Is Katz the most inept owner in pro sports history??

rboomercat90

Registered User
Mar 24, 2013
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Edmonton
But again look at the new arena. Chock full of obc imagery. All the PAST players on the walls in huge murals. Rogers place exists as essentially a new Museum to the old glory years club. That's what the place feels like. Its the whole decoraction of the place, the gretkzy restaurant, etc. Gretz statue relocated. Then think about how much they have sold the new arena or even furthered it being built by having all the OBC in tow, about having Gretz, Mess etc recommend it. This has been the new comfortable home of the OBC since it was built and with many more alumni showing up because theres the all expense paid Katz club etc right in the arena.

Katz and the OBC basically partying when they are here and reminiscing, as old people do. With the current games just on and happening as distraction back drop and hopefully good, but most of these hangers on are having a good time, and for them, its all its about. This is a play team for Katz. A convenient place to party with the orginal team he fancied and partied with in the 80's. Old people often want to turn back the clock like that. heh, I can speak to that.

McBlowe are not still here because of their acumen, obviously, its because they are part of the party. (as sad as that sounds)

The dynamic here with the Oilers is that success corrupts by its nature. By having more success than any other club in modern era the Oilers org were fairly doomed to have alumni hangers on, and hangers on that loved that alumni. Soon as Katz became owner we knew which version of the club he had affinity with. That was never in doubt. In Katz suite its party like its 80's all the time. In new swank surround that was taxpayer fronted. I expect the players themselves all feel he's a little cool for getting these modern digs built so they can all have their little palace to drop by any time like rock stars.
You’re bang on here.
 

Stoneman89

Registered User
Feb 8, 2008
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I'm not really defending him. I'm saying he's a typical sports owner. If anything he's less involved than some owners are.

Katz cares not one bit about the record of the team he owns and that makes him fairly typical too in todays sporting world where money and as much corrolary revenue as possible is the total bottom line.

Its funny, but Slapshot decades ago was allegorical in conveying a sports owner that didn't give two ****s about a club beyond it being an investment but it was a known quantity in ownership that has always been common. As fans we want to believe these people care. yeah, they care about making bucks.

btw there is no proof of the Yakupov rumors and I find it unlikely. Yakupov was not even liked in the Canadian hockey community and especially after his comments during the World Juniors. I really doubt Katz would have gone out of his way to go to bat for a Russian player.
You don’t think he cares about making playoff money?
 

Boom not bust

Registered User
Nov 17, 2018
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Katz wouldn't even be concerned about the kind of performance you are talking about, on ice. His performance is getting a new arena stamped and paid for, getting corrolarly revenue through an Arena district, Having an Edmtonton Tower bankrolled and leased out by the COE and then selling it to an Albert Crown corp already at considerable profit. These are the things that he cares about.

Basically everybody on this board jumped on the Katz train and thought he was great. We'll, he only puts priority on bottom lines typically. The hockey team was only purchased with a view to other asset building. The Edmonton Oilers are Katz pawn. have been from the start. Hardly anybody recognized it.
yeah, the only thing hockey related that he is good at is negotiating rink deals. Oilers fans are the loser and overpay in multiple ways while doing so.
 

Boom not bust

Registered User
Nov 17, 2018
157
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Edmonton
For the most part the reason why Katz has been terrible is nepotism and treating the team like a toy as has been mentioned. He owns the team for his leisure and is more concerned about being friends with and employing his hockey heros when they are clearly not the best qualified. Even when he hires outside of the OBC he is nepotistic, considering only people he already knows through hockey Canada. In hiring 3 GMs I don't think he has done a single competitive job search he just picks a hockey guy he knows and hands them the job. If he was serious about winning he would hold comprehensive job searches for what are the most important positions in determining the success of the organization.
 

Tyrolean

Registered User
Feb 1, 2004
9,625
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Katz is bad that's for sure but it's stupid to say he is the worst unless you give me all the facts comapring him with other bad owners.

Despite his eccentricities, he did save the team from relocating. I'd still rather have this loser team which may have slither of a chance to win the cup than none at all.

If fans really wanted to make the point they would stay away in droves or have a boycott of all things Oiler. That is the only way to get Katz attention. Since this will never happen, no amount of criticism will change the current regime. Only other option is he lets his son or heirs take over as he will never sell this money maker.
 

Stoneman89

Registered User
Feb 8, 2008
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Of course he cares. He is just stupid and arrogant enough to believe Blowe and Crapt will help him get it.
Of course I know he cares. The poster I was questioning said Katz doesn’t care about the record of the team. Last I looked, the record of the team is directly relevant to making the playoffs, and therefore getting playoff revenues. But I agree with your second statement. His methods of obtaining this are warped.
 

