven years is hardly the right foot. He's a great goalie and it's not his fault the Panthers were dog turd on ice, but he'll be far behind in career numbers because of it.

 

[Bluesfan1981]

with all this brodeur talk, i believe sawchuk's greatness as the greatest of them all is being diminished.....

You make it sound as if Sawchuk is undoubtly the greatest; Plante, Hall, and Roy are right there with him.

 

[Bluesfan1981]

Hall is the greatest goalie of all time.

And you make it sound as if Hall is undoubtly the greatest; Plante, Sawchuk, and Roy are right there with him.

 

[PecaFan]

Sawchuk was the best I ever saw. Period. Some of his compatriots had a little better numbers. I'm usually a numbers guy. But Sawchuk is the exception.

When Hasek and Roy strap on a phone book on each leg, a mitten for a catching glove and no mask, and demonstrate they can still stop the puck, then they can claim the title.

 

[ColoradoSportsFan]

I still don't buy the arguement that Brodeur will be the greatest after he breaks Roy's wins record....but that's a whole different arguement.

 

[EagleBelfour]

as someone already mentionned, I don't think Sawchuk never had the status of the greatess goaltender of all-time in his pocket. There always been this competion between Plante and him, and the debate will probably never end. Glenn Hall is being trown in the debate also. After that, you had to wait in the 90's to see some other names mentionned: Roy and Hasek. Brodeur is the next on the list, but I still think there's a little gap between him and the top-5, a gap he will fill before the end of his career.

Plante
Sawchuk
Roy
Hasek
Hall
Brodeur

 

[MXD]

with all this brodeur talk, i believe sawchuk's greatness as the greatest of them all is being diminished.....

i was born in 1971, so i did not see him play, however by reading books on this goalie, i firmly believe he was the greater one.....

but with brodeur destroying the record books in terms of wins and shutouts, now all experts point to him as the greatest goalie....

i wonder how "great" martin brodeur would have been if he played in high scoring 80's where playing defense was afterthought...

any thoughts...

... He never had it to begin with.

 

[EagleBelfour]

Thinking about it, the sudden death of Terry Sawchuk in an atrocious way might have overrated is legacy, putting him ahead of Plante or Hall for a certain time. But right now, no one can say he was the clear cut best goaltender of all-time a any time during or after his career.

 

[mcphee]

Throw those 6 in any order and you have an arguable list.

Roy
Sawchuk
Hall
Plante
Hasek
Brodeur

Exactly. I'd argue that any of them were the greatest, and change my mind the next day.

 

[mcphee]

Thinking about it, the sudden death of Terry Sawchuk in an atrocious way might have overrated is legacy, putting him ahead of Plante or Hall for a certain time. But right now, no one can say he was the clear cut best goaltender of all-time a any time during or after his career.

I've spoken to enough people of my Dad's generation that consider him the best they ever saw, and that was before his death. I'm not sure that his death affected the way he's perceived.

 

[Bear of Bad News]

Your thread title implies that Sawchuk was at one point the unquestionable Greatest Goalie Of All Time. That's not necessarily the case.

 

[Barrasso35]

The problem of course is that we're debating goalies from different eras and I just don't think you can do that. You can't compare Sawchuck to Roy or Brodeur because they played during completely different eras with different equipment, team defensive styles, etc.

It's fun to debate but you're never going to have a clearcut "greatest of all time" because there are too many factors.

Besides, no one mentioned Ken Dryden and while he didn't have the best GAA or save %, he does have six Stanley Cups.

 

[pitseleh]

Besides, no one mentioned Ken Dryden and while he didn't have the best GAA or save %, he does have six Stanley Cups.

Agreed about Dryden. Usually people refer to the big five, but I've always felt Dryden deserves to be mentioned in the same breath. Brodeur is on his way to being at that level as well.

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

Agreed about Dryden. Usually people refer to the big five, but I've always felt Dryden deserves to be mentioned in the same breath. Brodeur is on his way to being at that level as well.

Dryden takes a very big hit in regards to longevity. I think Benedict ranks above Dryden. Thing is, any of the top 5-8 goalies (Which includes Dryden) would win 6 cups on those Habs teams.

 

[EagleBelfour]

Agreed about Dryden. Usually people refer to the big five, but I've always felt Dryden deserves to be mentioned in the same breath. Brodeur is on his way to being at that level as well.

If you wanna include Dryden, you have to pur Durnan in the lot too.

 

[JaymzB]

Dryden takes a very big hit in regards to longevity. I think Benedict ranks above Dryden. Thing is, any of the top 5-8 goalies (Which includes Dryden) would win 6 cups on those Habs teams.

I would say they would definitely win 5 cups. The 71 Cup certainly wouldn't be a sure thing for any goalie. Now, perhaps one of the other greatest wouldn't have left for a year due to a contract dispute, and therefore could have gotten a 6th then. I can agree with you on that point.

 

[pitseleh]

Dryden takes a very big hit in regards to longevity. I think Benedict ranks above Dryden. Thing is, any of the top 5-8 goalies (Which includes Dryden) would win 6 cups on those Habs teams.

In terms of hypotheticals though, that's likely the case if you were to supplant the top guys on to any of teams that the top players played for. It's not like the early 50's Wings or the late 50's Canadiens were chopped liver.

 

[Murphy]

In the pre-game last night they were interviewing Hasek and next to his stall was was one for Sawchuk. I didn't know he had been honoured that way.

 

[Nalyd Psycho]

I would say they would definitely win 5 cups. The 71 Cup certainly wouldn't be a sure thing for any goalie. Now, perhaps one of the other greatest wouldn't have left for a year due to a contract dispute, and therefore could have gotten a 6th then. I can agree with you on that point.

Fair enough.

In terms of hypotheticals though, that's likely the case if you were to supplant the top guys on to any of teams that the top players played for. It's not like the early 50's Wings or the late 50's Canadiens were chopped liver.

All of them were good, and any of the greats would likely win about the same amount if transposed. But every other team lost it's edge quicker than the 70's Habs. A goalie who enters at a normal age, born the same year as Dryden, wins 8+ cups with those Habs.

 

[saskganesh]

silly. how come Broduer is now required to play in the "high scoring 80's" to proove his greatness but the corpse of zombie Sawchuck isn't?

your honour, this is the kind of thinking that killed hockey in Cleveland.