Is Colorado really that far off from being Edmonton?

[DoubleDouble*]

We can all agree that they have a better top 6 for D, and I prefer their forward depth and goaltending.

However, I don't think there is as large as a gap in reality than we may think. They've drafted 1st, 2nd or 3rd overall in 3 of the last 6 drafts. This year, they could draft within 1 or 2 spots of Edmonton again.

Edmonton has not climbed out of the basement at all, but Colorado seems to be a team that is given a free pass, even though they have been in the lottery %50 of the time over the last 6 years.

Florida and Tampa Bay are the only two teams other than Edmonton that have seen recurring picks in the top 3 over the last 6 years.

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[Smart Dunsparce*]

I never understand why they are never held to the same standard of the Oilers. They are the Edmonton Oilers just in Denver.

 

[Pirate King Luffy]

I never understand why they are never held to the same standard of the Oilers. They are the Edmonton Oilers just in Denver.

Yes. But in that time they did what the Oilers didn't do. Cleaned up the coaching staff, management and made playoffs. Even without Stastny they are the better team.

 

[Muston Atthews]

I never understand why they are never held to the same standard of the Oilers. They are the Edmonton Oilers just in Denver.

Considering they were 2nd in the West last year and made the playoffs last year... that's why they aren't held to the same standard

 

[maroon 6]

They just made the playoffs last year. No where near Edmonton bad.

 

[Vegeta]

I never understand why they are never held to the same standard of the Oilers. They are the Edmonton Oilers just in Denver.

....did Edmonton make the playoffs last year without my knowledge?

 

[Sojourn]

Making the playoffs last season probably contributes to that, but more than that I think the general opinion is that they were heading in the right direction, and were making the changes necessary to turn things around. That being said, it's not accurate to say they weren't criticized. They absolutely were.

I think a lot of the criticism regarding the Oilers is that it doesn't feel like they are making the changes necessary. The only ones who seem unsatisfied are the fans, and then you get management coming out talking about their Cup wins, how the team looks better visually(and yes, I'm paraphrasing and trying to add to the ridiculousness of it all, but it is still ridiculous), and other nonsense that doesn't actually seem to say much of anything.

 

[Sansbacon]

They just made the playoffs last year. No where near Edmonton bad.

And then immediately dropped to the bottom of the league the following year. With McDavid/Eichel on the top of the board. Same talent... top pick. McEichel.

Ohhhhh I get it now.

 

[DoubleDouble*]

I understand they were great last year, but they are not good this year, and you have to wonder if last year really was a abnormality, akin to the Leafs somehow making the playoffs and taking the Bruins to 7 a few years ago, when they really didn't play very well.

 

[DoubleDouble*]

....did Edmonton make the playoffs last year without my knowledge?

Honestly, though. Is one year of playoffs enough to shrug off 3/6 lottery picks? Especially considering they are trending towards another lottery pick.

 

[Scouter]

I never understand why they are never held to the same standard of the Oilers. They are the Edmonton Oilers just in Denver.

Hmm, I'm not sure, but maybe it's the fact they have a division title, but I've no idea really.

 

[Nihiliste]

Avs finishes the last 6 years: 28, 14, 29, 19, 29, 3.
Oilers finishes the last 6 years. 21, 30, 30, 29, 24, 28.

While the Avs clearly haven't been good either, in that time they've turned over their coaching and management group and made trades for a starting goalie and top pairing dman. There are also two playoff appearances during that time. While they're pretty bipolar with the way they drop down to lottery level every year, they're at least trying to improve and they typically play hard (other than the first part of this season).

 

[Extra Texture]

You're right about the drafting record. Colorado has had alot of high picks, and it did take them a while to finally take the next step when translating potential into winning.

However, I think there are a few important differences. Firstly, they got a taste of the playoffs to whet the appetite of some of their young stars in 2010. That team had Stastny (who had already stepped up among the Avs old guard, and proven he had star-potential), ROR, Duchene, Galiardi, etc and it looked to me like the basis for a good team that needed time to mature. Getting a taste of winning early probably helped alot.

Secondly, they never got mired in the same old boys club that is going on in Edmonton. Losing cost both Giguere and Granato their jobs. They didnt get recycled by the organization in the hopes that things would turn around. People paid for failure with their jobs, and maybe that is all thats needed to prove a point to everyone in the organization.

I would say they could serve as an example to the Oilers, because they never made a big "shake up" trade to change things (unless you count Shattenkirk for EJ), but clearly the differences more than superficial.

And yeah, I'm sure if last year hadnt happened, and the Avs wound up with another lottery pick, people would be putting them in the same bracket. The fact that they turned into a juggernaut seemingly overnight obviously changed perceptions.

 

[DoubleDouble*]

Avs finishes the last 6 years: 28th, 14th, 29th, 19th, 29th, 3rd.
Oilers finishes the last 6 years. 21st, 30th, 30th, 29th, 24th, 28th.

While the Avs clearly haven't been good either, in that time they've turned over their coaching and management group and made trades for a starting goalie and top pairing dman. While they're pretty bipolar with the way they drop down to lottery level every year, they're at least trying to improve and they typically play hard (other than the first part of this season).