Cloned

Begging for Bega
Aug 25, 2003
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Probably not.

He isn't even the most inept owner in NHL history (Harold Ballard, Wirtz, etc.), nor is he even the worst current owner in the NHL (Melnyk).

Then you go across to other sports and run into people like Al Davis, Marge Schott, etc.
 
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Todd from Leduc

Connor “The Next Great One” McDavid
Nov 15, 2017
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Guys relax, we are 4 points out of the playoffs. When we make the playoffs and win the Cup in the current nicest arena in North America this post will not age well.
 

oobga

Tier 2 Fan
Aug 1, 2003
23,179
18,166
But again look at the new arena. Chock full of obc imagery. All the PAST players on the walls in huge murals. Rogers place exists as essentially a new Museum to the old glory years club. That's what the place feels like. Its the whole decoraction of the place, the gretkzy restaurant, etc. Gretz statue relocated. Then think about how much they have sold the new arena or even furthered it being built by having all the OBC in tow, about having Gretz, Mess etc recommend it. This has been the new comfortable home of the OBC since it was built and with many more alumni showing up because theres the all expense paid Katz club etc right in the arena.

Katz and the OBC basically partying when they are here and reminiscing, as old people do. With the current games just on and happening as distraction back drop and hopefully good, but most of these hangers on are having a good time, and for them, its all its about. This is a play team for Katz. A convenient place to party with the orginal team he fancied and partied with in the 80's. Old people often want to turn back the clock like that. heh, I can speak to that.

McBlowe are not still here because of their acumen, obviously, its because they are part of the party. (as sad as that sounds)

The dynamic here with the Oilers is that success corrupts by its nature. By having more success than any other club in modern era the Oilers org were fairly doomed to have alumni hangers on, and hangers on that loved that alumni. Soon as Katz became owner we knew which version of the club he had affinity with. That was never in doubt. In Katz suite its party like its 80's all the time. In new swank surround that was taxpayer fronted. I expect the players themselves all feel he's a little cool for getting these modern digs built so they can all have their little palace to drop by any time like rock stars.

Agree with all that. This may really be a unique situation in the sporting world. Is there another story about an owner that is picking partying with a gang of guys he worshiped 30 years prior over giving his team a proper opportunity to succeed? For over 10 years now he has been ignoring the ineptness of management. Maybe not fully ignoring, he did hire (on the advice of Lowe, as Lowe proudly claimed when things were good in 16/17) a guy that was good at overseeing the creation of winning international teams when he got to pick all the best Canadian players.
 

5 Mins 4 Ftg

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Guys relax, we are 4 points out of the playoffs. When we make the playoffs and win the Cup in the current nicest arena in North America this post will not age well.

We are at the classic is the glass half full or is the glass half empty? 4 points out of a playoff spot. 6 points out of dead last.
The reality is we are without our best defenceman for another 4-5 weeks. Not looking too promising. Also Detroits arena is better...
 

Drivesaitl

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Doesn’t all this make him a bad owner from a fan perspective?

It makes him EXACTLY what I expected. I was shouted out of discussions here for decades for voicing my feelings on what a Katz owner would care about (money) and that the New Arena Deal and Oilers purchase were just adjuncts to much bigger development. But I link things like "Field of Schemes because I've been interested in this pro sports owner dynamic for decades. For around 40-50 years now depending on which sport its become less and less about winning and more about making money through as many corollary income sources as possible.

The trouble is the average fan doesn't care at all about researching these business schemes and seeing what these sports owners are actually, and almost unanimously up to. Its such a shell game its almost like owners have a script. Because it plays out the same everywhere. Complain about current revenues, say its not enough. Get tax money, sponsorship for retrofits of arena to make more money. Pay 1 dollar taxes on Arena. Take over ownership of arena you never built or funded, have cities build you a new arena and threaten to move out of town if they don't. Cite many studies that trump up how much cities benefit from pro sports teams etc.

So Katz is a typical owner. The major thing he could be faulted for is hiring Nicholson who in turn brought in Chiarelli and McLellan. But again this is what the hockey world was essentially telling him to do. These were the guys that were available that came recommended. It all boils down to Nicholson who is not as shrewd a hockey man as people gave him credit for.

Nicholson is a typical mover and shaker. A guy good in a room with a 500 watt smile. The guy that was captain of the football team, track team in highschool and probably valedictorian too. That nature of person often goes into politics. Nicholson chose sports but he's the same species. A populist figurehead. Don't expect him to do much or have the latest well established ideas but he can talk the good talk and spin some good yarns.

