Zetterberg4Captain
Registered User
Who was arguing he is a true #1?
nobody specifically thats why i didnt quote anyone
just a generalized post
nothing more
Who was arguing he is a true #1?
The exact same lies you hear him say every off-season.
Parity
Cleary is a leader in the locker room
Talks about youth movement and how much he is pushing for it.
I can't believe i am going to have to spend another year complaining about the exact same things.
I normally find you very pessimistic, but this is very accurate. He went back to the washed-out veterans last season after the excellent showing by the youngsters in 2013, and I have no faith that he won't do the exact same thing again. It's fortunate that Bertuzzi and Samuelsson are gone, as that's two less veterans for him to coddle and drool over, but it's entirely possible that Cleary will make the team on his "intangibles."
That said, Malik was of the opinion that Holland was simply unwilling to admit that he signed Cleary because of a promise.
Holland sounds really defensive, it is not becoming of him.
He is basically saying it in the only way that doesn't turn the NHL at least unhappy about it. Hey we said we would get something done and we did, promise goes into the did they talk numbers, did they cap circumvent area? His words are placed to avoid that, even if the NHL really set a precedent by letting that slide with Alfie, but my guess is a memo went out from both the NHL and NHLPA about hey lets be careful how we talk about this.
I don't like that they did it, but it isn't hard to see why they are wording it the way they are, both Holland and Babcock have put it right on the edge of where expounding on it isn't all that necessary and likely would draw the ire of the league. Cleary has likely been advised similarly to not speak out of turn on it and will be bland in his explanation as well when camp rolls around.
The NHL should go on a witch hunt and nix that contract, damnit.
I mean it is publicly circumventing the cap, shouldn't be that hard to crack down.
Maybe I will write a letter lol.
He kind of pointed out that Cleary was signed for a leadership role. "We need people who can speak and lead with an example, on and off the ice. And who will want to be at Detroit."
Mark my words Holland will get another 5 years.
He's safe until the wheels come completely off. He's got more goodwill stored up than any GM in the league. They keep making the playoffs and they keep drafting well, so I don't think we're all that close to wheels flying off.
Good version Cleary is extinct. His type hasn't been seen on the ice since 2011. By the 2nd half of the 11-12 season it was a hot topic on here how much his game had deteriorated. One of our respected posters SoupNazi started a thread about buying him out back then.
In 12-13 he was awful. Not bad, but awful. Statistically speaking (advanced stats combined) he was basically our worst forward yet was getting prime time minutes in the top 6 and on the PP. Every line that he played on was worse with him.
Last season he was just as awful. And Babcock still gave him prime roles. Anything other than the press box was too good for how his game was. Babcock has come out since then and admitted that Cleary brought nothing. Yet he still spoon fed him valuable special teams time for the first half of last season as we're fighting for our playoff lives.
2+ years in a row he's been awful and yet he's given new contracts two years in a row.
How can we trust anything Holland or Babcock say? The fact that he got another contract is beyond ridiculous. A PTO at best would have been more than generous. No other player in the history of Ken Holland has received this type of treatment. And why in the world should be be so certain that Babcock, who was quoted last season saying that "there is no bigger fan of Dan Cleary", wouldn't be biased when it comes to Cleary's chances of seeing the ice? Are we just going to ignore everything that has happened in the past?
The fact that we are even talking about him as a roster player in 14-15 is incomprehensible. It's absolutely ridiculous.
You still are ignoring that off-ice effect our management sees in Cleary. He was signed to be a team leader. They see these veterans important for the perfect youth movement. They will mentor to be a better next Red Wings generation.
There is just more than those on-ice efforts in a hockey franchise in our management believes.
But they also give on-ice chance for Cleary to bounce back, but nothing isn't guaranteed anymore.
Sorry, but without details anyone can say they heard anything.
Then hire him as an assistant or something.
You don't spend millions and take a roster spot for a player that is that bad because he's a good leader.
Exactly Bench, As long as we continue to make the playoffs and draft well. The Illitch family will be happy and that's all that matters.
Aren't making the playoffs and drafting well two of the main things you want from your GM?
Again and again, he is a good leader in the lockerroom, AND they believe he can bounce back with healthy knees. So there's the off-ice value and optimistic on-ice value on the board what Cleary could offer. It could be a failure, if he can't get his knees going, but then he is benched again and kids will play. What an end of the world.
You are still writing him off based on your mutual "fact" that you know for 100% sure Cleary is done and can never help this team again. Our organization thinks it othervise and it's just funny how some outsider can believe knowing things better at this kind of messageboard than the guys in our lockerroom/front office.
Again and again, he is a good leader in the lockerroom, AND they believe he can bounce back with healthy knees. So there's the off-ice value and optimistic on-ice value on the board what Cleary could offer. It could be a failure, if he can't get his knees going, but then he is benched again and kids will play. What an end of the world.
You are still writing him off based on your mutual "fact" that you know for 100% sure Cleary is done and can never help this team again. Our organization thinks it othervise and it's just funny how some outsider can believe knowing things better at this kind of messageboard than the guys in our lockerroom/front office.
Aren't making the playoffs and drafting well two of the main things you want from your GM?
what good is drafting well if you're too afraid to play the prospects? what good is making the Playoffs if you aren't good enough to win it all?
drafting well and making the Playoffs are just a means to an end,it's the next step where Holland falls apart