Potential CBA negotiation issues (was: Is a lockout actually inevitable?)

[895]

Seems like everyone thinks it is. I'm not sure why things can't be worked out.

What are the main issues this time around?

On the owners side, they want shorter max term contracts and less signing bonuses.

Players want what, Olympics?

Are these really insurmountable challenges for them to hash out?

Obviously I'm not a player or an owner but it seems like there can be reasonable concessions on both sides here.

Max contract length becomes 5, 6 for extensions. Signing bonuses can only 50% of the salary.

In return players get their Olympics. Maybe reduce the age of UFA by another year. Or make offer sheet draft pick compensation lower so RFA status is more valuable. Make players be arbitration eligible right after their ELCs.

Click to read more...

 

[CBJWerenski8]

Those are some major major concessions for the players.

 

[dukeofjive]

With how bad certain gms are with giving out contracts, it is only inevitable that the league will have to save the owners asses again.

 

[895]

Those are some major major concessions for the players.

Are they though? They mostly affect star players. Most guys aren't able to command 8 year contracts and all signing bonus contracts.

Meanwhile more offer sheets and earlier UFA benefits everyone. You don't think the 2nd, 3rd and 4th liners will carry the vote?

 

[Tom ServoMST3K]

I've been saying a lockout is inevitable for years. I still believe it.

Don Fehr and Gary Bettman cannot negotiate without labour stoppages

 

[LadyStanley]

Players want lower escrow. And Olympics.

Owners want to increase franchise values, pay less, get more income.

Where do you get that owners want shorter contracts, lower max? And lower signing bonuses?
(Still looking at 50% of HRR toward players?)

 

[rojac]

Players want lower escrow. And Olympics.

Owners want to increase franchise values, pay less, get more income.

Where do you get that owners want shorter contracts, lower max? And lower signing bonuses?
(Still looking at 50% of HRR toward players?)

Given that the owners wanted 5 and 6 year maximums for contracts before settling for 7 and 8, I wouldn't be surprised if lower maximums were something they tried to get.

 

[No Fun Shogun]

Yes, it's inevitable. The owners have yet to be hurt by any of the recent lockouts, as they've always resulted in them getting bigger pieces of the pie and any lost income from the half season/full season off is more than made up for by that over the course of the next CBA (or good from the get go for teams that have time off from being in the red). Fans keep coming back and players keep essentially going with the flow eventually given their fairly short potential career earnings periods, so owners will keep winning with the lockout method.

 

[kgboomer]

Personally, I don't think the owners will take their option to end the present CBA on Sep 2019, but the players will open that can of worms. Once it's opened, a lockout will be inevitable.

 

[LeHab]

Players want what, Olympics?

Owners offered Olympics this year in exchange of CBA extension. Players said NO. Players are hoping for a lot more concessions while owners seem ok with status quo. Of course like any negotiation owners will come asking for much more.

 

[jj cale]

One more lockout and I will have to seriously consider not watching anymore for a few years in protest, this is becoming ridiculous now.

 

[gstommylee]

One more lockout and I will have to seriously consider not watching anymore for a few years in protest, this is becoming ridiculous now.

This is how Fehr works. He waits till 11th hour to start negotiation to the point it basically guarantees a lockout.

 

[jj cale]

This is how Fehr works. He waits till 11th hour to start negotiation to the point it basically guarantees a lockout.

Yep, and I don't think I can deal with it anymore, it is basically a lockout every collective bargaining time now.

I don't see how the N.H.L is a strong enough league to keep doing this over and over, at some point the fans are gonna turn, I know I am.

 

[mouser]

Personally, I don't think the owners will take their option to end the present CBA on Sep 2019, but the players will open that can of worms. Once it's opened, a lockout will be inevitable.

Agreed. The fact that the owners were willing to extent the current CBA in exchange for Olympic participation suggests to me that they’re reasonably comfortable with the status quo.