When you been following politics, sports, business long enough you recognize a Nicholson. All talk, little substance. Now the one thing I can fault Katz for clearly is not recognizing what nature of manager Nicholson was. I spotted it, and I called it out here a the time of hire. Few did, everybody thought wow what a great hockey man, hockey Canada head, all that. Bob Nicholson has spent a lifetime developing a loved persona. Its no surprise a lot of people initially love him. But Katz should be able to sniff out that beyond the smile and the gladhanding Nicholson ain't much for being a CEO.

However, a Nicholson IS good when it comes to connections. its possible Katz hired him mainly for that. For his built connections with others and world hockey. Katz would have known that Bob Nicholson could land fish like Hlinka Cup, World Juniors, and that Nicholson also had entertainment connections and other international connections. Hiring Nicholson was probably a good use of money, but just not as CEO. In that role you need a Stan with a plan. ;)
 
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Drivesaitl

Finding Hyman
Oct 8, 2017
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I'll cite this one more time because its just interesting reading and its just one of many sources I have been reading for decades on pro sports owners and arena/stadia funding shellgames of pro sports.

Edmonton Oilers | Field of Schemes

Its a searchable and indexed database and for instance I'm linking Edmonton Oilers related stories that have appeared in Field of Schemes here. If interested people can select NHL specific stories as all cities have had fiascos and pro sports owner con games. Basically any major city has been played. Sometimes often. Per Capita Seattle has been played as much as any city and all pro sports doing it. Now hockey is again getting its turn costing Seattle residents money. Oh well, they can afford it..
 

rboomercat90

Registered User
Mar 24, 2013
14,737
8,954
Edmonton
It makes him EXACTLY what I expected. I was shouted out of discussions here for decades for voicing my feelings on what a Katz owner would care about (money) and that the New Arena Deal and Oilers purchase were just adjuncts to much bigger development. But I link things like "Field of Schemes because I've been interested in this pro sports owner dynamic for decades. For around 40-50 years now depending on which sport its become less and less about winning and more about making money through as many corollary income sources as possible.

The trouble is the average fan doesn't care at all about researching these business schemes and seeing what these sports owners are actually, and almost unanimously up to. Its such a shell game its almost like owners have a script. Because it plays out the same everywhere. Complain about current revenues, say its not enough. Get tax money, sponsorship for retrofits of arena to make more money. Pay 1 dollar taxes on Arena. Take over ownership of arena you never built or funded, have cities build you a new arena and threaten to move out of town if they don't. Cite many studies that trump up how much cities benefit from pro sports teams etc.

So Katz is a typical owner. The major thing he could be faulted for is hiring Nicholson who in turn brought in Chiarelli and McLellan. But again this is what the hockey world was essentially telling him to do. These were the guys that were available that came recommended. It all boils down to Nicholson who is not as shrewd a hockey man as people gave him credit for.

Nicholson is a typical mover and shaker. A guy good in a room with a 500 watt smile. The guy that was captain of the football team, track team in highschool and probably valedictorian too. That nature of person often goes into politics. Nicholson chose sports but he's the same species. A populist figurehead. Don't expect him to do much or have the latest well established ideas but he can talk the good talk and spin some good yarns.

When you been following politics, sports, business long enough you recognize a Nicholson. All talk, little substance. Now the one thing I can fault Katz for clearly is not recognizing what nature of manager Nicholson was. I spotted it, and I called it out here a the time of hire. Few did, everybody thought wow what a great hockey man, hockey Canada head, all that. Bob Nicholson has spent a lifetime developing a loved persona. Its no surprise a lot of people initially love him. But Katz should be able to sniff out that beyond the smile and the gladhanding Nicholson ain't much for being a CEO.

However, a Nicholson IS good when it comes to connections. its possible Katz hired him mainly for that. For his built connections with others and world hockey. Katz would have known that Bob Nicholson could land fish like Hlinka Cup, World Juniors, and that Nicholson also had entertainment connections and other international connections. Hiring Nicholson was probably a good use of money, but just not as CEO. In that role you need a Stan with a plan. ;)
All these things are true and I’ve been arguing on your side in that respect since I’ve been on this board. The thing is though is that they are true for pretty much every single owner in professional sports yet few of them have an on ice or on field record as dismal as Katz does. He is indeed a special case of ineptitude.
 

Stoneman89

Registered User
Feb 8, 2008
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If the question refers to the on ice product and performance only, Katz has to at least be considered, given the length of time his teams have blown chunks.
 

Da McBomb

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Remember when Katz was aiming for the Oilers to be Cup contenders by the time they moved into Rogers Place?

Yah still waiting....
 
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Stoneman89

Registered User
Feb 8, 2008
27,423
21,831
Remember when Katz was aiming for the Oilers to be Cup contenders by the time they moved into Roger's Place?

Yah still waiting....
At this rate, we'll be lucky to be contenders by the time they close the building.
 

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