OT: Is Canada hosting the World Cup more bitter or sweet to British Columbians?

[stampedingviking]

Soccer will never be popular in Canada. The flopping and acting will never be accepted.

With TSN and Sportsnet losing all rights to broadcast European soccer in Canada, it will only diminish the interest.


MLS is a joke. Its kick and chase soccer. Very limited skill. Its like a retirement home for previous world class athletes like Henry Ibrahimovic Beckham but overall the qiality is soooo bad compared to Euro Soccer

There's now plenty of flopping and acting in hockey, doers that mean hockey shouldn't be popular?

 

[Canucks LB]

There's now plenty of flopping and acting in hockey, doers that mean hockey shouldn't be popular?

What a dumb post my god

 

[coolboarder]

If we are only hosting a preliminary games then it is not worth it. If we are hosting in one of quarters or semi-finals then it might be worth the time and effort to host a WC. I read an article from Sportsnet that Russia is having a trouble filling out stadiums with only 27,000 out of 35,000 in the stadium stadium today. I am more interested in selling out games for this to worth the investment. Since the US is hosting majority of knockout games then it's not worth the hassle by bidding for a WC.

 

[StreetHawk]

If we are only hosting a preliminary games then it is not worth it. If we are hosting in one of quarters or semi-finals then it might be worth the time and effort to host a WC. I read an article from Sportsnet that Russia is having a trouble filling out stadiums with only 27,000 out of 35,000 in the stadium stadium today. I am more interested in selling out games for this to worth the investment. Since the US is hosting majority of knockout games then it's not worth the hassle by bidding for a WC.

35k? My understanding in the FIFA requirements was that group play requir d minimum 40k stadium, 60k for semis and 80k for opening and final games.

 

[me2]

I think there is a massive difference between people that are involved recreationally with soccer and those that actually attend pro soccer matches. They are two different demographics. There really is not a hardcore FIFA following in BC so its not a big deal that we're missing out on 1-3 World Cup games in BC. The BC Govt probably saved $100 million by not hosting and the hardcore fans should have no trouble getting tickets and driving down to Seattle and Portland.

It could be cheaper to fly the entire crowd to Edmonton or Toronto than have a game here. They should just build a new wing at a hospital and call it the FIFA money wing. The benefit to playing the soccer World cup games is next to zero, the tourism benefit is very short lived. The only people that might see benefits would be local soccer organisations trying to get more kids, that's not a net benefit to BC just redistributing existing young players/parents' money from other activities.

 

[Peen]

What a dumb post my god

How so? He isn't wrong.

Both sports are full of acting. One is just overly exaggerated. Both sports have it. Every sport has it. To try and act like one is better than the other is a joke.

 

[Horse McHindu]

I think there is a massive difference between people that are involved recreationally with soccer and those that actually attend pro soccer matches. They are two different demographics. There really is not a hardcore FIFA following in BC so its not a big deal that we're missing out on 1-3 World Cup games in BC. The BC Govt probably saved $100 million by not hosting and the hardcore fans should have no trouble getting tickets and driving down to Seattle and Portland.

I’ll be honest.

I was going to post in here and express my disdain for the fact that Vancouver won’t be hosting, but your post has changed my opinion.

 

[Horse McHindu]

Yawn. Didn't care about it before, don't care now.

Most middle aged ladies in BC don’t.

 

[Horse McHindu]

Old people in this thread arguing about what will never be popular in the future like they know something. News flash, it's already more popular than football for the younger demographic.

Like come on lmao, just because you and your buddies don't enjoy it doesn't mean it's a sport on the rise in this nation.

Same goes for the people who say basketball sucks and will never be popular here because it didn't take off in a short lifespan, when in reality everyone my age watched basketball.

As a 37 year old that grew up on CFL, even I have to admit that MLS soccer has blown by, or is in the process of blowing by, the CFL in Canada.

 

[RandV]

How so? He isn't wrong.

Both sports are full of acting. One is just overly exaggerated. Both sports have it. Every sport has it. To try and act like one is better than the other is a joke.

I'd take issue with the "There's now" part. Hockey isn't really that bad, but the divings been there for a few decades and I doubt it's particularly worse today than it was 10 or 20 years ago.

 

[stampedingviking]

What a dumb post my god

Why?

That's the exact reason the poster gave as to why football (soccer) shouldn't be popular.

 

[End on a Hinote]

If we are only hosting a preliminary games then it is not worth it. If we are hosting in one of quarters or semi-finals then it might be worth the time and effort to host a WC.

