Is Jon Cooper our weakest link?

[Nautica54]

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[gg720fla]

Well, I guess they will be both fired together next year if BB thinks Cooper is the answer to fix this team. I can't wait for next season to see the changes to our roster by our coach.

 

[DFC]

What does a red hot seat even mean in this case?

The team is talented enough to sleepwalk into the playoffs next year. So essentially hes gonna be judged again in the playoffs next year? So we are going to go the same rout in the playoffs next year and risk another year of age with this core? That sounds insane.

Pretty much, yeah. I think until he shows some playoff success, he's in trouble. But it wouldn't be shocking if the team struggles in the regular season next year because they themselves don't believe it means anything, kind of like us.

 

[DFC]

"My faith in Jon Cooper has not waived at all. We may not have won a Cup with him yet. If I hadn't re-signed Coop before playoffs, I'd be looking to re-sign him now"

Julien BriseBois

This is a problem.

 

[Cmac66]

I’m literally minutes into the press conference and I am already losing faith, please tell me it gets better later on in the video.

 

[DFC]

I'll accept Cooper returning if we change the fabric of the locker room. I can accept a coach who is quiet, laid back and hands off. That shouldn't sentence a team to playoff damnation every year. A fire and brimstone captain paired with coach like Cooper is a good balance in my eyes even vice versa. Coach is a hard ass? A captain who refuses to let it shake him and he stays cool and carries coach's message is a good balance too. As long as one guy of authority HATES losing and rallies the boys I'm happy. I just think too much of the same attitude is toxic. A coaching staff and team full of fire and brimstone is sometimes a team that doesn't know how to be calm in the storm. I don't always like that either but it can be productive.

Sadly this is what we have. It shows a painful lack of leadership and complacency and it pissed me off to no end to see Stamkos acting like this too. Your captain is your buffer between coach and team.

Wanna keep Cooper? Fine. But Stamkos can no longer be our captain. He has shadowed Cooper long enough and it makes me sick

There's too much of the same personality and it's made us weak

I don't think emotion has much to do with it. But I do think there HAS to be a segment of the locker room (and Stamkos seems to be chief among them) who believe Cooper can't get them "over the hump," to use T-Rex and some others' term. There were points in this series where the team appeared to be frustrated and/or have quit.

I do think a team like this could probably use more of a hard@$$ coach. I don't think it matters who the captain is, but a team who relies on smallish finesse players would probably do better with somebody who's going to crack a whip on them when they need it.

 

[Rschmitz]

According to JBB we just "slumped at the wrong time"

Our fanbase needs some red meat and instead JBB gives us this shit. HAHAHAHAHAHA

All of you hoping that the team loses enough to spurn changes are going to be chronically disappointed, this a very smug and fat organization content with itself.

 

[MattM92]

According to JBB we just "slumped at the wrong time"

Our fanbase needs some red meat and instead JBB gives us this ****. HAHAHAHAHAHA

All of you hoping that the team loses enough to spurn changes are going to be chronically disappointed, this a very smug and fat organization content with itself.

The exit interviews have been depressing, for sure.

I was utterly convinced that the humiliation of a sweep would HAVE to bring some changes. ANY changes. I thought there was no way the organization could stand pat having lost 6 straight playoff games.

Clearly, I was wrong.

 

[Lord Stan 2020]

well if is true stevie didnt want the deal done and at least some of the clubhouse was not with it then jbb has no option but to play the damage control card...

can this team win the cup moving forward of course.... will they will cooper I do not have hmmm belief he can get it done myself and everyone knows me you all do who have known me last 3-4 years I have never felt this way ever.... I am sad moving forward honestly yes its still bitter the end etc... but I have zero belief in cooper getting us the cup zero honestly by the crap show we saw on ice when it mattered... yep vasy injured explains a little dom coming back from injury explains a little more we dont get all the tidbits so no one knows how healthy dom was and that was the one big move we coulda tried but the offense never came to play never.... that is super concerning honestly good enough to outscore anyone in this league we saw it all year

a slump??? wth at the wrong time? ehem cheese and rice and what was cooper saying we couldnt find our game???that is prep dammit...

anyway love you all really sad right now and not calling for coopers or anyones head but I dont have much belief in him at this point.... and now i got to question jbb honestly which really sucks...

 

[Bolt 45]

I can't help but wonder if Yzerman's decision to take a step back had anything to do with the kind of nonsense we're seeing from the organization right now.

 

[LightningStrikes]

Fire JBB!

 

[Todd1a]

I can't help but wonder if Yzerman's decision to take a step back had anything to do with the kind of nonsense we're seeing from the organization right now.

Well I guess brisebois and cooper are going to get fired one day together so we keep riding the dead horse in Jon cooper ?