I feel like this actually makes me feel more like they are close to Edmonton. That 3rd looks a little flukey.

I hope they make the playoffs personally, a lot of young players on that team that I like, I will just be amazed if they draft top 5 again and people blow it off. They are closer to Florida and Edmonton than I've ever really considered.

 

[Siludin]

Gretzky and Messier just need to return to Edmonton and draft McDavid and make the playoffs despite any statistical reasoning and we have Colorado 2.0

 

[Nihiliste]

I would say they could serve as an example to the Oilers, because they never made a big "shake up" trade to change things (unless you count Shattenkirk for EJ), but clearly the differences more than superficial.

Stewart/Shattenkirk for EJ was a pretty big shakeup at the time. Trading picks for Varlamov weeks after finishing 29th was ballsy too. They also did pretty systematically trade away a number of players whom they saw as troublesome, and sold high on most of them; Stewart, Wolski, Galiardi, Quincey, Jones, O'brien et al. That was important for improving the culture around the team.

 

[Nona Di Giuseppe]

Honestly, though. Is one year of playoffs enough to shrug off 3/6 lottery picks? Especially considering they are trending towards another lottery pick.

Yes.

 

[Pirate King Luffy]

Honestly, though. Is one year of playoffs enough to shrug off 3/6 lottery picks? Especially considering they are trending towards another lottery pick.

They actually made it twice.

 

[badtakemachine]

Edmonton is in a league of their own.

 

[Nihiliste]

I feel like this actually makes me feel more like they are close to Edmonton. That 3rd looks a little flukey.

I hope they make the playoffs personally, a lot of young players on that team that I like, I will just be amazed if they draft top 5 again and people blow it off. They are closer to Florida and Edmonton than I've ever really considered.

I mean certainly those are three teams that have been rebuilding around the same time. If the observation is simply that these teams all have multiple lottery picks in the last 5 years then I'm not sure what your point is. Edmonton isn't ridiculed because they're rebuilding, they're ridiculed because of the way they're rebuilding. I wouldn't group Florida post-Tallon in with them either, he's been steadily amassing good young talent through the draft.

 

[TheAngryHank]

Oilers are in Canada and the Broncos are winning...

Not a lot of focus on the Avalanche.

 

[Vegeta]

They actually made it twice.

Not to mention they haven't had the pleasure of drafting first overall three consecutive years.

 

[Drury_Sakic]

They are still heading in the right direction, even though the loss of Stastny hurt. Iggy has been as advertised though which helps.

The team attempted to address its major weaknesses from last year, depth on the bottom two lines and a D core that was soft, by adding Winchester and Stuart. Winchester, by all rights, would have made the 4th line better but has been injured. Stuart, also injured a good while now, while not a #2/3 D man that I think Roy and Sakic had hoped, has actually been better than he has been given credit for. Injuries, for the most part, have nullified the moves made this summer.

Briere was largely a long term play for cap space -- but has actually been decent at times.

Another factor here is injuries to other depth players. Mitchell --- for all the **** he has taken in good nature from Avs fans --- is hugely important for the teams depth and has been hurt. Bords, while not a great player, is another depth forward that has missed all the season. The Avs also signed a few longer shot depth forwards for AHL/NHL call ups that also have been injured for chunks of the season.....it was bad enough at one point I think they called up 4 AHL forwards and 1 AHL D man to play in one game that no one really thought would be given chances this year because of injuries. I would not be shocked if the Avs lead the league in man games lost to injury this year.

Add that to the D that was already known to be a weakness and a slow start by O'Reilly and Mac. --- well --- you get the current spot in the standings...not to mention Varly being injured, though Pickard has made goaltending hardly the Avs most pressing issue by playing outstanding hockey.

If the Avs can get healthy on the bottom 6 and get a bit more puck luck, I am still confident they will make the playoffs, or at the least be in the race until the end. If you doubt a healthy bottom six does not make all the difference in Denver, look at the playoffs last year with Mitchell out...and it is more of the same this year.

 

[Nona Di Giuseppe]

I feel like this actually makes me feel more like they are close to Edmonton. That 3rd looks a little flukey.

I hope they make the playoffs personally, a lot of young players on that team that I like, I will just be amazed if they draft top 5 again and people blow it off. They are closer to Florida and Edmonton than I've ever really considered.

The total number of spots Colorado has had on Edmonton is 40 and has an average of 6.5 spots higher over the last six years.

Colorado hasn't consistently sucked as badly as Edmonton and had a great season last year. It's not shocking.

Edmonton has been in competition for LAST year in and year out. Worst team with no signs of the ship being righted.

 

[DoubleDouble*]

Another factor here is injuries to other depth players. Mitchell --- for all the **** he has taken in good nature from Avs fans --- is hugely important for the teams depth and has been hurt. Bords, while not a great player, is another depth forward that has missed all the season.

I have to admit I am surprised to hear another team's fanbase say that Johnny Malkin is an important part of their team, but good for him. Always like his attitude on the ice.