Will the players exercise the 2019 option? All the media noise we’ve heard suggests they will, mostly due to unhappiness with escrow. I’m skeptical that the players/union will end up with a “better” deal if they do opt out. The past two CBA’s have tilted towards the owners.

 

[StreetHawk]

Agreed. The fact that the owners were willing to extent the current CBA in exchange for Olympic participation suggests to me that they’re reasonably comfortable with the status quo.

Will the players exercise the 2019 option? All the media noise we’ve heard suggests they will, mostly due to unhappiness with escrow. I’m skeptical that the players/union will end up with a “better” deal if they do opt out. The past two CBA’s have tilted towards the owners.

At this point, what is really left to argue about. Once the owners got cost certainty, main issue is to determine what constitutes HRR. After that, it's just semantics of how to divide the pie amongst the players and their rights within the CBA.

Players have set up their contracts to have that year as a low salary year with a lot of signing bonus. Think we're up to $250 million in signing bonus for July 1, 2020. So, the players are prepared if they elect to exercise the opt out next September.

 

[ricky0034]

i'm surprised Fehr is still around

I just kind of assumed he was replaced at some point over the past half decade with how his first year went

 

[NeverBeNormal]

I still wonder why the PA didn't even vote on the 2 year CBA extension for Olympic participation offer from the NHL. A lot of influential members wanted it, and well, lately when the CBA expires the PA gets, ya know, pretty much destroyed.

 

[Butch 19]

Those are some major major concessions for the players.

How about the CBA just keeps guaranteed contracts? That's 10x the "concessions" in the OP.

Is that a major enough concession to the NHLPA? Not enough to just keep making money??

Based on the signings of the last few weeks, it seems the players are getting paid. What's the problem - seriously!? Why not just extend the existing CBA? (maybe with some minor tweaks)

 

[Melrose Munch]

Always.

How about the CBA just keeps guaranteed contracts? That's 10x the "concessions" in the OP.

Is that a major enough concession to the NHLPA? Not enough to just keep making money??

Based on the signings of the last few weeks, it seems the players are getting paid. What's the problem - seriously!? Why not just extend the existing CBA? (maybe with some minor tweaks)

They're not getting paid as much as the MLB and NBA.

 

[LadyStanley]

Which is more an issue of smaller TV contracts, n'est pa Melrose?

And smaller sponsorships as well, my guess.

 

[Jumptheshark]

Seems like everyone thinks it is. I'm not sure why things can't be worked out.

What are the main issues this time around?

On the owners side, they want shorter max term contracts and less signing bonuses.

Players want what, Olympics?

Are these really insurmountable challenges for them to hash out?

Obviously I'm not a player or an owner but it seems like there can be reasonable concessions on both sides here.

Max contract length becomes 5, 6 for extensions. Signing bonuses can only 50% of the salary.

In return players get their Olympics. Maybe reduce the age of UFA by another year. Or make offer sheet draft pick compensation lower so RFA status is more valuable. Make players be arbitration eligible right after their ELCs.

99% chance there is another lock out

 

[kgboomer]

The owners could give them more $$$ and make them play 162 games like in MLB.

 

[Bookie21]

If Donald Fehr is still in charge of the PA there is a 100% chance of a lockout. His M.O. is to wait until the 11th hour and then make silly demands that he knows the owners won't take kindly too. In return, after pissing of the owners they will go for the jugular and take another pound of flesh from the players like they always do. The BOG vs Fehr is such a mismatch, that always ends in a huge victory for Bettman. Like I said Fehr will lead the sheep to slaughter AGAIN if he's in charge

 

[Morbo]

Is Bettman still in charge? Then yes, 100% chance.

 

[CBJWerenski8]

How about the CBA just keeps guaranteed contracts? That's 10x the "concessions" in the OP.

Is that a major enough concession to the NHLPA? Not enough to just keep making money??

Based on the signings of the last few weeks, it seems the players are getting paid. What's the problem - seriously!? Why not just extend the existing CBA? (maybe with some minor tweaks)

Keeping something you already have isn't a concession. If the owners go after guaranteed contracts, a lost season is assured.