 

[Todd1a]

well if is true stevie didnt want the deal done and at least some of the clubhouse was not with it then jbb has no option but to play the damage control card...

can this team win the cup moving forward of course.... will they will cooper I do not have hmmm belief he can get it done myself and everyone knows me you all do who have known me last 3-4 years I have never felt this way ever.... I am sad moving forward honestly yes its still bitter the end etc... but I have zero belief in cooper getting us the cup zero honestly by the crap show we saw on ice when it mattered... yep vasy injured explains a little dom coming back from injury explains a little more we dont get all the tidbits so no one knows how healthy dom was and that was the one big move we coulda tried but the offense never came to play never.... that is super concerning honestly good enough to outscore anyone in this league we saw it all year

a slump??? wth at the wrong time? ehem cheese and rice and what was cooper saying we couldnt find our game???that is prep dammit...

anyway love you all really sad right now and not calling for coopers or anyones head but I dont have much belief in him at this point.... and now i got to question jbb honestly which really sucks...

They could go 82-0 next year and I’m still not going to have faith in them winning a cup until I see they play in the playoffs next year .

 

[Bolt 45]

Well I guess brisebois and cooper are going to get fired one day together so we keep riding the dead horse in Jon cooper ?

I guess so. SMH.

 

[These Are The Days]

I don't think emotion has much to do with it. But I do think there HAS to be a segment of the locker room (and Stamkos seems to be chief among them) who believe Cooper can't get them "over the hump," to use T-Rex and some others' term. There were points in this series where the team appeared to be frustrated and/or have quit.

I do think a team like this could probably use more of a hard@$$ coach. I don't think it matters who the captain is, but a team who relies on smallish finesse players would probably do better with somebody who's going to crack a whip on them when they need it.

You're not wrong about any of this. My desire roster turnover is twofold for bigger players and different attitude. It is kinda hard to not reference Scotty (62 wins and all) but he could do anything he wanted because Yzerman couldn't be shook. Not by his coach, press, previous reputation of failure or playing on one freaking leg. He is the definition of iron will. Stamkos does not strike me as that kind of person. I don't know who he is behind closed doors but the stereotypical "aw shucks" attitude that is sometimes attributed to Canadians seems real with him and I seriously wonder how he'd handle a guy like Tortorella clamping down on him. I'm ad libbing based on the one rant I've actually seen but I wouldn't be surprised if Torts would probably point to him during the 2nd intermission of an ass whooping and say "This is what you're all playing like. Like f***ing shit! Steven! Get yourself and your team ready to play! Do your job captain! Or do I use the term loosely? Show me you're better than this. I know you are! But do you? f***ing figure it out!!" So much of the reason I want a change in captaincy is because I honestly don't know how Stamkos would hold up to that and I can't prove Cooper doesn't just chew gum and say "aw shucks" between lashes like that one. I hope he doesn't because that means Cooper isn't reaching his team.

Based on what I heard, stuff like was another day in the office for Scotty. He had the captain he needed to succeed in Detroit becuase Yzerman answered by dominating. I'm not certain about Cooper any more than I am Stamkos now. We could get bigger up front but if Stamkos keeps playing like a scolded dog it isn't gonna mean much. I'm very disheartened by everyone's performance.

I don't need to know people are yelling to be happy. I need to know this group grasps the fact that their window will close in a few years and their prime years will go with it. The only assumption I'm comfortable in making is that the team gave Cooper an endorsement because I don't think he'd be here if they had not.

 

[Hoek]

Doubtful Yzerman left because of this. He was the one in the position to do something about it. Not like Vinik was going to stop him.

 

[PJ817]

Did anyone catch Killer's comments on what people are saying about historic choking?

"Let them say whatever they want. We don't care."

Yep, Killer, that last sentence was VERY clear; don't care about the playoffs, don't care what people think, don't care what people do, don't care what people say, don't care that your fans are disgusted, don't care...

 

[Sky04]

Did anyone catch Killer's comments on what people are saying about historic choking?

"Let them say whatever they want. We don't care."

Yep, Killer, that last sentence was VERY clear; don't care about the playoffs, don't care what people think, don't care what people do, don't care what people say, don't care that your fans are disgusted, don't care...

Talk about overanalyzing LOL

 

[Its a Bolts Life]

Talk about overanalyzing LOL

Yea, That is reading way to much into that bit of his comment.

 

[DaBolts]

Is Jon Cooper our weakest link?

Does a bear....

 

[DFC]

You're not wrong about any of this. My desire roster turnover is twofold for bigger players and different attitude. It is kinda hard to not reference Scotty (62 wins and all) but he could do anything he wanted because Yzerman couldn't be shook. Not by his coach, press, previous reputation of failure or playing on one freaking leg. He is the definition of iron will. Stamkos does not strike me as that kind of person. I don't know who he is behind closed doors but the stereotypical "aw shucks" attitude that is sometimes attributed to Canadians seems real with him and I seriously wonder how he'd handle a guy like Tortorella clamping down on him. I'm ad libbing based on the one rant I've actually seen but I wouldn't be surprised if Torts would probably point to him during the 2nd intermission of an ass whooping and say "This is what you're all playing like. Like ****ing ****! Steven! Get yourself and your team ready to play! Do your job captain! Or do I use the term loosely? Show me you're better than this. I know you are! But do you? ****ing figure it out!!" So much of the reason I want a change in captaincy is because I honestly don't know how Stamkos would hold up to that and I can't prove Cooper doesn't just chew gum and say "aw shucks" between lashes like that one. I hope he doesn't because that means Cooper isn't reaching his team.

