Blue Jays Discussion: Thank you, Gibby!

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zeke

The Dube Abides
Mar 14, 2005
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McKinney's BB and K rates have always been solid in the minors.

eh. he started off well but steadily deteriorated as he moved up.

McKinney

A+: 12.1b%, 16.9k%
AA: 10.9b%, 17.6k%
AAA: 7.2bb%, 22.8k%
MLB: 7.1bb%, 25.7k%

there's probably not a good reason to think he'll improve substantially on those AAA/MLB rates going forward.

that stands in contrast to the other guys I mentioned:

Tellez

A+: 9.5b%, 18.9k%
AA: 12.3b%, 17.9k%
AAA: 9.2b%, 17.8k%
MLB: 1.9b%, 25.0k%

(probably a good reason to think his mlb numbers will improve here)

Jansen

A+: 8.5b%, 15.3k%
AA: 10.5b%, 9.1k%
AAA: 12.6b%, 12.8k%
MLB: 9.2b%, 14.9k%

Good mlb numbers not surprising here.

Vladdy

A+: 16.9b%, 13.2k%
AA: 7.9b%, 10.2k%
AAA: 11.7b%, 7.8k%

Awesome.
 

Discoverer

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Apr 11, 2012
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eh. he started off well but steadily deteriorated as he moved up.

McKinney

A+: 12.1b%, 16.9k%
AA: 10.9b%, 17.6k%
AAA: 7.2bb%, 22.8k%
MLB: 7.1bb%, 25.7k%

there's probably not a good reason to think he'll improve substantially on those AAA/MLB rates going forward.

He had a 4.0% walk rate in his first stint in AAA and it's 9.3% this year. Considering his history, it seems like last year was an outlier rather than just steady deterioration. I see a 9.3% BB rate and 23.9% K rate as perfectly acceptable. They're certainly not Vlad/Jansen/Rowdy levels, but I think he safely sits somewhere between "great" and "bad".
 
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deletethis

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Mar 17, 2015
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Considering Lind has hit 200 HR and a .272 career average, I'd be happy if Tellez was Lind 2.0

Lind-like would be a super positive outcome considering that Lind was a better minor leaguer than Tellez at most levels including the AAA level.

Lind's career numbers shouldn't be overvalued. He was a LF/1B/DH type. In the modern MLB, his career seems to be about the bare minimum for the average version of that type of major leaguer.
 

deletethis

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Mar 17, 2015
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Toronto has a vertible horde of average-ish position players who will be cheap for the upcoming years.

That's not a small thing. Plenty of contending teams have a group of stars and no depth. So its a good position to be in if you can add some stars to put in front of the mid-listers. The problem is getting genuine star players is one of the harder things to do. The hope would be that this prospect pool can deliver that. A big group of 2ish WAR players is great around a core of 4+ WAR guys, but is ineffectual on their own.


I hope this is true. Average performing position players across the board with a great pitching staff can win it all. It does seem like the Blue Jays are going to be able to cobble together a decent lineup for the "best of" many outfield and infield possibilities that are currently owned. It's also promising that for the first time since the late 1970's (yes that long ago) there appears to be a surplus major league catching prospects in the organization.
 

stickty111

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Jan 23, 2017
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Josh is such a baby.
Great decision by Shatkins to let him go. Management has been terrific.
 

Mach85

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Mar 14, 2013
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I'm not bothered by that quote. They're often taken out of context. Josh is on record as to how much he loved it here, and by all accounts wanted to be here long term. It could be as simple as he was asked what's different between Toronto and Cleveland and that's the obvious answer, and it's not him ripping on Toronto.
 

Discoverer

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Apr 11, 2012
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If you believe Blair then the Braves approached the Jays about a Martin-Kemp swap before dealing Kemp to the Dodgers.

That wouldn't be the least bit surprising considering Martin had way more value than Kemp in the offseason. Of course the Braves would have tried to trade him for a player who can provide something of value before settling on a pure salary-based move.
 

TheMadHatTrick

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Nov 2, 2008
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I'm not bothered by that quote. They're often taken out of context. Josh is on record as to how much he loved it here, and by all accounts wanted to be here long term. It could be as simple as he was asked what's different between Toronto and Cleveland and that's the obvious answer, and it's not him ripping on Toronto.

I'm really sickened by the need to trash players no longer with the team in order to seemingly white knight for management.
 

canucksfan

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Mar 16, 2002
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I'm not bothered by that quote. They're often taken out of context. Josh is on record as to how much he loved it here, and by all accounts wanted to be here long term. It could be as simple as he was asked what's different between Toronto and Cleveland and that's the obvious answer, and it's not him ripping on Toronto.

Exactly
 

TheMadHatTrick

Registered User
Nov 2, 2008
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I don't even think Shatkins have earned the whiteknighting yet either. Just really bad trades.

I think white knighting for management is a stupid exercise regardless. I don't care if it's Theo Epstein. If a guy makes a move I don't like I'm gonna say something. I have no loyalty to management.
 
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phillipmike

Registered User
Oct 27, 2009
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That wouldn't be the least bit surprising considering Martin had way more value than Kemp in the offseason. Of course the Braves would have tried to trade him for a player who can provide something of value before settling on a pure salary-based move.

Even after these seasons Martin still has more value than Kemp. Unless the Braves were throwing in prospects or sizeable salary relief it made no sense for the Jays.
 

deletethis

Registered User
Mar 17, 2015
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Toronto
It seems to me that Donaldson is slagging his ex-teammates as much as his former GM. What a real mensch. His next contract keeps getting smaller and shorter with each uttered word of pure genius. It would be sweet irony if Cleveland decided to leave Donaldson off their playoff roster due to poor performance.
 

BertCorbeau

F*ck cancer - RIP Fugu and Buffaloed
Jan 6, 2012
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oh yay we're hating all our stars again becuz shatkins.

Josh is such a baby.
Great decision by Shatkins to let him go. Management has been terrific.

tenor.gif
 
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