Opinion: Vancouver is a world-class city that should be co-hosting the FIFA World Cup

And for Vancouver, the odds of a major role in the 2026 tournament were highly in its favour, short of hosting the semi-finals and final.....

At most, the event would have cost tens of millions, not the billions some have falsely bellyached over and compared with the investments made for the 2010 Olympics.
So what exactly does Vancouver lose out on by not hosting the World Cup?

• Three to five World Cup matches, including potentially a quarterfinal and one of three tournament-opening games. That number may seem small, but this is actually a norm as most stadiums in previous editions of the World Cup host only a handful of matches. Stadiums with a larger capacity are generally able to host more matches as they are large enough to meet the higher capacity requirements for the semi-finals (60,000) and championship opener and final (80,000). The Women’s World Cup format is an exception and cannot be used as a comparison.
• Possibly the FIFA World Cup Draw. This high-profile, pre-tournament event would determine the group in which each of the 48 qualified national teams will play in. It would have likely been held at the Vancouver Convention Centre’s West Building.
• Major pre-tournament test events. BC Place Stadium would host many more soccer matches than just the World Cup matches. This includes a number of qualifying matches for the World Cup and matches for the 2025 FIFA Confederations Cup. There is a possibility FIFA could end the Confederations Cup after 2021, but if that happens there will still be a replacement equivalent such as an expanded version of the FIFA Club World Cup.
• FIFA Fan Festival. A month-long, highly elaborate, free FIFA Fan Festival near BC Place Stadium, similar to the scale and scope of Live City Yaletown during the Olympics.
• Economic benefits. According to the United Bid, each host city can expect between USD$160 million and USD$620 million in incremental economic activity from increased tourism and organizing committee spending.

Apparently Vancouver would have been a hub city and could possibly have hosted more relevant games. Or at least more relevant teams.

Article also said that it's still possible for Vancouver to reconsider, too...

 

[Peen]

Vancouver was getting the most money from FIFA to be a host city. FIFA was going to pay for the costs of the stadium getting grass.

Really wish the NDP would have released numbers on the revenue side.

 

[Chubros]

I am amazed at all the posters expressing support for the NDP's decision. I can only conclude that people are either 1) uninformed, 2) NDP partisans that blindly support all decisions that the government makes, or 3) blinded by their dislike for the sport and/ or FIFA.

Here are the facts:

- BC could have remained in the bid process and opted out by 2021 at little to no cost to taxpayers. Essentially the province had a free option to host games that it decided to throw away for nothing. Options have economic value.

- The estimated economic benefits to the province were around $500 m. Imagine how livid you would be if you owned a bar, restaurant, or hotel downtown. These are the entities that create and maintain jobs for people.

The NDP should have stayed in the game, taken their time, done a careful analysis of the net benefit to the province, and made a rational decision based on what was best for the people of this province. They did not do this despite the cost being nothing.

Instead they made a decision that was based on pure political calculation. They must have thought this would be popular with their supporters. Sadly, based on the bulk of the posts made in this thread, their cynical political calculation seems to have been correct.

But make no mistake. This decision was not made in the best interest of British Columbians.

 

[Melvin]

I am amazed at all the posters expressing support for the NDP's decision. I can only conclude that people are either 1) uninformed, 2) NDP partisans that blindly support all decisions that the government makes, or 3) blinded by their dislike for the sport and/ or FIFA.

Here are the facts:

- BC could have remained in the bid process and opted out by 2021 at little to no cost to taxpayers. Essentially the province had a free option to host games that it decided to throw away for nothing. Options have economic value.

- The estimated economic benefits to the province were around $500 m. Imagine how livid you would be if you owned a bar, restaurant, or hotel downtown. These are the entities that create and maintain jobs for people.

The NDP should have stayed in the game, taken their time, done a careful analysis of the net benefit to the province, and made a rational decision based on what was best for the people of this province. They did not do this despite the cost being nothing.

Instead they made a decision that was based on pure political calculation. They must have thought this would be popular with their supporters. Sadly, based on the bulk of the posts made in this thread, their cynical political calculation seems to have been correct.

But make no mistake. This decision was not made in the best interest of British Columbians.

Can you post some links to these facts please?

I am in [1]

 

[Chubros]

Can you post some links to these facts please?

I am in [1]

- Opt out clause:

I have also heard this from radio commentators, etc. It is supposedly based on a reading of the fine print in the FIFA agreement. I have enough trust in Farhan Lalji that I am not going to read the agreement myself.