You're mistaken on Yzerman not being shook. Yzerman credits Bowman for his change into a two-way player. Pierre McGuire tells a story about Bowman shaming an unnamed player (who's clearly Yzerman) in front of his teammates, basically saying he played for personal stats more than team wins, and that was the catalyst for Yzerman being the iron-willed guy you're talking about. But that's not to say you're wrong--just clearing up that one thing. As good as those Red Wings teams were, Bowman's role can't be understated. He took a group of star players and made them play like cogs in a machine.

But yeah, Stamkos doesn't seem to be that guy. But comparing anybody in the league to Yzerman when it comes to will and determination just isn't fair. Detroit's trainer in those days said something along the lines of Yzerman not feeling pain the way a normal human does, because he shouldn't have been able to play through injuries like he did, and as well as he did, and his teammates always took inspiration from that. (More than a few of them have talked about how you couldn't in good conscience watch Yzerman come into a lockerroom on crutches, lace up skates, and then not go out and give 100% yourself.)

But that's why Yzerman was a top player in history. Stamkos, Kucherov, Point, and on and on, all have the opportunity/potential to go down as top players, but it won't have to be based on something so strange as pain tolerance. But I mean, this is why I think a lot of the criticism of Stamkos is unfair, because they don't realize Yzerman's leadership, same with a lot of "great" leaders, wasn't about screaming at his team. Everybody just assumes all great captains must have a little Mark Messier in them, but I don't think that's true. Leadership comes in different forms, and there's no better example of that than Yzerman.

Maybe this team does need somebody to scream at them. I've always thought there's still a place in the league for a hard@$$ coach, especially when you're dealing with star players. Maybe it even needs a new captain--Stamkos was made captain at 24, and I think we all thought he would grow into the role, but he's not a guy who looks like a leader on the ice, even when he's playing well.

Based on what I heard, stuff like was another day in the office for Scotty. He had the captain he needed to succeed in Detroit becuase Yzerman answered by dominating. I'm not certain about Cooper any more than I am Stamkos now. We could get bigger up front but if Stamkos keeps playing like a scolded dog it isn't gonna mean much. I'm very disheartened by everyone's performance.

When Stamkos scored in Game 4, it kind of disheartened me, because it felt like a frustration goal. He beat two players on his own and then fired a shot top shelf. Great individual efforts are nice, but not a recipe for success.

I don't need to know people are yelling to be happy. I need to know this group grasps the fact that their window will close in a few years and their prime years will go with it. The only assumption I'm comfortable in making is that the team gave Cooper an endorsement because I don't think he'd be here if they had not.

I think sometimes we fans underestimate just how much players care. This is a thing they've dedicated their lives to. Many of them took less money to play in TB for the chance to win. It just always seems to me when fans are questioning effort level, it's usually based on how many pucks are going in, or how well things are going for a team.

The players may well have given Cooper an endorsement. Or maybe they didn't. I just think the optics of a rookie GM firing a 62 win coach were too much for JB to swallow, so he's going to be a little more patient with it. I mean, yeah, those of us who believe coaching is, and has been, a major problem for this team, aren't going to be happy with it. But the hockey world outside of TB, even if they believe Coop underperformed, would likely be shocked if he were fired after tying an NHL record in the regular season.

It's troubling to me that Todd Richards had to go in and fix both of our special teams while Cooper has been here the entire time. I can only imagine what that means for the 5v5 system, especially when coming up against a trap. Washington really did write the blueprint on how to beat us, or maybe even Babcock back in 2015.

 

[DaBolts]

If Richards were our head coach, I think we are still playing DFC, I really do.

 

[Bolt 45]

Did anyone catch Killer's comments on what people are saying about historic choking?

"Let them say whatever they want. We don't care."

Yep, Killer, that last sentence was VERY clear; don't care about the playoffs, don't care what people think, don't care what people do, don't care what people say, don't care that your fans are disgusted, don't care...

I mean, I get what he's saying, but, yeah, the reality is that they sure didn't look like they cared when there was still time to do something about it. Unfortunate choice of words.

 

[Hockey4Life91]

This is a problem.

I told everyone: they rose together. And both their comments during the Yzerman announced revealed a mutual affection. JBB’s recent comment is a prime example. How can the utter disaster not have raised any concerns?

 

[JoVel]

Did anyone catch Killer's comments on what people are saying about historic choking?

"Let them say whatever they want. We don't care."

Yep, Killer, that last sentence was VERY clear; don't care about the playoffs, don't care what people think, don't care what people do, don't care what people say, don't care that your fans are disgusted, don't care...

Why not continue the list? We don't care about world hunger. We don't care about the poor...

He said they don't care what people think, that's it.