- Economic benefits: http://council.vancouver.ca/20180130/documents/rr2.pdf

City of Vancouver report citing a Boston Consulting Group study:

BCG estimates that individual host cities could see between $160 and $620 million in incremental economic activity (which translates to a net benefit of approximately $90 - $480 million per city).

 

[Melvin]

Thank you.

 

[Hollywood Burrows]

those "economic benefits" numbers are a laughable lie, sorry. It's the same garbage economics that NA sports teams use when they're asking for stadium handouts. It's complete fiction, and a certainly a tiresome one in 2018!

 

[Chubros]

those "economic benefits" numbers are a laughable lie, sorry. It's the same garbage economics that NA sports teams use when they're asking for stadium handouts. It's complete fiction, and a certainly a tiresome one in 2018!

BCG is one of the world's top consulting groups and is hired by some of the planet's largest corporations to provide advisory services.

But even if the government was sceptical about the economic benefits, they could have spent a whole three years analyzing them before making a decision.

 

[me2]

How so? He isn't wrong.

Both sports are full of acting. One is just overly exaggerated. Both sports have it. Every sport has it. To try and act like one is better than the other is a joke.

 

[me2]

- Opt out clause:


- Economic benefits: http://council.vancouver.ca/20180130/documents/rr2.pdf

City of Vancouver report citing a Boston Consulting Group study:

Big problem when the entirity of the financial details is "you will make $160m to $480m". These things are usually Voodoo economic BS. Brazil must have made billions from the world cup and Olympics..... You know the economic firm paid to make the bid look good would have found big economic benefits in the proposal.

 

[Chubros]

Big problem when the entirity of the financial details is "you will make $160m to $480m". These things are usually Voodoo economic BS. Brazil must have made billions from the world cup and Olympics..... You know the economic firm paid to make the bid look good would have found big economic benefits in the proposal.

I don't think anyone can make a fair judgement of the conclusions without having read the report. As far as I know, it has not been made available publicly. The Canada Soccer website has something approaching a synopsis of it: United Bid Committee: Hosting the 2026 FIFA World Cup™ could create more than $5 billion in economic activity for North America | Canada Soccer

The variation between the figures is explained as follows:

The variation in impact among the candidate host cities in Canada, Mexico, and the United States is the result of differences in the number of matches hosted, venue capacity, current levels of tourism, cost of living, city population, and geographic size. In its analysis, BCG built projections for seven distinct clusters of candidate cities, drawing on benchmarks, expert interviews, third-party research, and its own experience working with other sports organizations.

Scepticism about the numbers is not a bad thing at all. But again, why not take all the time available before making the decision?

 

[Melvin]

those "economic benefits" numbers are a laughable lie, sorry. It's the same garbage economics that NA sports teams use when they're asking for stadium handouts. It's complete fiction, and a certainly a tiresome one in 2018!

Because ... ?

 

[ayoshi]

I'm a huge footy fan but I don't really care that Vancouver will not be hosting any games. I'll go to wherever Canada are playing anyway.

 

[bobbyb2009]

I think there is a massive difference between people that are involved recreationally with soccer and those that actually attend pro soccer matches. They are two different demographics. There really is not a hardcore FIFA following in BC so its not a big deal that we're missing out on 1-3 World Cup games in BC. The BC Govt probably saved $100 million by not hosting and the hardcore fans should have no trouble getting tickets and driving down to Seattle and Portland.

Love to know where you are getting your stats from. Here are a few for you to consider (so that you can understand you are simply wrong).

Average Attendance
2017

Vancouver Whitecaps FC

21,416

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

2017/18
Vancouver Canucks 18079

2015 FIFA WOMEN'S World Cup
52 Matches in Canada 26, 029
Canada Match in BC 54,027

So, to be clear, Canucks not selling out, Whitecaps averaging more people to games than Canucks, FIFA WOMENS's games outdrawing Canucks, and Canada Women outdrawing Canucks by 3 X. Thats right, 3X. And this is the women...

There would be massive interest in games in BC.

I agree though, there is a difference of people who are involved recreationally in soccer vs those that attend games (at least in terms of converting youth players into stadium goers). The biggest difference, however, is there are less people involved in the largest participation sport in BC than there is who watch games and have interest in FIFA World Cup! And there is no doubt about that! The single biggest issue for the Whitecaps and every other pro franchise that ever tried it in this market is getting kids and recreational soccer players to support Canadian "pro level" football. This challenge does not exist for one of competitions like the World Cup. Those watchers and world football interested have intense interest in World Cups.